Interesting. Do you think that the type of vitamin E really matters? Like if it is derived from soybean oil or not. My thoughts are we should try to do the best we can purchasing the highest quality vitamin E, but some people can't afford the best since vitamin E can be very expensive depending on the source of the oil. If coming from MCT oil, it gets pretty pricey. I currently am taking solgar vitamin E, derived from safflower oil (I know not the best). Though I am not a fan of most supplements, I believe E is important because we are exposed to so many estrogenic compounds, and after years of eating PUFA vitamin E requirements are elevated. The fact that it can also help to lower prolactin is a huge bonus.
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Concerning Blood Work - What Am I Doing Wrong
- Thread starter stsfut
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Interesting. Do you think that the type of vitamin E really matters? Like if it is derived from soybean oil or not. My thoughts are we should try to do the best we can purchasing the highest quality vitamin E, but some people can't afford the best since vitamin E can be very expensive depending on the source of the oil. If coming from MCT oil, it gets pretty pricey. I currently am taking solgar vitamin E, derived from safflower oil (I know not the best). Though I am not a fan of most supplements, I believe E is important because we are exposed to so many estrogenic compounds, and after years of eating PUFA vitamin E requirements are elevated. The fact that it can also help to lower prolactin is a huge bonus.
Ulysses
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What aspirin dose are you using? Try the 81 mg tablets. Also, pay attention to the fact that it’s hurting your stomach. That’s an important clue. Maybe you are just predisposed to aspirin sensitivity for some immutable genetic reason, but on the other hand, maybe there are some specific steps you need to take in order to heal your gut: this could easily be the root of your issues.
Agreed, vitamin E is critical after decades of PUFAs. Even if my body fat is very low, the prolactin and anti estrogen benefits are great.I think there was virtually no difference in price (in store) between the oil-based vitamin E and the oil-free ones.
https://naturalfactors.com/product/clear-base-vitamin-e/
The topic on tamoxifen and vitamin E is here:
Vitamin E Is An Estrogen Receptor Antagonist
it's also shown improvements on blood flow with interesting effects on arteries (just like oats) and also type 1 diabetes retinal damage IIRC.
Vitamin E Helps Arteries Even After a High-Fat Meal
If you have a true 32" waist size (not pants size per se) then that would mean at 6' tall, your waist to height ratio is .44 which is very good. As someone with a 200# frame and a 32" waist, I would presume that you probably have a low body fat % and a pretty good V taper? This to me seems healthy to me and not necessarily a bad thing. As I stated before, the fact that you have gained weight could be partly due to TRT as it tends to make men pack on muscle even without going to the gym. If you are eating a ton of calories, that could raise your triglycerides, not necessarily from fructose alone, as another poster suggested. Peat talks about temporary increases in triglycerides from fructose consumption due to a shift from lowered free fatty acids, which actually may be a good thing, temporarily. But yeah a lot of it could be due to increased calorie consumption if you recently have gained weight. It's important to recheck your triglycerides because there can be huge variations depending on what you ate close to the test, and whether during the week of your test you were in a calorie surplus or deficit.
My point was about the doses, Ray supplements T. That being said he is 80, it is disturbing to think a man in his 20s needs trt.
Feeling better on trt or any compound does not justify its use as far as I am concerned, that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, just that it isn't enough.
It is funny to say people are dogmatic (not sure where you saw that in the discussion btw), and then proceed to exclude everyone from the discussion besides a very small minority of people.
Feeling better on trt or any compound does not justify its use as far as I am concerned, that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, just that it isn't enough.
It is funny to say people are dogmatic (not sure where you saw that in the discussion btw), and then proceed to exclude everyone from the discussion besides a very small minority of people.
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Im somewhat onboard with @Wagner83 's thinking. Considering the role of thyroid with respect to keeping stress at bay AND supporting androgens I have a really hard time accepting that its appropriate and OK considering longevity in males and the resiliency of things like testes and adrenals.
Today im talking through stuff with my 33 year old friend who was put on TRT like 2 years ago. Dude had insane stress and was an idiot in regards to his life and nutrition. Doc threw him on TRT without even doing a fvckin thyroid or a stress panel. Just plain disgusting how blindly these guys go about medicine and treating only the symptom. Now hea concerned because not only does he look and feel like garbage, his sperm count is 0 and now he's thinking of kids
Today im talking through stuff with my 33 year old friend who was put on TRT like 2 years ago. Dude had insane stress and was an idiot in regards to his life and nutrition. Doc threw him on TRT without even doing a fvckin thyroid or a stress panel. Just plain disgusting how blindly these guys go about medicine and treating only the symptom. Now hea concerned because not only does he look and feel like garbage, his sperm count is 0 and now he's thinking of kids
western medicine is scary. It's a shame I spent years myself studying it and believing in it, and now looking for my way out.
Personal note, TRT has been incredible for me. But I don't believe natural testosterone production could suit my physique goals (that I have reached as of today).
From a more general standpoint, I agree that I wouldn't touch a drug, especially a suppressive one, unless everything else is in check in the patient's lifestyle. But that's so much to ask...
Personal note, TRT has been incredible for me. But I don't believe natural testosterone production could suit my physique goals (that I have reached as of today).
From a more general standpoint, I agree that I wouldn't touch a drug, especially a suppressive one, unless everything else is in check in the patient's lifestyle. But that's so much to ask...
I eat out 1-2x a week which IMO is fine and does not effect me adversely. However, eating PUFA free while going out to eat is difficult. Most restaurants use canola oil because of its smoke point being favorable to olive oil, etc. Garbage i know but my friend is a chef and has verified this fact. PUFA is everywhere too. If you order a sandwich, it is more than likely in the bread they provide etc. Nothing a little vitamin e once a week cant handle but for improving liver health, eating out should be minimized without effecting social life.
I didn't mean having a healthy libido is annoying. I mean certain weeks for whatever reason, one can be insatiable almost "high school horny" which in fact can be annoying. Having libido is obviously better than not having it.
Not trying to judge folks who have taken TRT what so ever. I just guarantee some have arrived at that decision prematurely before finding Peat or other pioneers who understand endocrinology. This is extremely understandable as the majority of information out there regarding androgens and hormones is bull crap. The amount of my friends that think they are eating healthy by eating nuts and salads etc. is astonishing.
With that being said, i agree that testicular atrophy and infertility are clearly not permanent situations. I believe most things in life aren't permanent and can be improved. I have a buddy who took TRT, HGH for 3-5 years, quit cold turkey and just had a baby girl. Also look at all the celebrities on a cocktail of artificial hormones that have kids all the time. Its clearly possible.
All the power to you for fixing your situation and enjoying life. Nobody should take that away from you.
I think many of us are in agreement here. For one, I think most of us can all agree that TRT should be only after one has the desired amount of kids he wants and if all other therapies have been exhausted such as diet/lifestyle, thyroid supplements, small amounts of androsterone/pregnenolone/dhea. Problem is many of these things do not work for many, many people I have talked to. I have seen bloodwork from people who take Haidut's products and it is not always consistent.
Believe me, if these things worked to make a good percentage of people who try them feel better it would be a great thing. Unlike TRT, there is no clear standard procedure for treating someone with hypogonadism and bringing testosterone to acceptable physiological ranges. Most people on this forum have different views about what is healthy and what isn't and in what amounts. To somebody who's had hypogonadism for years, this can be very intimidating, and rightfully so. From a time economy perspective, it can be a tough pill to swallow, especially not knowing who/what to believe.
So I do think we are all onto something trying to fix hormonal issues with small doses, diet and lifestyle strategies, etc, but until there is a good percentage of people who find an effective formula that works for a good amount of people, it won't be an acceptable recovery protocol. On a side note, lets face it, modern life is stressful. I work seven days a week. Many of my friends do the same, and have several jobs + going to school. It takes much more time to do all the research, interpret the studies, and make the best educated decisions on what supplements to take, diet strategies to follow, etc. And at the end of the day, the culprit is often not diet related, but due to the fact that we work so much and spend so much of our waking hours commuting to work on polluted highways, which is terrible for our health. Many of us don't have the option of quitting our jobs due to family commitments, etc...
I don't blame somebody for making the educated decision to take TRT as opposed to altering their whole lifestyle and quit his/her job in an attempt to fix their hormones, which may or may not actually work.
Believe me, if these things worked to make a good percentage of people who try them feel better it would be a great thing. Unlike TRT, there is no clear standard procedure for treating someone with hypogonadism and bringing testosterone to acceptable physiological ranges. Most people on this forum have different views about what is healthy and what isn't and in what amounts. To somebody who's had hypogonadism for years, this can be very intimidating, and rightfully so. From a time economy perspective, it can be a tough pill to swallow, especially not knowing who/what to believe.
So I do think we are all onto something trying to fix hormonal issues with small doses, diet and lifestyle strategies, etc, but until there is a good percentage of people who find an effective formula that works for a good amount of people, it won't be an acceptable recovery protocol. On a side note, lets face it, modern life is stressful. I work seven days a week. Many of my friends do the same, and have several jobs + going to school. It takes much more time to do all the research, interpret the studies, and make the best educated decisions on what supplements to take, diet strategies to follow, etc. And at the end of the day, the culprit is often not diet related, but due to the fact that we work so much and spend so much of our waking hours commuting to work on polluted highways, which is terrible for our health. Many of us don't have the option of quitting our jobs due to family commitments, etc...
I don't blame somebody for making the educated decision to take TRT as opposed to altering their whole lifestyle and quit his/her job in an attempt to fix their hormones, which may or may not actually work.
Amen. Well said. I will also add how important it is to factor in the role of both neurosteroids and neurotransmitters. There was a period of time about a year and a half ago, where I did not feel great. I was very orthorexic, and did not eat enough but just started to discover eating for testosterone. I went and got checked and came back with a testosterone score of 813, and a free t that was off the reference range high, with a low e2 score of 12 on a range from 20-70 or whatever. Long story short, most people would tell you that panel is close to ideal for a natural guy not taking anything besides a vitamin a couple of days a week. Except my libido was crap, work production was bad, OCD symptoms existed. I either had low DHT at the time (didnt get tested) or neurotransmitters and neurosteroids were off. I haven't gotten my T checked in a while because i feel much better now. I wouldn't be surprised if a blood panel revealed a lower level of T, but my neurosteroids are working much much better.
Good points. My question is, how do you know your neurosteroids are working well? Is there anything you have tried to alter them? I.e. BCAAs, L-phenylalanine, tyrosine, etc, or gelatine to block the formation of serotonin? Or have you tried to fix your gut with raw carrots, etc... I find that my libido is often inconsistent despite having good T levels and thyroid levels. Following some of Peat's work while also liberalizing my diet a good bit (a la Matt Stone), I was able to get my testosterone up, but like you, I find my libido is not always consistent. I feel a lot of it may have to do with my crazy work schedule. I don't often get excited about things as much as I used to, just seem to have an ambivalent attitude about everything, which seems like excess serotonin to me, but the things I've tried (BCAAs, L-phenylalanine have not helped). What actually helps bring good feelings of dopamine up the most is some good music. The more I listen to music, the better I feel and more good emotions are flowing.
interesting how I had the exact same blood test naturally. 800+ total T, 10 e2. On the other hand my free T was low too which makes me believe that free T is unreliable. But low e2 is terrible for sure. I blame it all on life stress and unhappiness which are still not fixed 100% so TRT it is. It fixed a lot if not all body-related conditions, now the biggest hurdle is ahead which is finding true happiness.
When I was off everything for a month last summer and had a lot of vacations me and my GF I was healthier than on TRT. Came back to real life and probable rock bottom {FSH+LH+sex hormone} levels hit me within days. Stress IS cancer.
I would say neurosteroid function should be associated closely with your mood, cognitive function, CNS recovery from a workout, how you sleep, libido, etc. For me, who has never dealt with low testosterone directly, I notice more significant changes from supplements like Cypro, diamant, nicotine, aspirn, energin than androsterone, thyroid, DHEA etc. I hypothesize this is because the modern world we live in is tough on our neurotransmitters. We are on our phones constantly, staring at laptops etc. I know this lowers T, but i think that's through promoting excess serotonin, altering neurotransmitter profiles significantly. Red light is also a good tool obviously.
Good music is a great tool. I notice that when i listen to aggressive music like rap or something similar, i can have some innapropriate or disturbing thoughts. Nothing terrible, but still worth noting. Where as if i listen to old school rock and roll, etc. i am immediately relaxed and thinking very clearly.
Pablo Cruise
Member
If I had those results and your triglycerides I would cut back seriously on ice cream. If your GP or internal med have no answers see a hematologist. I am not diagnosing you but perhaps hemachromatosis should be ruled out. You don't show physical activity signs of that dx. Any genetics for it?
By my ferritin would be super high, no?
Mito
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“Now, let’s think back to the core principles of measuring nutritional status that I had mentioned in chrismasterjohnphd.com/interlude, what makes a good marker of nutritional status. The first two principles were sensitivity and specificity. So let’s compare ferritin and transferrin saturation here. In terms of sensitivity, the reason that ferritin increases in response to too much iron status is because on a mechanistic level, elevated transferrin saturation communicates through HFE to hepcidin to downregulate iron absorption and to increase storage of iron and ferritin. So transferrin saturation is much more sensitive than ferritin is because transferrin saturation is the cause of ferritin elevating in response to too much iron, and that’s consistent with my own story where my transferrin saturation was going out of the reference range while my ferritin was way, way, way within it. In fact, when ferritin is used to diagnose hemochromatosis, then it may be the case that they won’t recommend that you get a liver biopsy until your ferritin reaches 1000 nanograms per milliliter, and you could probably catch all of those people with hemochromatosis if you just screened everyone who has transferrin saturation over 45%.” https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/2017/01/27/need-manage-iron-status/
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/2017/03/22/know-youre-risk-iron-overload/
Thanks for that. Definitely concerned now.
Serum iron has nothing to do with diet when ferritin is normal. High serum iron is a sign of inflammation. The high liver enzymes are a sign of liver stress but that can also be caused by having a bunch of beers or even tylenol the night before. Did you drink the night before the test? If you post your full labs it would be helpful since there can be a ton of things causing inflammation. It does seem like too much ice cream and maybe fructose since your cholesterol is normal.
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