Concerning Blood Work - What Am I Doing Wrong

[stsfut]

Began 'peating' in December.

AST - 48 (0-40) (was in 20's in November)
ALT - 66 (00-44) (was in 20's November)
Trigs - 334 (0-149) was in lower 100's in November)
Iron, Serum - 211 (38-169)
Iron, Saturation - 62 (15-55)
Transferrin Saturation, Calculated - 62 (<50)
CRP - .42 (0-3) (phew)
Ferritin - 119 (30-400)

It looks like iron overload but ferritin is good. Liver enzymes are up. Trigs are outrageously high but other lipids look fine (LDL at 108, HDL low at 40 however). I feel like I am following Peat's and this forums strategies pretty good and yet seeing weird results like these. Not posting this to bash on Peat because I think the guy is a genius but just confused in where I have gone wrong. I am feeling pretty good for the most part. Below I will list medications, supplements, diet and lifestyle. Age 26 Male.

Meds/supplements:
-on TRT (testosterone came back at a modest ~700)
-NDT, 3 grains, spread throughout day. I need to cut back and plan on doing so immediately. My TSH is completely suppressed but more importantly my FT3 is way over the range at 5.3 and RT3 is high at 19.
-vitamin A 10,000iu, every other day
-vitamin D 5,000iu, every day
-Thiamine 300mg, every day
-B-complex 100, every day
-Magnesium complex every night

Diet:
-oatmeal every morning with fruit, milk, coconut oil and chocolate (semi-sweet)
-I eat a good amount of beef every day it seems (try to pair it with gelatin when I can)
-I eat a couple eggs pretty much every day
-I eat at chipotle a good bit (try to go low pufa as possible)
-other random, low pufa meals made at home
-Peat approved fruit though I do still eat bananas
-Lots of 1% milk and lots of coffee
-A good amount of orange juice and coke, though I try to drink that with meals
-Hagen Daz (however you spell that) ice cream 5 nights a week on average

Lifestyle:
-I drink maybe one night a week, usually beer in large amounts. Not the best thing for health but gotta live.
-Pushups and other body weight training every day
-Cardio - either basketball, tennis or soccer - 3/4 days a week
-Married, try to have sex every night but erections have been poor lately despite being on a good TRT protocol in numbers

 

[churchmouth]

Nice write up. Weight? Stress? Sun exposure?

 

[stsfut]

Thanks, I weigh 200 pounds now at 6 foot. Gained about 10 pounds in last couple months. Stress - no more than usual I feel. Should be less since I’m no longer following a crazy low-carb diet. I get a decent amount of sun everyday. Get it whenever I am able to.

 

[mmb82]

I don't know if you have heard of Dr. Garrett Smith, but he has a lot of information on iron overload. Like Peat, he is not a fan of too much iron. Unlike Peat, however, Dr. Smith is not a fan of calcium. Dr. Smith's primary view of disease seems to be the "limescale and rust" theory in which he believes that excess calcium and iron accumulate in the body and cause a majority of health issues. He says, "trying to use the calcium in dairy to counteract iron absorption is not a good long-term strategy. Iron and calcium cause problems together in the body, so two wrongs don’t make a right".

Some dietary recommendations Dr. Smith has for dealing with iron overload include ingesting coffee (similar to Peat's use of coffee), black and green tea, red onions, cocoa, cinnamon, turmeric, high vitamin C foods, high vitamin E foods, and foods with Oligomeric Proanthocyanadins (OPCs). He also suggests avoiding vitamin D supplements and vitamin D fortified foods (most diary), large amounts of heme iron, and any iron-enriched foods like flour and rice. He isn't pro-vegan, but does recommend that a large portion of the diet come from plant foods like fruits, vegetables, and beans. For people that need a lot of protein (athletes or large individuals) or those who simply don't feel well not eating meat, he says that 4-6 oz of meat once a day is OK, but to limit red meat to about 1 lb a week. Eggs don't count as "meat" and he actually suggests eating 3 or more daily if you can tolerate them.

Based on your blood tests, he would definitely say you have iron overload. You can try donating blood 2-3 times a year to assist in removing excess iron, but make sure to replenish other minerals you lose in the process. Also, do not donate “double reds”, plasma, or platelets. Finally, the best strategy is probably avoiding heme iron, not forever, but until iron levels come down. If you don't want to eat beans for some protein to remain "Peaty", eggs, egg whites, and gelatin could help bring your protein intake up if you decide to remove some or all of the meat from your diet. I personally don't find it that easy to keep protein intake at my desired levels with mainly plant foods even with egg whites and gelatin, but it can be something to try for a little while until you get follow-up blood tests to see what effect it has.

 

[Jsaute21]

Began 'peating' in December.

AST - 48 (0-40) (was in 20's in November)
ALT - 66 (00-44) (was in 20's November)
Trigs - 334 (0-149) was in lower 100's in November)
Iron, Serum - 211 (38-169)
Iron, Saturation - 62 (15-55)
Transferrin Saturation, Calculated - 62 (<50)
CRP - .42 (0-3) (phew)
Ferritin - 119 (30-400)

It looks like iron overload but ferritin is good. Liver enzymes are up. Trigs are outrageously high but other lipids look fine (LDL at 108, HDL low at 40 however). I feel like I am following Peat's and this forums strategies pretty good and yet seeing weird results like these. Not posting this to bash on Peat because I think the guy is a genius but just confused in where I have gone wrong. I am feeling pretty good for the most part. Below I will list medications, supplements, diet and lifestyle. Age 26 Male.

Meds/supplements:
-on TRT (testosterone came back at a modest ~700)
-NDT, 3 grains, spread throughout day. I need to cut back and plan on doing so immediately. My TSH is completely suppressed but more importantly my FT3 is way over the range at 5.3 and RT3 is high at 19.
-vitamin A 10,000iu, every other day
-vitamin D 5,000iu, every day
-Thiamine 300mg, every day
-B-complex 100, every day
-Magnesium complex every night

Diet:
-oatmeal every morning with fruit, milk, coconut oil and chocolate (semi-sweet)
-I eat a good amount of beef every day it seems (try to pair it with gelatin when I can)
-I eat a couple eggs pretty much every day
-I eat at chipotle a good bit (try to go low pufa as possible)
-other random, low pufa meals made at home
-Peat approved fruit though I do still eat bananas
-Lots of 1% milk and lots of coffee
-A good amount of orange juice and coke, though I try to drink that with meals
-Hagen Daz (however you spell that) ice cream 5 nights a week on average

Lifestyle:
-I drink maybe one night a week, usually beer in large amounts. Not the best thing for health but gotta live.
-Pushups and other body weight training every day
-Cardio - either basketball, tennis or soccer - 3/4 days a week
-Married, try to have sex every night but erections have been poor lately despite being on a good TRT protocol in numbers

Just curious, no judgment what so ever, but what drove you to take TRT? Other than that it seems like everything you do is extremely healthy.

 

[stsfut]

Just curious, no judgment what so ever, but what drove you to take TRT? Other than that it seems like everything you do is extremely healthy.

I started TRT in April of last year. I did that before ever finding Peat's works and even before thyroid medication for my sluggish thyroid. I had low testosterone for unknown reasons beginning at age 21 and I was put onto a SERM called Clomid to try to force my body to create more testosterone. I did that for about 3.5 years and was still feeling crummy (Clomid raised numbers but has side effects) so I decided to go for TRT. I also take something called HCG that we hopefully preserve my fertility. TRT has definitely made me feel loads better, I don't really regret that. Pinning myself with a needle once in a while isn't really an issue for me.

 

[stsfut]

I don't know if you have heard of Dr. Garrett Smith, but he has a lot of information on iron overload. Like Peat, he is not a fan of too much iron. Unlike Peat, however, Dr. Smith is not a fan of calcium. Dr. Smith's primary view of disease seems to be the "limescale and rust" theory in which he believes that excess calcium and iron accumulate in the body and cause a majority of health issues. He says, "trying to use the calcium in dairy to counteract iron absorption is not a good long-term strategy. Iron and calcium cause problems together in the body, so two wrongs don’t make a right".

Some dietary recommendations Dr. Smith has for dealing with iron overload include ingesting coffee (similar to Peat's use of coffee), black and green tea, red onions, cocoa, cinnamon, turmeric, high vitamin C foods, high vitamin E foods, and foods with Oligomeric Proanthocyanadins (OPCs). He also suggests avoiding vitamin D supplements and vitamin D fortified foods (most diary), large amounts of heme iron, and any iron-enriched foods like flour and rice. He isn't pro-vegan, but does recommend that a large portion of the diet come from plant foods like fruits, vegetables, and beans. For people that need a lot of protein (athletes or large individuals) or those who simply don't feel well not eating meat, he says that 4-6 oz of meat once a day is OK, but to limit red meat to about 1 lb a week. Eggs don't count as "meat" and he actually suggests eating 3 or more daily if you can tolerate them.

Based on your blood tests, he would definitely say you have iron overload. You can try donating blood 2-3 times a year to assist in removing excess iron, but make sure to replenish other minerals you lose in the process. Also, do not donate “double reds”, plasma, or platelets. Finally, the best strategy is probably avoiding heme iron, not forever, but until iron levels come down. If you don't want to eat beans for some protein to remain "Peaty", eggs, egg whites, and gelatin could help bring your protein intake up if you decide to remove some or all of the meat from your diet. I personally don't find it that easy to keep protein intake at my desired levels with mainly plant foods even with egg whites and gelatin, but it can be something to try for a little while until you get follow-up blood tests to see what effect it has.

Thanks for the response! I definitely feel like I need to eat way less meat. I eat red meat every day I think, sometimes for multiple meals. I also plan on giving up the ice cream. That should cut back on the calcium a little bit and hopefully help with the high trigs. I am a little hesitant about the vitamin C. I have been consuming OJ around all of my meals and I think that might be part of the iron problem. The vitamin C might be making my body absorb more iron than it usually would.

 

[Jsaute21]

I started TRT in April of last year. I did that before ever finding Peat's works and even before thyroid medication for my sluggish thyroid. I had low testosterone for unknown reasons beginning at age 21 and I was put onto a SERM called Clomid to try to force my body to create more testosterone. I did that for about 3.5 years and was still feeling crummy (Clomid raised numbers but has side effects) so I decided to go for TRT. I also take something called HCG that we hopefully preserve my fertility. TRT has definitely made me feel loads better, I don't really regret that. Pinning myself with a needle once in a while isn't really an issue for me.

Totally understandable how you arrived at that step. I figured you made that step before finding Peat. It also seems like you are on a somewhat anti estrogen food routine, which should pay dividends eventually. I would suggest stop taking TRT and use androsterone/pansterone with your NDT while resting adequately while letting your body recover. I think your androgens can be healed with good diet, thyroid etc. Thyroid controls all hormones. Healing it will allow your body to regulate itself again. That is just my 2C.

 

[stsfut]

Totally understandable how you arrived at that step. I figured you made that step before finding Peat. It also seems like you are on a somewhat anti estrogen food routine, which should pay dividends eventually. I would suggest stop taking TRT and use androsterone/pansterone with your NDT while resting adequately while letting your body recover. I think your androgens can be healed with good diet, thyroid etc. Thyroid controls all hormones. Healing it will allow your body to regulate itself again. That is just my 2C.

I have actually considered it. Fixing my diet and thyroid really could have been what was missing. Just a little scared to try!

Re: estrogen, I actually also started taking Progest-E a few nights ago (not reflected in these labs). My progesterone level was <.1 on a scale of .1-.5. My DHEA was also a little low. Not sure why these hormones are low. I expected thyroid meds to really boost them up.

 

[mmb82]

I am a little hesitant about the vitamin C. I have been consuming OJ around all of my meals and I think that might be part of the iron problem. The vitamin C might be making my body absorb more iron than it usually would.

Vitamin C only influences non-heme iron absorption, so consuming vitamin C with a steak should neither inhibit nor enhance the heme iron absorption from the steak. Dr. Smith actually recommends high doses of vitamin C (3-10 grams per day) to help with iron overload since vitamin C is necessary for proper iron metabolism in the water-related tissues of the body. I am not pressuring you into taking it if you are hesitant; just figured I'd provide another view/belief.

 

[stsfut]

Vitamin C only influences non-heme iron absorption, so consuming vitamin C with a steak should neither inhibit nor enhance the heme iron absorption from the steak. Dr. Smith actually recommends high doses of vitamin C (3-10 grams per day) to help with iron overload since vitamin C is necessary for proper iron metabolism in the water-related tissues of the body. I am not pressuring you into taking it if you are hesitant; just figured I'd provide another view/belief.

Thank you for posting this! I am not the most knowledgeable about iron I guess. I just thought that vitamin c increases iron absorption, period.

 

[stsfut]

BTW full labs found here. There is ALOT. In case anyone is interested. Lol

Imgur

 

[mmb82]

BTW full labs found here. There is ALOT. In case anyone is interested. Lol

Your blood levels are vitamin D are high...I would wager that your fat tissues are saturated with vitamin D, i.e. there is nowhere for your body to store it anymore, so it is ending up in the blood in large amounts. I am not a doctor, so you do not have to listen to me, but I would stop supplementing with vitamin D and take vitamin K2 (5 mg or so) instead. I would also start taking 20,000 IU of vitamin A daily for 2-3 months to get those blood levels of vitamin D down. Fat soluble vitamins are shitty because they accumulate in your tissues if you: a) take large doses, b) take even slightly more than you need for a prolonged time, or c) both. So if you do decide to take high doses of A and K2 based on my recommendations, don't do it for too long without testing and re-evaluating whether or not you need to be taking them in the quantities you are or at all.

How long have you been supplementing with vitamin D? I would suggest never taking a vitamin D supplement; let your body regulate its vitamin D production on its own. Low levels of magnesium and boron in the body can inhibit the body's production of vitamin D by the way, so one could argue that if you have low vitamin D levels in the blood, it is likely a deficiency of something else, not vitamin D itself. By that logic, taking vitamin D directly is covering up symptoms, not addressing the root issue, and could potentially do more harm than good if you take it in excess.

 

[stsfut]

62 in a range of 30-100 is high? I thought that would be an optimal level. I have been taking vitamin every day for the last 5-6 years. I now just take the 5kiu every other day. I was planning on reducing it to once a week once it spring came around but I guess I could stop now. I take the Vit A 10kiu every other day but I could start taking that daily. Is there no chance that Vit A could be the culprit for my high liver enzymes? I began taking Vit A a couple months ago. I have had high trigs before but never seen high liver enzymes before so not sure if that's connected.

 

[Dhair]

First of all, don't get too caught up in the numbers. You say that you are feeling better. What is your main troubling symptom? Is it erection quality? I don't see a prolactin test result. It is imperative to have this tested, especially with your history of low T.
Edit: Just read your full results. Prolactin is definitely too high. Dr. Peat has said that he has never met a man who was comfortable with his health who had a prolactin reading above 10. Make this your number one priority.

 

[stsfut]

Prolactin is 14.1 (4-15.2). So a little high. It is on page 3, kind of hard to see the results in that link I gave, I know. Prolactin is regularly that high for me. Has been as high as low 20's.

Yeah, the lack of good, solid erections is a little troubling. I have also been having what I perceived to be BPH. I figured my estradiol would be high but that turned out to be normal. PSA was normal also.

I wouldn't call it a symptom but it worries me to see the triglycerides and liver/enzymes so high. I may not be 'feeling' those things but I don't want to be quietly burying myself a grave.

 

[mmb82]

62 in a range of 30-100 is high? I thought that would be an optimal level.

I would say that is high based on the thoughts of Chris Masterjohn and this website. Overall, I think the research on optimal blood levels of vitamin D need more work because vitamin D levels affect and are affected by so many other variables in the body. Basically, because of the complex relationships of vitamin D with other vitamins and minerals, measuring the 25(OH)D levels don't give you the full picture, which I alluded to in my previous post when I mentioned magnesium and boron. That doesn't even consider the fact that the blood test you got measures the storage form of vitamin D, not the active form, so basically, you have high levels of the "storage form" of vitamin D, but no idea what the levels of the active form are. If you have that high of levels in your blood, then you are likely already storing a lot in your fat tissue and don't need more, especially since you said that you get a decent amount of sun.

My overall point is still that fat soluble vitamins are shitty to supplement and should be done cautiously. If you are off in your dosage too much and/or for too long, you can really mess yourself up, which is why I recommend that if you use A and K2 to bring those D levels down, don't do it too aggressively or for too long. Get vitamin D from the sun, not from supplements. If you have trouble keeping vitamin D levels up naturally even with a lot of sun exposure, there is likely another issue/deficiency.

 

[stsfut]

First of all, don't get too caught up in the numbers. You say that you are feeling better. What is your main troubling symptom? Is it erection quality? I don't see a prolactin test result. It is imperative to have this tested, especially with your history of low T.
Edit: Just read your full results. Prolactin is definitely too high. Dr. Peat has said that he has never met a man who was comfortable with his health who had a prolactin reading above 10. Make this your number one priority.

How though? I think 100mg of b6 daily. Keep estradiol low. Is it just stress? I agree though, I have been monitoring/researching PRL. There is a drug cabergoline I could take but I would rather not.

 

[Dhair]

How though? I think 100mg of b6 daily. Keep estradiol low. Is it just stress? I agree though, I have been monitoring/researching PRL. There is a drug cabergoline I could take but I would rather not.

Why take cabergoline? Lisuride is the safest, followed by bromocriptine, then cabergoline. Idealabs sells lisuride. It is extremely effective at lowering prolactin.
Your prolactin could be high because of stress, darkness, any number of things. I can tell you that even though it is high enough to cause problems, it probably isn't high enough for a doctor to prescribe you anything for it, so you may have to do it yourself. I think if you lowered prolactin to 6 or so, your testosterone would be even higher.

 

[stsfut]

Well I’m on TRT so if I wanted higher T I could just inject more. But yea I think PRL is def high enough to cause libido/erection issues. I will try more sunlight plus look into idealabs. Thanks!