Dear God.

Discussion in 'Ask For Help or Advice' started by yayhowfun, Mar 4, 2014.

  1. yayhowfun

    yayhowfun New Member

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    I'm not even sure where to start, so I guess I'll go with the beginning and try to make it concise.

    I'm a 31 yr old woman - started following the Ray Peat diet with a gym that promotes it locally.

    For 3 months, I've been having coffee with milk and sugar, lots of fruit, beef, lamb, coconut oil, milk, cottage cheese, etc. I cut out all unsaturated fats, raw vegetables, etc. For 3 months, I have been working out consistently (weight training, circuit training, etc). For 3 months, I have watched my weight climb higher and higher, and watched myself get fatter. For 3 months, I have been more and more upset every day.

    I'm 5' 2.5", I weighed 132-133lbs when I started this madness, and today, I was 143.2. I have gained 2 inches in my waist, 1.5 inches in my hips, and another 1.5 inches on my thighs.

    One factor to note is that I'd been taking ADHD medicine for years - extended release ritalin, basically. My trainer told me that this was messing with my stats, so I decided to take the plunge and get off the meds. It's been a month without them and I'm managing.

    My resting heart rate is around 60 and my temp is around 97.7. It goes up a bit when I eat, but then back down. My trainer says my metabolism is in the mud. I say - I've never gained this much weight this fast by working out and "eating healthy." Prior to this, I've tried low carb diets, South Beach, 4 Hour Body, and Isagenix. (I'm sure I'm missing a few.) I always lose weight initially and then plateau. However, with Isagenix shakes, I actually FELT a lot better - I had great energy, better workouts, etc. But, I digress.

    The point is - WHAT is happening here?!

    As a child, I was allergic to milk (not lactose, actually milk) and eggs, and I supposedly "grew out of it," but I'm thinking maybe I didn't...and that drinking all this milk is a part of the problem. I cut out eggs in the last few weeks and notice that when I eat them, I feel lethargic, so I'm cutting them out altogether. Again, I digress.

    HOW, how, HOW can this possibly be good for me when all that's happened with consistently eating Peat-style and working out has caused me to gain inches, pounds, and body fat?!?! I've never felt more sad, upset, and generally unhappy with my body, than I have in the last 3 months. I avoid the mirror, and now, at the brink of bikini season, all I can do is cry and feel that I spent 3 months regressing instead of making progress. I can't possibly fathom how this is good for me.

    Now - before you go judging me for being superficial, I have worked really hard to get to this weight. As a child, I was overweight - at my heaviest, I was 185 when I was about 17 years old and at my lowest, got down to 127. I'm happy around 130. The thing is, before Peat, I felt great - the only thing I wanted was to lean out a bit more. I was told that this diet would "fix my metabolism" and that I was going to be a lean, mean, fat burning, metabolic machine.

    Someone. Help.
     
  2. j.

    j. Guest

    I gained some benefits from the diet alone, but adding pregnenolone, and especially thyroid, brought further benefits. I use ERFA thyroid, 30 mg per day.
     
  3. OP
    yayhowfun

    yayhowfun New Member

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    Is that the same as Progest-E?
     
  4. j.

    j. Guest

    No, one of the differences is that thyroid is much, much more dangerous if one overdoses.
     
  5. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    As much as I loved lifting the weights, I had to give it up to get healthier. And am thankful to myself for doing so. Anything over a relaxing walk is too much for a lot of us due to being so metabolically broken.
     
  6. OP
    yayhowfun

    yayhowfun New Member

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    Well, the gym I train at is all about the Peat stuff, so I imagine they're not purposely screwing me up...but now it makes me wonder. I'll ask.
     
  7. Curt :-)

    Curt :-) Member

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    I'm sorry to hear you're having no luck. I feel for you.
    I think Peaty IS but conducive to physique, but it takes a long time, perhaps even years. Having said that, a lot of Peaty recommendations are incongruous with physique; some cats are drinking 3 litres of milk and 6 of OJ, in addition to ice cream and whatnot. Ridiculous amounts of food if you want to loose body fat.
    You mentioned you were feeling great before doing Peaty. I know I'm going to get flamed for this, but, if I were you, I'd go on paleo for the summer. You can tweak it with some Peaty principles, and paleo is way more conducive to body composition. Why feel like ***t for the summer in the name of health?
    I should mention that I totally think that paleo is NOT healthy. I feel awful on it. Cant sleep, cant get a boner. It sucks. However, if it doesn't give you too much trouble, it might be worth it, at least temporarily as you sound very upset and at your wit's end.
    Good luck with it xx
     
  8. unexamined_whimsy

    unexamined_whimsy Member

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    My initial experience with this approach was similar.

    I did manage to turn it around by, one, consuming only a sane (from a calorific point-of-view) quantity of pro-thyroid foods. Too much full-fat dairy, in the long run, is unsustainable. And so, are the tablespoons helpings of crystalline sugar. Second, by resuming the consumption of vegetables that I had forsaken in the name of Peat. Cruciferous vegetables, for example, may be mildly anti-thyroid but they are certainly extremely anti-estrogenic, and win on that account.

    For women, being hyper- (or fashionably-) lean usually comes at the expense of at least a mild metabolic derangement, when the adrenal activity is heightened producing a slight excess of male hormones giving a chiseled, taut look: think runway models, ballerinas and sportswomen. I do confess that that can be a very attractive disposition, however.
     
  9. OP
    yayhowfun

    yayhowfun New Member

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    Thank you! I'm so glad to hear that I'm not the only one who thinks it's all a bit nuts. I've tried Paleo and didn't have lots of success there, but I think it's because I was having dairy as well. I'm going to go back to Isagenix and hopefully at least get back to where I started within the next few weeks. I can't handle one more day of this.
     
  10. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    You already have your answer.

    Doing something wrong doesn't mean it was done on purpose to screw you up. It could have been done in ignorance.
     
  11. Blossom

    Blossom Moderator

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    I had a lot of advice given to me that was well meaning and ended up causing more harm than good. I put on 18 pounds which was necessary for my healing and currently 5 of that has come off without any calorie restriction or exercise. I think it takes a little time for the body to adjust to the changes. I think you will be better off metabolically by sticking with a Peat inspired approach. If you can just accept yourself no matter what the scale reads it will all come together in time. We think that ultra thin is great because it's promoted in the media and it's a scarce commodity. That's one of the things Matt Stone does that I highly respect-he puts the weight issue into perspective beautifully. I've been skinny and it didn't get me anything more than I already had except more poor health. I hope you will really think about this before you make any major changes. I just hate to see time wasted in the pursuit of appearance. There really is more at stake than how you look in a bikini and way more to life. A couple months into this I thought my husband was going to leave me due to the weight gain but it has turned out that he is happier seeing me vibrant and healthy. I was imposing my fears and insecurities on to him which did us both a disservice. Please choose health, I know you won't regret in the long run.
     
  12. HDD

    HDD Member

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    "Broda Barnes, more than 60 years ago, summed up the major effects of hypothyroidism on health very neatly when he pointed out that if hypothyroid people don't die young from infectious diseases, such as tuberculosis, they die a little later from cancer or heart disease. He did his PhD research at the University of Chicago, just a few years after Otto Warburg, in Germany, had demonstrated the role of a "respiratory defect" in cancer. At the time Barnes was doing his research, hypothyroidism was diagnosed on the basis of a low basal metabolic rate, meaning that only a small amount of oxygen was needed to sustain life. This deficiency of oxygen consumption involved the same enzyme system that Warburg was studying in cancer cells.

    Barnes experimented on rabbits, and found that when their thyroid glands were removed, they developed atherosclerosis, just as hypothyroid people did. By the mid-1930s, it was generally known that hypothyroidism causes the cholesterol level in the blood to increase; hypercholesterolemia was a diagnostic sign of hypothyroidism. Administering a thyroid supplement, blood cholesterol came down to normal exactly as the basal metabolic rate came up to the normal rate. The biology of atherosclerotic heart disease was basically solved before the second world war.

    Many other diseases are now known to be caused by respiratory defects. Inflammation, stress, immunodeficiency, autoimmunity, developmental and degenerative diseases, and aging, all involve significantly abnormal oxidative processes. Just brief oxygen deprivation triggers processes that lead to lipid peroxidation, producing a chain of other oxidative reactions when oxygen is restored. The only effective way to stop lipid peroxidation is to restore normal respiration.

    Now that dozens of diseases are known to involve defective respiration, the idea of thyroid's extremely broad range of actions is becoming easier to accept."

    http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/thyroid.shtml


    I gained maybe 20+ pounds, but now I am dropping the weight. Your health is the most important thing to consider. Your temperature and pulse indicate hypothyroidism. Sometimes this can be corrected with diet and sometimes thyroid is needed.
     
  13. Curt :-)

    Curt :-) Member

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    Totally agree with unexaminded_whimsy.
    Also, assuming you hired your personal trainer to get you leaner, I'd fire their ass. You could weight/circuit train without having to pay through the nose for the privilege. And from a physique standpoint, putting weight-loss clients on Peaty is mighty stupid. My 2 cents
     
  14. thebigpeatowski

    thebigpeatowski Member

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    Unfortunately I am in the same boat: Female, 47 years old, 5 foot 2.5 inches tall and gaining fast. I started peat eating in November 2013 and have put on 25 pounds, this is unsustainable. I am hypothyroid and have been for nearly 25 years, I currently take 2 grains of Armour. I don't exercise at all because it wipes me out.

    Interestingly enough, I was able to go off ALL meds after an 75 pound weight loss on HGC in 2011(down to 130 lbs.) and I maintained that weight loss through a very low carb primal/gaps type diet...until October 2013 which is when I started gaining weight mysteriously. I am now back on thyroid meds and feel like sh*t. This isn't about vanity, I feel like hell, I have NO ENERGY, I am majorly depressed and none of my clothes fit at all.

    I have added carbs back into my diet, drastically reduced fat intake compared to my primal days, cut out ALL PUFA, doubled my thyroid dose and am doing all the recommended supps....still gaining weight on an 1800 a day calorie diet.

    I feel like my ability to oxidize glucose is broken. Can this actually be fixed? ANY advice would be much appreciated.
     
  15. SQu

    SQu Member

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    I too did quite a few hcg rounds, during and after low carb for years, then picked up lots of weight while trying to heal myself. With hindsight I might have limited weight gain if I'd been peating earlier. If I were to do it again I'd look up all weight loss advice on this forum and in peat's articles, especially the information regarding starch and fat. But I was 47 too and had done much damage and had to accept that healing had to come first and with it came weight. For me anyway. I'm not yet on thyroid but sounds like it's not doing anything for you the way you're taking it now - there's loads of threads and email advice which I would comb through . The other thing about feeling like hell is estrogen. It takes time - lots - and patience. But so worth it. Good luck!
     
  16. Blossom

    Blossom Moderator

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    Possibly you would enjoy reading the Marry Shommon interview with Ray Peat if you have not already seen this. It has a lot of practical information.
     
  17. Peata

    Peata Member

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    Found it here: http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/ray-peat.htm
     
  18. Blossom

    Blossom Moderator

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    Even though gaining weight seems difficult to accept there are worse things. People often don't realize that not being able to gain or maintain weight has far worse implications. I've been there and it's not good at all, I'd much rather carry a couple extra pounds and be healthy. The reason many elderly and dying people are so frail and thin is that they are wasting from deranged energy metabolism. When you seemingly have health it's easy to ignore this but if you ever lose your health and start wasting away I guarantee weight gain won't seem so bad after all. I just wanted to give an example of a different context and maybe some thoughts on an appreciation for the ability to gain weight.
     
  19. thebigpeatowski

    thebigpeatowski Member

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    Thank you for your response ladies.... I have read the interview with Mary Shomon several times over the last three months. It is chock full of excellent info. I am truly a textbook case for all that Peat describes in that interview. I added Progest-E this past January and I believe it is making a HUGE DIFFERENCE in my estrogen dominance. I do the red light thing. I definitely know that I am on the right track as I have seen many symptoms get better in the 3 months that I have been doing this.....I just wish the weight would stop piling on, I cannot afford to buy new clothes :(
     
  20. north

    north Member

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    Since sugar-metabolism seems low, for now maybe 2L Milk, 1L OJ per day would cover basic stress defense (Peat said that would be a basic anti stress sugar intake), and be generous with coconut oil. Then try to gradually increase sugar. I noticed its a lot easier to keep track when having a set guideline (mine is 2L Milk, 2L OJ (3L on training day), 40g gelatin, 50g coconut oil, 40g protein from solid food (minimum 200g per day or i get digeistive issues from all liquid). Then i track my weight and adjust intake. Im not too strict and if i feel stressed out at night i prefer going over my plan to correct stress issue.

    Peat:
    "I had put a tablespoonful of coconut oil on some rice I had for supper, and half an hour later while I was reading, I noticed I was breathing more deeply than normal. I saw that my skin was pink, and I found that my pulse was faster than normal -- about 98, I think. After an hour or two, my pulse and breathing returned to normal.

    Every day for a couple of weeks I noticed the same response while I was digesting a small amount of coconut oil, but gradually it didn't happen any more, and I increased my daily consumption of the oil to about an ounce. I kept eating the same foods as before, except that I added about 200 or 250 calories per day as coconut oil.

    Apparently the metabolic surges that happened at first were an indication that my body was compensating for an anti-thyroid substance by producing more thyroid hormone; when the coconut oil relieved the inhibition, I experienced a moment of slight hyperthyroidism, but after a time the inhibitor became less effective, and my body adjusted by producing slightly less thyroid hormone.

    But over the next few months, I saw that my weight was slowly and consistently decreasing. It had been steady at 185 pounds for 25 years, but over a period of six months it dropped to about 175 pounds. I found that eating more coconut oil lowered my weight another few pounds, and eating less caused it to increase."

    Maybe someone with longer Peat-experience could chime in as well...
     
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