Compost is NOT SOIL, soil is Sand, Silt, and Clay. Exposing the compost scam with Gary's Best.

[:M :B.]

Thanks for sharing.
I am enjoying his lectures.

I added perlite, peat moss and sand to my last few planting mixes.
Too early to tell, but it made sense to me.

Very nice. If you feel like it take some pics of the plants in your different soils and then if they grow differently it would be interesting to see that. I think a mulch layer on top of the Gary mix would be sweet.

The pics I posted of my house plants and soil early in the tread don't really show the soil mix very well because when I water it the perlite floats to the top and the sand got washed down a little bit. And I didn't add a layer of mulch, probably should do that.

 

[Regina]

Very nice. If you feel like it take some pics of the plants in your different soils and then if they grow differently it would be interesting to see that. I think a mulch layer on top of the Gary mix would be sweet.

The pics I posted of my house plants and soil early in the tread don't really show the soil mix very well because when I water it the perlite floats to the top and the sand got washed down a little bit. And I didn't add a layer of mulch, probably should do that.

Okay.
Don't laugh. I don't have a green thumb. Yet.
Areca: bag of crushed granite, sand, potting mix, yard dirt (that tends to be sandy loams), with a sand garnish
Tomato: I removed some potting mix and gingerly added perlite, peat moss and sand
Olive: yard dirt, sand, perlite, peat moss
Orange: I gingerly added perlite, moss sand and olive leaves
China Doll: potting mix

 

[:M :B.]

Okay.
Don't laugh. I don't have a green thumb. Yet.
Areca: bag of crushed granite, sand, potting mix, yard dirt (that tends to be sandy loams), with a sand garnish
Tomato: I removed some potting mix and gingerly added perlite, peat moss and sand
Olive: yard dirt, sand, perlite, peat moss
Orange: I gingerly added perlite, moss sand and olive leaves
China Doll: potting mix

Awesome, good work. We'll see how they do.

 

[SlowWalker]

I think dr Elain Ingram has some of the best understanding of soil biology and she is very good at making it entertaining. It’s truly fascinating how the diversity of biological life in the soil is the key factor determining plant growth and soil quality. She mentions compost as being crucial to inoculating soil with diverse microbial species, the key being that the compost has to be of high quality and not having gone through an anaerobic phase as these bacterias can create some of the most harmful chemicals for plants.

This is a 4 part video, well worth the watch for an in-depth understanding of soul biology


View: https://youtu.be/ErMHR6Mc4Bk

 

[lvysaur]

Yes cover crops are crucial. A potato farm in Fraser valley Canada doesn't fertilize, they grow in real soil and use cover crops in the off season. They occasionally add a little compost to the top of their soil. Very awesome potatoes from this farm.

If they use cover crops, they are fertilizing. Cover crops pull atmospheric nitrogen from the air, so you get free nitrogen. The Cover crop is then mowed and allowed to decompose into the soil.

There's no compost scam. It's just people who've never grown anything in their lives listening to internet gurus who overrate misleading stuff for hype.

Fertilizer is necessary, even moreso in a suburban backyard where the soil has been chronically robbed of nutrients by mowing and trashing the lawn clippings. This fertilizer doesn't *necessarily* have to be compost, although compost is a very good and somewhat idiotproof way to do it.

One can also use urine (Nitrogen), bones (Phosphorous), or ashes (Potassium). Among many other things. But these are one ingredient level-ups.

A hypothetical place where fertilizer is UNnecessary would be a forest--no removal of nutrients whatsoever, just a totally closed loop cycle.

 

[lvysaur]

the key being that the compost has to be of high quality and not having gone through an anaerobic phase as these bacterias can create some of the most harmful chemicals for plants.

Overrated IMO.

I have had anaerobic rotting stinky compost sitting in the rain. The grass around it grew 3x higher than the other grass.

The anaerobic seepage promoted the grass' growth. The fact that it was anaerobic didn't matter--it's just not as efficient and fast as aerobic composting. However, it's less labor.

It's possible that anaerobic bacteria can wreck certain plants, but it is not a universal issue. Koreans use anaerobic "rotting water" as a soil amendment (diluted of course)

 

[:M :B.]

Gary talked about a lot of good stuff in this recent show. I'd vote it one of his best shows.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELVxPE7JGyw&t=3243s

 

[Regina]

Gary talked about a lot of good stuff in this recent show. I'd vote it one of his best shows.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELVxPE7JGyw&t=3243s

Great! Thanks for posting. I really enjoy him.

 

[EvanHinkle]

Just wanted to revive this post with spring right around the corner. My wife and I have really committed to our backyard orchard and Gary’s advice has been invaluable!

In addition, he’s very “Peaty” as he talks about the necessity of carbohydrate for plants to grow and how wood is just rearranged sugar. I literally just watched a video where he said carbon dioxide and water will make things decompose slower. Incredible stuff. Highly recommended.

 

[:M :B.]

Just wanted to revive this post with spring right around the corner. My wife and I have really committed to our backyard orchard and Gary’s advice has been invaluable!

In addition, he’s very “Peaty” as he talks about the necessity of carbohydrate for plants to grow and how wood is just rearranged sugar. I literally just watched a video where he said carbon dioxide and water will make things decompose slower. Incredible stuff. Highly recommended.View attachment 47942

Awesome! Gary is the Ray of the plant world. He mentioned spraying plants with sugar water in one of his classes.

 

[Waynish]

I've been aware of this guy for a while... But can anyone find older source materials for this stuff? I bet it has more gravy - though this is a good start.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Compost's main functions are water retention and aeration. You can add stuff like chicken manure or urine to make it super fertilizer. Calling it a scam is just ridiculous

 

[EvanHinkle]

Compost's main functions are water retention and aeration. You can add stuff like chicken manure or urine to make it super fertilizer. Calling it a scam is just ridiculous

I kinda lean toward the idea of scam personally. Compost is pushed by university horticulturalists, it retains the water as you mentioned, and nearly everything you purchase commercially comes potted in it. In my experience most people kill their plants from overwatering them, (exacerbated by compost). The yellow leaves that many people get on their trees and houseplants are from this constant sogginess. Yet, on a farm, planted in soil, there’s no concept of overwatering. There’s poor use of water, but overwatering will not kill plants, (Gary says this all the time, and having used compost for far too long myself, I agree from my personal experience).

I think his perspective that “authoritative experts” are pushing an improper medium for the growth of the food bearing plant, coupled with his emphasis on restoring proper balance to ensure the plant can reproduce make him very much like Peat. It’s almost as if we’re being sold fruit trees and food bearing plants in an improper medium so that they’ll die and we’ll give up and say, “oh well, I guess growing your own food is too hard. I tried but I can’t do it. I’ll just stick to buying things I need from our super functional industrial food complex. Why did I think a little guy like me could do something like this…”

Try making some of his growing medium and using it for a plant of yours and I bet you’ll be surprised with the results. I didn’t believe it myself at first, but I sure do now.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Try making some of his growing medium and using it for a plant of yours and I bet you’ll be surprised with the results. I didn’t believe it myself at first, but I sure do now.

Instead of me having to go back and watch the video give me the tldr version of what the mix would look like

 

[EvanHinkle]

Instead of me having to go back and watch the video give me the tldr version of what the mix would look like

That would rob you of Gary’s genius. I can’t in good conscience do that, lol (and I won’t do it justice really). Essentially it’s sand clay and rocks, but if you don’t want to do it yourself he has a mix called Top Pot.

 

[Perry Staltic]

That would rob you of Gary’s genius. I can’t in good conscience do that, lol (and I won’t do it justice really). Essentially it’s sand clay and rocks, but if you don’t want to do it yourself he has a mix called Top Pot.

Rocks make no sense and serve no purpose other than to take up volume. Sand keeps the clay from clumping tightly together, thus improving drainage. Something's needed to retain water otherwise you'll be watering more than necessary, and to provide more aeration than sand gives. Plant roots need water, nutrients and air. Optimize that and you've got good soil.

 

[EvanHinkle]

Rocks make no sense and serve no purpose other than to take up volume. Sand keeps the clay from clumping tightly together, thus improving drainage. Something's needed to retain water otherwise you'll be watering more than necessary, and to provide more aeration than sand gives. Plant roots need water, nutrients and air. Optimize that and you've got good soil.

Then don’t try his method. No biggie. Post some pictures of your garden and maybe we can have a friendly competition?

 

[Perry Staltic]

Then don’t try his method. No biggie. Post some pictures of your garden and maybe we can have a friendly competition?

FWIW I've grown veggies in nothing but pea-sized gravel. The roots stayed constantly wet, but they got plenty of air so the plants thrived. They had plenty of air, water and nutrients from fish water that flooded the gravel bed and drained about every 15 minutes.

 

[EvanHinkle]

FWIW I've grown veggies in nothing but pea-sized gravel. The roots stayed constantly wet, but they got plenty of air so the plants thrived. They had plenty of air, water and nutrients from fish water that flooded the gravel bed and drained about every 15 minutes.

I think that’s where the clay comes in, (to retain water better amongst the sand/rock. I’m still pretty new to Gary’s concepts though.

Interesting what you said about the roots getting air in your gravel. He says that’s the whole point of his soil, (to allow oxygen to circulate). He says compost will restrict air flow.

 

[Perry Staltic]

He says compost will restrict air flow.

Depends on the compost. The typical stuff you buy at the store is crap