Chronic health problem (Dehydration) - Faint hope somebody here might have some ideas

[yerrag]

I've sent you some material to read without you having any comment on them. this means you either read them and found them hard to understand. Or that my direction of inquiry is not consistent with what your direction.

I personally feel that you do a lot more testing than what is needed. You may have a nice health insurance plan that allows your doctors to grant tests, but how relevant are these tests and how helpful are they? Your thyroid tests are inconclusive and your estrogen test says nothing about your true estrogen level, which is not in the blood but mostly in the tissues, so the low estrogen in the blood means nothing.

I only say this because I see the predicament you're in. With your doctor unable to do much, and your RPF team in this thread making a broth made by many chefs, you're just as clueless as before. Since this thread is already 18 pages long, it may help if you find a better doctor who analyzes well instead of keep giving you tests. In the mean time, it would be better if you pm somebody from the members here, and start working with him one on one. You've already gotten a flavor of the expertise here, I hope, and you would have to trust your judgment. It's better than having a hodge-podge that pulls you in different directions, as this would get you nowhere.

 

[Callmestar]

I've sent you some material to read without you having any comment on them. this means you either read them and found them hard to understand. Or that my direction of inquiry is not consistent with what your direction.

I personally feel that you do a lot more testing than what is needed. You may have a nice health insurance plan that allows your doctors to grant tests, but how relevant are these tests and how helpful are they? Your thyroid tests are inconclusive and your estrogen test says nothing about your true estrogen level, which is not in the blood but mostly in the tissues, so the low estrogen in the blood means nothing.

I only say this because I see the predicament you're in. With your doctor unable to do much, and your RPF team in this thread making a broth made by many chefs, you're just as clueless as before. Since this thread is already 18 pages long, it may help if you find a better doctor who analyzes well instead of keep giving you tests. In the mean time, it would be better if you pm somebody from the members here, and start working with him one on one. You've already gotten a flavor of the expertise here, I hope, and you would have to trust your judgment. It's better than having a hodge-podge that pulls you in different directions, as this would get you nowhere.

Apologies, I comment on and read 99% of what is shared here. Sorry if I didn't get back to your on one of your posts. Initially, your posts were regarding possible pathogen / infection which we then thought may be less likely based on my bloods and you moved on to the PH / Acid alkinline balance. I ordered the urine strips and tested which showed I was around optimal but slightly on the acidic side. I did the breath count test and this showed the complete opposite and indicated me being very alkaline. So two conflicting results. I don't know enough about this area to know if it could be related to my symptoms. I also don't have the capacity to explore every single possibility.

I agree, at this point I'm just getting tests for the sake of it and hoping by the off chance I find something that's out of range that might be causing my symptoms. Find a better doctor? I've seen about 10, none can work out what's going on so the best chance I have is from the experience of those here it seems. I can't follow every idea and protocol at once and I also can't constantly chop and change what I'm doing before giving things a chance, which I've done previously. By balance, the most common theme here has been to eat better, more Peat recommended foods, look at hypothyroid and that's what I've been doing mostly thus far. As well as some b vitamin supplementation which is another common theme. That's just a basic explanation of what I'm doing, of course, I'm doing whatever I can practically to improve my wellbeing, reducing stress, getting plenty of sleep, sunlight etc etc by these go without saying at this point.

But yes, there's been little to no improvement and I'm probably as clueless as before as we are all just guessing at the end of the day.

The things that do stand out are high DHEA which is always high, Kidney results that repeatedly come back with high creatinine and uric acid, although they were ok most recent result. Testosterone that's dropping. But yes, I'm lost.

 

[Kaur Singh]

Dehydration, mouth dryness, excessive urination can be signs of diabetes, or diabetic ketoacidosis.

So how your body is handling glucose seems relevant, even if you don't quite have the above conditions.
You can measure ketones at home too.
As you have experienced, testing in the morning doesn't give enough information and doesn't get you much of anywhere.

Peat has a few articles on sugar and diabetes posted on his site.
Understand what his thesis on what happens to the body in hypothyroid states is
Go to the source

Read the one on learned helplessness too

Ultimately thyroid corrects the imbalances.
Make sure you have your nutrition on board.

Good luck!

 

[Callmestar]

Dehydration, mouth dryness, excessive urination can be signs of diabetes, or diabetic ketoacidosis.

So how your body is handling glucose seems relevant, even if you don't quite have the above conditions.
You can measure ketones at home too.
As you have experienced, testing in the morning doesn't give enough information and doesn't get you much of anywhere.

Peat has a few articles on sugar and diabetes posted on his site.
Understand what his thesis on what happens to the body in hypothyroid states is
Go to the source

Read the one on learned helplessness too

Ultimately thyroid corrects the imbalances.
Make sure you have your nutrition on board.

Good luck!

Learned helplessness....yeah that's it.

My nutrition is on board and I'm taking thyroid.

 

[Kaur Singh]

Learned helplessness....yeah that's it.

My nutrition is on board and I'm taking thyroid.

The symptoms you have described, to me, indicate ME/CFS.
There are connective issues too, joint instability - hyoid bone, jaw, cervical vertebrae included.
Plus whatever muscle patterning and co-ordination problems
(the swallowing problems)

To keep going from doctor to doctor,
with no real answers from them,
reinforces the learned helplessness:
if they, the 'experts' don't know - how can anyone?

To consistently try recommendations and tips,
and not have them work
reinforces the learned helplessness:
I keep trying things and nothing works (that has for others)
something must be very different and very wrong (about me)


Alas, putting the label of ME/CFS on it
also can lead to more learned helplessness:
oh no, I have something that has no cure, no treatment, little is known about it
per the doctors, researchers and people suffering from it.

I am very grateful that I quickly realized that no doctor would be able to help me
And that Peat figured out a good chunk of this decades ago

Keep going
figure out how to make nutrition and thyroid medication work for you
keep learning and informing yourself
go to the original source, the articles and audio interviews

keep tinkering

See what happens when you cut down/eliminate your tryptophan intake from muscle meats and seafood
the question then become where you are going to get your proteins from
See what happens when you ingest more calcium than phosphate
(reasonable doses of niacinamide can help)

If you try too many things at once,
you won't be able to keep track of what is helping, what is hurting
etc

If you start to feel hopeless/despair, remind your self it is this state of cholinergic dominance

View: https://youtu.be/lVtCaaRjllU



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pXdGi8hwcM



Know that some of us recover
are recovering
have recovered
even from severe bedbound ME/CFS
by using Peat's work and recommendations
by taking thyroid hormones (according to how each one needs them)
or other programs that are very similar to Peat's recommendations.

 

[Bluebell]

Know that some of us recover
are recovering
have recovered
even from severe bedbound ME/CFS
by using Peat's work and recommendations
by taking thyroid hormones (according to how each one needs them)
or other programs that are very similar to Peat's recommendations.

@Kaur Singh

Interesting!

Can you provide some links? (apart from posts on this site)

 

[Callmestar]

The symptoms you have described, to me, indicate ME/CFS.
There are connective issues too, joint instability - hyoid bone, jaw, cervical vertebrae included.
Plus whatever muscle patterning and co-ordination problems
(the swallowing problems)

To keep going from doctor to doctor,
with no real answers from them,
reinforces the learned helplessness:
if they, the 'experts' don't know - how can anyone?

To consistently try recommendations and tips,
and not have them work
reinforces the learned helplessness:
I keep trying things and nothing works (that has for others)
something must be very different and very wrong (about me)


Alas, putting the label of ME/CFS on it
also can lead to more learned helplessness:
oh no, I have something that has no cure, no treatment, little is known about it
per the doctors, researchers and people suffering from it.

I am very grateful that I quickly realized that no doctor would be able to help me
And that Peat figured out a good chunk of this decades ago

Keep going
figure out how to make nutrition and thyroid medication work for you
keep learning and informing yourself
go to the original source, the articles and audio interviews

keep tinkering

See what happens when you cut down/eliminate your tryptophan intake from muscle meats and seafood
the question then become where you are going to get your proteins from
See what happens when you ingest more calcium than phosphate
(reasonable doses of niacinamide can help)

If you try too many things at once,
you won't be able to keep track of what is helping, what is hurting
etc

If you start to feel hopeless/despair, remind your self it is this state of cholinergic dominance

View: https://youtu.be/lVtCaaRjllU



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pXdGi8hwcM



Know that some of us recover
are recovering
have recovered
even from severe bedbound ME/CFS
by using Peat's work and recommendations
by taking thyroid hormones (according to how each one needs them)
or other programs that are very similar to Peat's recommendations.

Sorry, but I am literally the last person to rely on doctors for anything or think they somehow have the power to save me. When these symptoms initially started after being unable to find any organic cause or cure myself, naturally I went to a doctor for testing to see if there was something that could be found via bloodwork or be treated, because obviously, I don't have the facility do that on my own. After initial testing was inconclusive, I literally went 3 years without seeing a doctor trying everything I could to rebuild myself through my own research, nutrition, and various other protocols. There were brief periods here and there were the symptoms were slightly improved but for the most part they remained at the current level. So what do you do after 3 years of no success in recovery? You look at different options again, you look for the opinion of others in case you've missed anything or simply don't have the knowledge to work out what's going on. That is usually in the form of speaking to medical professionals who have access to tests and asking on forums such as this. The reason I currently get blood tests now is because I want to see where my bloods are at in case I find something that might lead to an answer, not because I think a doctor is going to spot something. I know full well my doctor isn't going to spot anything, he just does what I tell him to do and I take away the blood results.

Would I like someone to give me an answer that would resolve all of my medical issues, of course. Do I think that's going to happen, no. I literally have the opposite of learned helplessness and go around telling everyone how utterly useless most medical professionals are and they are likely to find better information and a quicker route to health through forums such as this. Doctors are only useful for tests or surgery.

I work with people who have ME/CFS, Fibromyalgia etc every day. I know exactly how people can adopt these labels and live by the diagnosis and that become their identity for the rest of their life. An excuse for why they can't do anything in life and always thinking a doctor or medication is the answer. I know exactly what learned helplessness is and it certainly isn't what's going on here with me.

Unfortunately with my current condition, I have absolutely no idea what's going on, as does nobody else. So it's become a case of throwing 100 darts at a dartboard in the form of forum posts or random obscure blood tests, in the hope one might hit the bullseye....That's not learned helplessness. That's just having no other option and increasing my chances of finding a solution. Don't think for a second I'm waiting for someone to save me and not implementing nutrition, thyroid and many of the things mentioned here, which I've already stated I'm doing before your post.

 

[yerrag]

Apologies, I comment on and read 99% of what is shared here. Sorry if I didn't get back to your on one of your posts. Initially, your posts were regarding possible pathogen / infection which we then thought may be less likely based on my bloods and your moved on to the PH / Acid alkinline balance.

It's understandable as a few things would slip through. And yes, your recounting is accurate and we have ruled out the bacterial infection origin of it. The acid-base balance aspect is where we left off.

I ordered the urine strips and tested which showed I was around optimal but slightly on the acidic side. I did the breath count test and this showed the complete opposite and indicated me being very alkaline. So two conflicting results. I don't know enough about this area to know if it could be related to my symptoms.

At that time, I believe we only tested the urine and not saliva, and your purported breath rate (which I don't trust) is 10 . Your urine was around 6 -6.5 (acidic- based on your faulty reading).

It's easy for a neophyte to think these results are in conflict, only because he knows not enough to interpret it. And below I attached some reading material for you to read, so we can be on the same page. And this is where the conversation was broken.

I would say that your urine should actually be more alkaline to reflect your alkaline state. The reason it isn't is probably you're low on potassium, such that instead of say excreting potassium bicarbonate, it's instead excreting ammonium (NH3 + H+) bicarbonate, for example. If so, it would reflect poorly on your low potassium stores.

It's likely that is the result of your high urine excretion rate for a long time, which excreted also plenty of potassium. This led to your current condition of not being able to excrete potassium. If this were the case, your intrcellular potassium would also be low, and since potassium regulates calcium influx int to the cell, you may have more calcium in your cells than what is optimal. So without your intracellualr/extracellular potassium ratio being out of whack (it's supposed to be 35:1), your extracellular/intracellular calcium would be as well (optimal is around 12000:1 or 15000:1, not sure which). Since the calcium gradient in and outside of cells affect how muscles contract and expand, you may experience the effects of this with your heart, the heart being a muscle.

But your alkaline condition may be caused by something else. Not every disease is because of high acidity, although that is what we hear all the time. Balance is key, neither too acidic nor too alkaline. Yet you hear of ads selling alkaline water only, and no acidic water. You also hear of how high cholesterol or high blood sugar is bad, but low cholesterol and low blood sugar gets a pass.

Be that as it may, perhaps you can first address your alkaline condition, and your potassium deficiency, and see it that helps you condition with the kidneys and the prostate. However, don't expect it to solve your kidney and prostate issues instantly, or ever, by this alone. The condition has gone on for some time, and the body would have found its adaptation to the condition, and this adaptation would have taken root and just like the US deep state, it's not easy to tell it to go away even after the initial cause has been resolved. I think I know by now, after trying to figure out my high bp for 20 years, it all comes down to understanding how the body works, more than finding a magic bullet that will make all the bad things disappear.

Some things to read up on:

Metabolic Acidosis

This is the condition where someone is systemically too acid. The extracellular plasma fluid has a low pH wherein the H+ concentration is high and the bicarbonate level is low. Just as in metabolic

biomedx.com

Metabolic Alkalosis

In lieu of a case study, I'm just going to touch a wee bit on the topic of metabolic alkalosis. This is the condition where someone is too alkaline. Yep, too alkaline. The extra cellular space

biomedx.com

This website also explains using the breath rate as a basis for knowing your acid-base balance. It is very useful to know because I used to rely on the urine pH alone as my basis for determining my acid base balance. I was thrown off base by that myth, which is what many people use as well in this forum. I think this website's approach makes a lot more sense to me. Now I don't worry when my urine pH is acidic, as when it is, all it's saying is that the kidneys are doing their job in excreting excess acids in the system. But I'd be worried if my system is acidic, and I'm not able to excrete acids. Something then is really wrong. That seems to be your case, although you are on the alkaline side of things.

But this is only to answer your question of "what if my breath rate is 10 bpm."

So, if you want to proceed on this line, please read the articles, and if you have questions, as I expect you would. we can proceed.

Getting an accurate breath rate, a urine pH, and a saliva pH would give us a more complete picture of your acid-state balance situation, as well as help us figure out your electrolyte imbalances that are certain in your case, given your 4 year history of urination. This would definitely affect how your kidneys clears excess acids or bases. This general state of imbalance may just be the overarching problem, and not the kidneys, although typical doctors - for not being trained any better by the staid curriculum of big pharma - having the mind of technicians earning a certificate after a few powerpoint presentations - would see it as a kidney problem, and once again, lead you to another useless round of blood tests and scans and whatever sounds high-tech.

 

[Callmestar]

It's understandable as a few things would slip through. And yes, your recounting is accurate and we have ruled out the bacterial infection origin of it. The acid-base balance aspect is where we left off.


At that time, I believe we only tested the urine and not saliva, and your purported breath rate (which I don't trust) is 10 . Your urine was around 6 -6.5 (acidic- based on your faulty reading).

It's easy for a neophyte to think these results are in conflict, only because he knows not enough to interpret it. And below I attached some reading material for you to read, so we can be on the same page. And this is where the conversation was broken.


So, if you want to proceed on this line, please read the articles, and if you have questions, as I expect you would. we can proceed.

Getting an accurate breath rate, a urine pH, and a saliva pH would give us a more complete picture of your acid-state balance situation, as well as help us figure out your electrolyte imbalances that are certain in your case, given your 4 year history of urination. This would definitely affect how your kidneys clears excess acids or bases. This general state of imbalance may just be the overarching problem, and not the kidneys, although typical doctors - for not being trained any better by the staid curriculum of big pharma - having the mind of technicians earning a certificate after a few powerpoint presentations - would see it as a kidney problem, and once again, lead you to another useless round of blood tests and scans and whatever sounds high-tech.

The breath rate is 10, certainly no higher than 12. I've measured multiple times with the app and with clock watching. I know you say it doesn't work if you measure it yourself and you change your breath rate when you become aware of it. I agree, to an extent. But if anything I'd be speeding it up and I've measured multiple times and it's always 10 when resting. It would match my overall system which has always been low breath rate and low heart rate of around 50 when resting. To get to say 15 breaths per minute would feel like breathless panting to me.

My urine was a faulty reading? I measured it multiple times with multiple test strips at different times throughout the day.

I'll read the information you've linked.

 

[yerrag]

The breath rate is 10, certainly no higher than 12. I've measured multiple times with the app and with clock watching. I know you say it doesn't work if you measure it yourself and you change your breath rate when you become aware of it. I agree, to an extent. But if anything I'd be speeding it up and I've measured multiple times and it's always 10 when resting. It would match my overall system which has always been low breath rate and low heart rate of around 50 when resting. To get to say 15 breaths per minute would feel like breathless panting to me.

My urine was a faulty reading? I measured it multiple times with multiple test strips at different times throughout the day.

I'll read the information you've linked.

OK. I didn't mean urine pH to be faulty, just the breath rate. This time, take a full set-breath rate, urine pH, and saliva pH.

Taking the saliva pH is harder. So you put some spit in a spoon, dip the strip for 1 second, and then do a quick swipe against a tissue paper, and compare to the color scale.

 

[yerrag]

It's better if you take these measurements after you wake up.

 

[Callmestar]

It's understandable as a few things would slip through. And yes, your recounting is accurate and we have ruled out the bacterial infection origin of it. The acid-base balance aspect is where we left off.


At that time, I believe we only tested the urine and not saliva, and your purported breath rate (which I don't trust) is 10 . Your urine was around 6 -6.5 (acidic- based on your faulty reading).

It's easy for a neophyte to think these results are in conflict, only because he knows not enough to interpret it. And below I attached some reading material for you to read, so we can be on the same page. And this is where the conversation was broken.


So, if you want to proceed on this line, please read the articles, and if you have questions, as I expect you would. we can proceed.

Getting an accurate breath rate, a urine pH, and a saliva pH would give us a more complete picture of your acid-state balance situation, as well as help us figure out your electrolyte imbalances that are certain in your case, given your 4 year history of urination. This would definitely affect how your kidneys clears excess acids or bases. This general state of imbalance may just be the overarching problem, and not the kidneys, although typical doctors - for not being trained any better by the staid curriculum of big pharma - having the mind of technicians earning a certificate after a few powerpoint presentations - would see it as a kidney problem, and once again, lead you to another useless round of blood tests and scans and whatever sounds high-tech.

Thanks, I read the articles linked, interesting. I may be too alkaline. I was trying to find the test strips today to test saliva but couldn't find them, I will get some more. But based on my breath rate, if we are to believe it's linked to the acid/alkaline balance, then I am certainly alkaline. Unfortunately the article doesn't give much guidance on how to correct the problem. I'm not convinced it has any relation to my symptoms but certainly has to be worth exploring. Any recommendations on improving this problem?

 

[yerrag]

As you understand that the kidneys and the lungs play a big role in the regulation of acid-base balance, and that urine is excreted by the kidneys as part of its role in regulating pH, how could one imagine not knowing the state of acid-base balance in solving one's problem with excessive urination?

 

[Callmestar]

As you understand that the kidneys and the lungs play a big role in the regulation of acid-base balance, and that urine is excreted by the kidneys as part of its role in regulating pH, how could one imagine not knowing the state of acid-base balance in solving one's problem with excessive urination?

Sorry, I'm lost, from the testing it looks as though I'm alkaline and will confirm with saliva test as soon as I have more test strips. You ignored my question about how to go about improving/resolving being Alkaline?

 

[yerrag]

[/QUOTE]

I'm not convinced it has any relation to my symptoms but certainly has to be worth exploring.

Did you say this?

Watch the Karate Kid with Ralph Macchio being schooled by his Sensei. Sorry, I can't give you a magic pill.

You have to understand there is a process here.

 

[Callmestar]

[/QUOTE]
Did you say this?

Watch the Karate Kid with Ralph Macchio being schooled by his Sensei. Sorry, I can't give you a magic pill.

You have to understand there is a process here.
[/QUOTE]

Yes I said, it's 'certainly worth exploring'. Then asked for your advice on how I might go about starting this. But you refuse to answer because I said I have doubts about it being the cause of my symptoms? That's rather strange. Sorry if I offended you.
I've had multiple possible causes given by people that haven't been the cause and thought I've found a possible link and cause for my symptoms multiple times and it ends up being a dead up, so please forgive me if I'm not certain your idea is the answer before we've even started working on it.

 

[yerrag]

Yes I said, it's 'certainly worth exploring'. Then asked for your advice on how I might go about starting this. But you refuse to answer because I said I have doubts about it being the cause of my symptoms? That's rather strange. Sorry if I offended you.
I've had multiple possible causes given by people that haven't been the cause and thought I've found a possible link and cause for my symptoms multiple times and it ends up being a dead up, so please forgive me if I'm not certain your idea is the answer before we've even started working on it.

I can understand your frustration and need to get answers that assure you're not wasting your time on dead ends. That is a very common frustration, and you have been to many of them. So I can sympathize with you since I have been through that.

But you're still acting like you have with me a patient-doctor relationship, and how can I be the one with answers, and how can I be the one also to assure you that you're not heading into a dead end? All I can do is to recommend a path and a process for you to resolve the issue on your own. The right answer is really not as important as knowing the way towards getting the right answer. I'm not even physically present 24/7 as you are to know the minute details, and you are, and you've already begun the process of being your own doctor.

If you know your breathing rate (assuming you have no respiratory issues), you will know your acid-balance status. Based on that (assuming the breath rate is correct), you are alkaline. Now, you need to get your urine and saliva pH using a test strip I recommended. It's better if you take these when you wake up. You haven't provided these, and you're asking for next steps.

Here is more reading material. I don't ever consider reading and understanding acid-base balance and how the lungs and kidneys are intricately involved in it a waste of time. I can rely on simple tests to self-test without going to the doctor nor rely on health insurance to authorize these tests. I don't even rely on an expensive thyroid panel to determine if I'm hypothyroid or not. I'm a cheapskate compared to most people here, I admit, but hey, it works. I'd rather spend my resources elsewhere.

A lot of people post here without really knowing what they're talking about. They just think of taking this and taking that and really don't know why except that other people recommend them. I don't think it's right. It misleads. It doesn't help when people are here to heal and getting correct information and methods is important. People are always in a hurry to heal and they end up not healing because they don't take the time to understand what is going on inside themselves. They just hope someone has the answer that fits to a tee to themselves. It's easier to win the lotto.

 

[Callmestar]

Update: I GOT FAT!

Eating higher calories and Peat type foods has lead to an increase in weight. I hadn't noticed much change at first but I think the chocolate milk I added tipped it over the edge. I'm by no means huge but at 5'9 and nearly 14st (Currently 194lbs) that's quite heavy for me. I generally sit around 12 - 12.5st. My face remains as gaunt as before but I have gained body weight and some fat around the midsection and chest. I have reduced the chocolate milk and am trying to start some exercise / weights again gently, despite the fatigue and dehydration.

Anyway, my symptoms in terms of the dehydration remain pretty much the same. I did have some brief periods of improvement, this often happens when it's very warm / hot weather and we have some good weather in the UK for a couple of weeks but that's now disappeared. Still generally fatigued and feel depleted. Finding that my body wants to sleep more and more. Not in the day per say but when I go to sleep at night, I could easily sleep 10 / 11 hours every night, when previously I would have naturally woken up after around 8 hours.

Been taking thyroxine 50mcg a day, it's made no difference to how I feel. I'm going to switch over to cynoplus as a last try but at this point none of the thyroid meds I've taken seem to have given any tangible improvement or change in wellbeing.

My testosterone is verging on low at 10 nmol/L. It's gone from 18, to 15, to 13, now to 10, so at this point I'm even debating TRT. Although I think the gradually lowering testosterone is more likely a result of the dehydration and fatigue rather than the cause. Unfortunately, I'm unable to find the cause so everything else seems to be being impacted negatively over time.

 

[Callmestar]

Got another blood test as my testosterone seemed to be getting lower and lower. (I know I get a lot).

A common theme, test getting lower, DHEA without fail very high, why? TSH is roughly the same but also creeping up. Cholesterol is always high. Triglycerides concerningly high. I wasn't fasted for this blood test by the way.

Now considering going on TRT if I can't find any improvement soon. I was taking thyroxine but didn't feel any benefit so tapered off a few weeks ago. Awaiting some cynoplus. Still working on some things with the help of some people here in private chat but thought I'd better post this as my numbers aren't looking great.

 

[Callmestar]

Full results: