Controlling Dopamine...Andrew Huberman (Dopamine rises and falls)

[dhtsupreme]

Great podcast discussing how dopamine works in the brain, the pathways of the brain that enable dopaminergic transmission, what stimulates its release, and tools to optomize dopamine to prevent addiction and promote motivation and enjoyment in ones life.

What I did not know prior to this was that dopamine rises and falls below baseline after an event that stimulates dopamine. For example, if I ate a piece of chocolate I can experience a 1.5 fold increase in dopamine (varies from person to person). Sounds great except that after a period of time dopamine will actually fall below baseline for a period of time. Meaning I will be experiencing symptoms of low dopamine after experiencing this higher level.

According to him and the research he discussed, tyrosine and mucuna pruriens are part of the factors/substances that produce a temporary high and then a drop below baseline whereas caffeine and maca are indirect (producing a small rise without a dramatic drop). The study he referred to concluded tyrosine caused a sharp rise in dopamine that lasted for a half hour and began to fall. It was not tested long enough to determine if it would drop below baseline however Dr. Huberman said with everything studied on dopamine, it would be the case that it would fall below baseline due to "depletion of the readily reservible pool of dopamine vesicles". Wouldn't tyrosine fill those reserves since it increases dopamine production directly? @haidut @Hans

My question/concern is how to use substances to not have such a negative effect. I know for many lisuride has temporary effects and this may be why since it's an agonist of many dopamine receptors. It could be creating this dramatic increase for a short time then a sharp drop. For many trying to raise dopamine or believe/know they have high prolactin, this could be confusing.

Is there a way to dose lisuride/tyrosine/mucuna pruriens to not have such a dramatic rise and fall? Perhaps using much smaller doses than 500mg for tyrosine like 100mg? Maybe diluting lisuride to provide a minor increase in dopamine?

Can other indirect compounds that raise dopamine receptors like caffeine be more beneficial in the long run? (Uridine/cdp choline- D2 receptor or large doses of thiamine to upregulate D1 receptor) @Hans @haidut


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmOF0crdyRU&t=7305s

 

[tankasnowgod]

According to him and the research he discussed, tyrosine and mucuna pruriens are part of the factors/substances that produce a temporary high and then a drop below baseline whereas caffeine and maca are indirect (producing a small rise without a dramatic drop). The study he referred to concluded tyrosine caused a sharp rise in dopamine that lasted for a half hour and began to fall. It was not tested long enough to determine if it would drop below baseline however Dr. Huberman said with everything studied on dopamine, it would be the case that it would fall below baseline due to "depletion of the readily reservible pool of dopamine vesicles". Wouldn't tyrosine fill those reserves since it increases dopamine production directly? @haidut @Hans

I don't see any reason Tyrosine would lead to a drop below baseline, nor do I notice such "subjective" effects with my own use.

I have recently switched to using supplemental Tyrosine, usually with BCAAs to deplete serotonin, and also as a substitute for Phenylalanine in the modified MAP protocol. I do certainly noticed improved mood 30 or so minutes after ingestion, as while it tapers off a bit, I am feeling better overall than before I started, pretty much all day long.

It could very well depend, as well, on Dopamine reserves, but I would think that a lot of people might be low right now, due to stressful situations (like, say, an obviously fake pandemic that certain nefarious people and forces are trying to use as the final push into the endgame of the World Revolutionary Movement/New World Order, aka, World Communism).

 

[dhtsupreme]

I don't see any reason Tyrosine would lead to a drop below baseline, nor do I notice such "subjective" effects with my own use.

I have recently switched to using supplemental Tyrosine, usually with BCAAs to deplete serotonin, and also as a substitute for Phenylalanine in the modified MAP protocol. I do certainly noticed improved mood 30 or so minutes after ingestion, as while it tapers off a bit, I am feeling better overall than before I started, pretty much all day long.

It could very well depend, as well, on Dopamine reserves, but I would think that a lot of people might be low right now, due to stressful situations (like, say, an obviously fake pandemic that certain nefarious people and forces are trying to use as the final push into the endgame of the World Revolutionary Movement/New World Order, aka, World Communism).

I feel the same way. I've noticed benefits from bcaa tyrosine protocal too. Aside from a temporary rise in dopamine, perhaps the sustained benefits are more related to thryoid since tyrosine is needed for t3 production and lowered serotonin (minimal absorption of tryptophan so maybe change in dopamine:serotonin ratio too)

I'm confused as to why Tyrosine conversion to l dopa then dopamine wouldn't refill those vesicles he refers to. Once dopamine is created wouldn't it be packaged into those vesicles for neurotransmission? I wonder if phenylalanine is a more stable approach

I'm considering starting a lower dose pheylalanine/tyrosine protocal to see if I can get more sustained benefit from dopamine. If there are sharp rises and falls from the typical doses of tyrosine/phenylalanine, maybe the peaks can be more stable (smaller rises and falls) if smaller doses that resemble food intake are used and spread out during the day. Maybe can prevent any downregulation if used this way. This is all speculation of course and I would appreciate any opinions/personal experience from anyone.

The pandemic definitely changed us for the worst. All that isolation probably plummeted dopamine and raised cortisol/serotonin for many. I fear it will only get much worse in the winter time. I hope to be wrong