David Sinclair On Extending Lifespan

Ableton

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Sorry, I read that wrong, I though you said regeneration CAUSES deterioration. I'd agree that our bodies and the process of regeneration does tend to decline with age, but I don't think it has anything to do with the passage of time. I think, instead, it's the things that have been pointed out again and again on this forum- excess toxins, excess stress (and therefore excess stress hormones like cortisol), low levels of youth associated hormones, and low levels of certain vitamins, minerals, and amino acids like glycine.

You don't need anthropologists to find 170 year olds, seeing as there are claims people living to that age in recent history- Caucasus Peasant Dies at 168; Said to Be World's Oldest Man (Published 1973).

Also, in The Bible, you have claims of many men living hundreds of years, with Methuselah living to an age of 969. Why did they pick such long lifespans? Is it possible that people used to live far longer than we tend to now?
Your article just proved my entire point. „Moderate eating“, „mountain air“.

mountain = cold, low oxygen, probably low carb diets too

Mountain also: low inhabitation

mountain also: extremely disproportianate % of people getting extremely old.

if you would account for population density the numbers would be ridicolous.

„his wife of 107 years old“, yet you have to scan through the whole of usa to find even 2 people that age
 

boris

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I can go a whole day without seeing old people as thin as 90% of the people in this list. Lol

You said literally every extremely old person is very thin low BMI and basically "1 step above starvation". Clearly 90% ( ;) ) wrong as proven by photographic evidence.
 

Ableton

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You said litereally every extremely old person is very thin low BMI and basically "1 step above starvation". Clearly 100% wrong as seen by photographic evidence.
Ok, you are right in that my statement was too definite. I’ll leave it to the readers of this thread if it did more harm than good though, especially in comparison to the forum culture here :)
 

cjm

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The process of regeneration deteriorates as well

Wait, are you seriously doubting that our ability to regenerate our bodies declines with age? I never defined regeneration as deterioration lmao. I said our ability to regenerate declines with age
According to this forums logic anthropologists should be finding 170 year old people living in hunter gatherer tribes in oceanica or rain forests. Hint: they dont.

You should clarify. Are you saying that often the repair job doesn't finish or leaves scars (which I would subscribe to) , or that there is stress/destruction inherent in the regeneration process? The former is prescriptive of higher metabolism to complete the job.

EDIT: You answered this already. It sounds like we're on the same page.

Here's a timely Haidut post that speaks against the "wear and tear" theory:

Low, not high, metabolism creates oxidative stress

From the study: "Some electrons are directly transferred to O2 to generate reactive oxygen species (ROS) in the ETC. The second part of this review discusses the sites of ROS generation in each ETC complex, including sites IF and IQ in complex I, site IIF in complex II and site IIIQo in complex III, and the physiological and pathological regulation of ROS. As signaling molecules, ROS play an important role in cell proliferation, hypoxia adaptation and cell fate determination, but excessive ROS can cause irreversible cell damage and even cell death. The occurrence and development of a number of diseases are closely related to ROS overproduction"

Haidut's comments: "it is low oxidative metabolism (OXPHOS), not high, that causes ROS generation. In other words, it is low OXPHOS that causes aging, not high."
The slower an animal moves relative to its own weight, the longer it sleeps relative to its time alive, the longer it lives in comparison to animals with otherwise similar physiology who differ in these points. Low metabolic rate = longevity.
Greenland sharks
Turtles
Kois
Sea urchins
Elephants
Whales

These are interesting correlations worth expanding upon. But the ROS angle is elegant because it explains a lot with a single vector.

anthropologists should be finding 170 year old people living in hunter gatherer tribes in oceanica or rain forests.

Without nitpicking or sowing doubt on this point, can both positions be right, that low stress leads to longevity but also low ROS/high metabolism does as well?
 
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tankasnowgod

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be honest: your task is to find the oldest person in the world. Do you search near the equator/ in a rainforest or near the poles/in the mountains?

And what does that tell us about metabolic rate, oxygen, and longevity?

I don't know what this has to do with anything I posted, but I would look near the equator and in high elevations. The reason being is that I'm looking for people with high metabolic rates and people with high CO2 retention. An elevation of about 4,000-6,000 near the equator would probably be about ideal, as far as living conditions I know of. I absolutely would not search near the poles. You obviously think a lot differently, so when you say "us," clearly, in this case, it would not be a group that involves both you and me.
 

Ableton

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Anabolisms ultimate consequence is cancer (formerly known as dying of old age)
We also know that fats cause heart disease.

if you don’t eat, you are basically immune to like what, 90% of natural death causes? (cancer, cardiovascular)

the fact we have to eat is quite simply one of the main reasons we have to die, alongside with having to breath in oxygen and forces like gravity
 

Ableton

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I don't know what this has to do with anything I posted, but I would look near the equator and in high elevations. The reason being is that I'm looking for people with high metabolic rates and people with high CO2 retention. An elevation of about 4,000-6,000 near the equator would probably be about ideal, as far as living conditions I know of. I absolutely would not search near the poles. You obviously think a lot differently, so when you say "us," clearly, in this case, it would not be a group that involves both you and me.
Caucasus is not exactly known for being warm is it?
Mountain regions are also not known for high caloric diets, especially not for high carb diets for that matter
 

MitchMitchell

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High carb or high fat doesn’t matter, people go for high fats in those tough climates because of the attractive 9 kcal/g and more conveniently stored.
Living in a cold environment revs up metabolism to produce heat, which increases TDEE, which increases the likelihood of being on a caloric deficit year round, or a low maintenance at best. You could achieve the same caloric intake using sugars for energy. As long as you keep protein constant and on the low side, you’re fine.

It’s interesting that protein consumption isn’t high because of pure logistics - no supermarkets, no abundance of meat based stuff. Lots of cream, bread, cheese, potatoes, stuff like that. Besides, eating the above AND supplementing collagen aren’t self excluding
 

R J

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Living ages you. Mostly the food.

Living on low flame ages you more slowly.

Most people here will disagree with this though.

Rate of living hypothesis is completely wrong , my intuition tells me so.
 

R J

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I respect Peat obviously. He is a good example that his own diet is ideal for energy output (his great work) but not for aging more slowly (he at best looks slightly younger than his age despite top 0,0001%il diet and lifestyle optimization.
People will bring up roddy now, who does look younger than his age, but he gives low energy vibes to me.
Obviously genes play a role here too no doubt.

Have you seen Danny roddys diet? It’s extrmely autistic and boring. Beef and Parmesan and coffee. Liver and Parmesan and coffee. Egg and Parmesan and coffee. Wa la!
 

Ableton

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High carb or high fat doesn’t matter, people go for high fats in those tough climates because of the attractive 9 kcal/g and more conveniently stored.
Living in a cold environment revs up metabolism to produce heat, which increases TDEE, which increases the likelihood of being on a caloric deficit year round, or a low maintenance at best. You could achieve the same caloric intake using sugars for energy. As long as you keep protein constant and on the low side, you’re fine.

It’s interesting that protein consumption isn’t high because of pure logistics - no supermarkets, no abundance of meat based stuff. Lots of cream, bread, cheese, potatoes, stuff like that. Besides, eating the above AND supplementing collagen aren’t self excluding
Yeah I think I would agree with high metabolism despite caloric deficit being a sign of great health actually.
My theory on hypothyroidism that differs from this forum goes in that direction. I think hypothyroidism is a response, not a disease, to an elevated cancer risk due to environment. Thats why people on high cal diets can stay hypothyroid despite it, and others are not hypo despite eating a third of that. Anabolism + cancer risk = cancer. Anabolism + no cancer risk = ideal. Catabolism + cancer risk = no cancer.
If you have elevated cancer risk your body wants you to be hypothyroid, because otherwise you die. Survival is first, high metabolic rate second.
 

R J

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Sinclair

yes according to peat we should all be superhumans here but I will tell you something: everything in life has advantages and disadvantages. Thats the main reason there are so many health approaches. If there was one way to live, it would have been figured out in the internet age the latest.

i would not be here if I thought peating had more disadvantages. I suspect peating is the best way to age while on a diet optimized for high functioning even

you are bluepilled on the Sinclair question . Physiognomy of Sinclair tells a lot
 

boris

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Why does peat not look significantly younger than his age?

He had to battle lots of stresses. He could never pursue what he initally wanted to do. Getting bullied by intelligence agencies (his school destroyed, hindered from teaching in other countries), getting bullied by corporations (kept from giving talks about nutrition), etc.. His health and looks are impressive considering what he went through. Most people would have long crumbled under this kind of stress.

Apart from that he clearly looks better than he would have following his old diet. Only recently did his skin reach a level of sagginess close to what he had in his 40s before the pregnenolone testing:
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(and he halted his hairloss)
 

Ableton

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you are bluepilled on the Sinclair question . Physiognomy of Sinclair tells a lot
Much like roddy, he looks extremely young for his age, but he looks like ***t. Not masculine enough. But my evaluation of that could be influenced by hollywood etc., so it doesn’t matter
 

MitchMitchell

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Have you seen Danny roddys diet? It’s extrmely autistic and boring. Beef and Parmesan and coffee. Liver and Parmesan and coffee. Egg and Parmesan and coffee. Wa la!

roddy is on the carnivore bandwagon now??

what the heck. Didn’t he quit it years ago already
 

Ableton

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roddy is on the carnivore bandwagon now??

what the heck. Didn’t he quit it years ago already
If thats really his diet (a peaty version of low carb although such a thing doesnt exist) it explains his looks and low energy vibe
 
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metabolizm

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Danny Roddy’s diet is designed to resemble Ray Peat’s as closely as possible.
 

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