jyb

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I've done a few experiments over the months. A few mg's during the day, and something a bit higher at night (16mg) is good. I tried doses like 80mg at night, and my next day temperatures/function were bad. Maybe a too high dose is a burden on the liver, I don't know.
 

dukez07

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jyb said:
(both cypro and mirta have similar side effects: drowsy at higher dose, can be used for insomnia, typically safe & without permanent side effects unlike SSRIs).

Mirtazapine is actually more stimulating at higher dosages. It's such a potently strong antihistamine, that taking it in higher doses actually causes very little further sedation. When you start taking it at 30-45mg, the way it interacts with the adrenergic pathways become far more pronounced. Plus, after a while, the histmainergic receptors desensitize, which again, probably helps with the 'Ive just been hit by a ******* train, so now I'm going to sleep for 16hrs a day, side effect', lol.
 

Ben

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Makes sense, they prescribe adrenalin shots for allergic reaction emergencies because adrenalin acts in the opposite way of histamine. Antihistamines and anticholinergics cause some symptoms resembling activation of the sympathetic nervous system, like dilated pupils, dry mouth, and erectile dysfunction. People with low histamine have high blood sugar, are usually overstimulated in the adrenergic way, have dry mouth, visible anxiety, low libido, sleep a lot, and aren't very motivated, and people with high histamine have anxiety invisible to people (like worry), overstimulated in the histaminergic way, have low blood sugar due to glycolysis, have lots of saliva and libido, sleep little, and have lots of motivation and achievement.

I wonder if an anti-histamine would be more effective if paired up with a beta-blocker. That would offset any side effects like dry mouth from stimulating the adrenergic system.
 

jyb

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dukez07 said:
Mirtazapine is actually more stimulating at higher dosages. It's such a potently strong antihistamine, that taking it in higher doses actually causes very little further sedation. When you start taking it at 30-45mg, the way it interacts with the adrenergic pathways become far more pronounced. Plus, after a while, the histmainergic receptors desensitize, which again, probably helps with the 'Ive just been hit by a f***ing train, so now I'm going to sleep for 16hrs a day, side effect', lol.

I've taken Mirtazapine for a long time in the past. I think it was 30mg for a while. It was very nasty, the drowsyness is extreme much worse than cyproheptadine at any dose (and I tried cypro from 2mg up to 80mg). 15mg was a bit better, but I still wouldn't want to ever touch it again. I certainly didn't agree with the fact that mirtazapine is less drowsy at higher doses. Extreme drowsyness is a pretty common side effect of mirta, according to the doctors I was seeing.

I think cypro is easier not just because it has a much shorter half life than mirta. Mirta seemed to just put me to sleep like I were hit by a train, whereas cypro, after the first few days, is much more subtle and allow me to function almost fine even if I took a high dose.
 

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You have to wait?
 
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piotr_zarach said:
Hi :) how long i should wait after tianeptine (3x12,5 for 4 months) before I could take cypro ?


As far as I know you don't have to wait, but just keep in mind that after stopping tianeptine there may be a "withdrawal" period with symptoms of nervousness and shaking, and cypro may make that a bit worse since anti-histamines may potentiate the adrenalin response after stopping tianeptine.
 

piotr_zarach

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Thank you Haidut ! (sorry for my english)

Quit with it because it gives me bad sides like after amfetamine fellings and heart problems (paliptations and breathing problem). At the another side, try to quit with it do same problems !
For the last two weeks i have adrenaline rush mostly in night. I'm tappering tianetpine from 4/3 to 2 now and when i take it a fell good for 2 hours.For the last two weeks i have adrenaline rush mostly in night. After this time i have somthing like panic attack, with heart palpitations and short breathing. Its scars me alot ! What could i do with it, when it happend i think im die ... :| Please help.

Should i take valium ? Im have this stuff now- Hydroxyzine http://www.drugs.com/ingredient/hydroxyzine.html take it or not ?

Peating for 2 months. Still increase amount of Peat things in my diet. 25 years old male. very skinny but with strong muscles.
 
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piotr_zarach said:
Thank you Haidut ! (sorry for my english)

Quit with it because it gives me bad sides like after amfetamine fellings and heart problems (paliptations and breathing problem). At the another side, try to quit with it do same problems !
For the last two weeks i have adrenaline rush mostly in night. I'm tappering tianetpine from 4/3 to 2 now and when i take it a fell good for 2 hours.For the last two weeks i have adrenaline rush mostly in night. After this time i have somthing like panic attack, with heart palpitations and short breathing. Its scars me alot ! What could i do with it, when it happend i think im die ... :| Please help.

Should i take valium ? Im have this stuff now- Hydroxyzine http://www.drugs.com/ingredient/hydroxyzine.html take it or not ?

Peating for 2 months. Still increase amount of Peat things in my diet. 25 years old male. very skinny but with strong muscles.

No need to take Valium, niacinamide (vitamin B3) works the same way. Take 1500mg before going to bed and you should be able to fall asleep without getting adrenalin rush. You can take 500mg-1000mg during the day as well whenever you feel like you have an adrenalin rush. The rush should stop in about a week. At least that's how long it took other people that were taking tianeptine.
 

piotr_zarach

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In my country i could get only niacinamide in combo with other B-wit. But at last night i try small dose of hydroxizinum. Something like 5 mg and it helps. So i think my problem with adrenaline rush it could be histamine rush from diary and non ripe fruits... I have milk intolerance and when i drink more milk even after meal and with alot of sugar there is big gut problem, short breath, and pain in chest. So maybe this is the way to withdraw with tianeptine and start to take cypro... ?

BTW; I get my tianeptine for prescription and it cost me only 2,5 dollars for 30 x12,5 mg tabs.
 
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haidut

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piotr_zarach said:
In my country i could get only niacinamide in combo with other B-wit. But at last night i try small dose of hydroxizinum. Something like 5 mg and it helps. So i think my problem with adrenaline rush it could be histamine rush from diary and non ripe fruits... I have milk intolerance and when i drink more milk even after meal and with alot of sugar there is big gut problem, short breath, and pain in chest. So maybe this is the way to withdraw with tianeptine and start to take cypro... ?

BTW; I get my tianeptine for prescription and it cost me only 2,5 dollars for 30 x12,5 mg tabs.

If it works for you then by all means do it. I was suggesting niacinamide b/c it is over the counter. Also, salt should lower adrenalin as well.
 

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i was wondering. Why does cypro increase appetite? is it because it lowers serotonin wich again increases metabolism?
 
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superhuman said:
i was wondering. Why does cypro increase appetite? is it because it lowers serotonin wich again increases metabolism?

I think the mainstream explanation is that since cyproheptadine is an antagonist of the 5-HT2C and 5-HT2A "receptors" that causes an increase in appetite. So, it sounds plausible that lowering serotonin would boost metabolism and push the organism to eat more to compensate for the higher energetic demands.
 

superhuman

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haidut: great
How long should one do cypro and how high should one aim to go in dosages before one has lowered serotonin enough? i started with 1mg but now i take 2mg and i dont get drowsi or anything from it anymore
 

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I take 4mg a day. Split 4 times so 1mg each dose. I did work up slowly to that, though.
 
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superhuman said:
haidut: great
How long should one do cypro and how high should one aim to go in dosages before one has lowered serotonin enough? i started with 1mg but now i take 2mg and i dont get drowsi or anything from it anymore

Ray recommends doses of 0.5mg-4mg a day and says it should not be taken for more than several days b/c serotonin drugs tend to eventually cause side effects. While I agree with him that taking a drug for too long is not a good idea, in my experience most people have to take cypro for 1-2 weeks before they get any lasting effect. Once the serotonin is under control, then slowly taper off and focus on diet.
I think Ray's comments about the side effects are based on studies with other anti-serotonin drugs causing some heart issues (e.g. ondansetron) but in the case of cyproheptadine the side effects are extremely rare and tend to be mild. Certainly no heart issues from cypro, and most people may get some nervousness due to the anticholinergic properties or briefly elevated liver enzymes.
 

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