Chronic Eczema + Dry Skin. Please Help Me With My Plan

[knockinondoors]

Going to the doctor tomorrow and see what the doc has to say about my new outbreak.
Condition is getting worse while i'm trying to pack in the calories.

Taking anti-histamine to bear the night. But i don't think it's really that helpful anymore.

 

[tara]

Hi,
Sounds very frustrating. Hope you can find a solution. Wonder if there's a way to get novocaine as in your quote above.

I'm not sure if these things would have a direct or indirect effect on eczema, but I notice you are getting quite a lot of fluids and not very much salt. Are you drinking to thirst? If you are peeing frequently and/or clear, you could try reducing fluids. If not, then no need to change. Are you salting to taste/meeting any cravings for salt?

Is your OJ ripe and sweet? If it's unripe, it may have more citric acid than your body wants.
IIRC, Pina wrote that she's found her eczema much improved by omitting citrus and nightshades. I'm considering a few days off OJ to see if that's a sensitivity for me too.

If you are not getting sunlight, do you manage to get supplemental red light? If not, may be worth trying. Cells need some red light daily to keep up energy production.

I have been having eczema trouble the last year, nowhere near as ad as yours. I've found coconut oil by itself not so helpful. My current brew is a mixture of coconut oil, cocoa butter, and a little beeswax to make it stick better. Some people seem to find tallow good. Or petroleum jelly (eg vaseline).

 

[Sea]

If the skin is worsening then I think this usually indicates that you are not digesting something, and the stress hormones are increasing, at least when you are eating the offending food. I would consider replacing the sugar with honey or soda, and removing the milk for now. I would not consume any sugars after consuming the beef/lamb as these will take longer to digest. I wouldn't bother with the calcium supplement, until your condition has stabilized and you can better assess if it is helping or not. I think sometimes calcium supplements can slow digestion and this can potentially cause a problem.(I am not 100% sure about this though)

Other than antibiotics, the only thing that fully removed my dandruff/skin problems was aspirin. When I would take around 2 grams/day for 4-5 days usually my dandruff would completely disappear, but after stopping aspirin it would slowly come back. I never took aspirin for more than a week in a row so maybe a longer period would have had a more permanent effect, like minocycline did. However I don't recommend starting at a high dosage of aspirin, only slowly increasing the dosage, and spreading it out throughout the whole day, after a smaller dosage no longer produces much effect. Caffeine, niacinamide, vitamin k2, glycine, and I think just making sure to eat enough calories can prevent side effects from aspirin. At higher dosages I think it will usually increase caloric requirements.

Since you are making all of your food, it can be easy to under consume salt. Salt is very important for metabolism, and I recommend aiming for at least 5 teaspoons of salt/day. You may require more salt than this or potentially you might not need as much, but I would try a very high intake for at least a week and see if some symptoms improve.

Ray Peat summarizes hypothyroidism here, "If the basic problem in hypothyroidism is the deficient production of carbon dioxide causing excessive loss of salt and retention of water..." (http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/water.shtml)

We can combat this by eating a lot more salt than normal, and eating a lot more carbohydrates than normal, at least this is how I interpret it and how my experience has been. You might also do better with some of your carbohydrates as starch, just judge by your symptoms, as if you are digesting better the skin should be improving, and if something is worsening digestion it will show on your skin.

 

[Sea]

Since you don't have any sun I recommend this light bulb: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003P1MQDK/?tag=rapefo-20
Which you can put in a light socket like this: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0061MZ4Q6/?tag=rapefo-20 (This one kind of sucks so you might want to try a different one, just make sure it can support 250w)

You can keep this light nearby and it will work similar to the sun. I don't think it provides vitamin D, but you can get some of the metabolic benefits which were very noticeable to me when I put one over my desk.

 

[knockinondoors]

Thank you Sea and tara, I've read both of your replies and I'll need some time to digest them hence I haven't replied.

Currently I'm for sure going for several supplements
Vitamin A, E, D3, B(s)..Just haven't thought of anymore. The rationale behind these are:
Vitamin A for skin, E for oxidative stress possibly by high iron, D3 for lack of sunlight these days and lack of outdoor time, B(s) I haven't read into.

I'm adapting to the suggestion of adding salt and sugar to my OJ (i got the commercial kind..haven't got the energy to squeeze my own and i don't have those juicer). I will eventually get it though

Red Light is something I will look at. Thank you.

Keep em' coming haha.

Question for Sea:

So you think the skin and digestion is related and my eczema is probably due to digestive problems?
Similar to point views of Josh Rubin (HCL deficiency)

May you point me to some relevant articles of Ray Peat?
And I've been having several times of diarrhea since taking the anti-biotic last night (started tonight)
What do you think of that? Simply bacteria dying off?

To tara:
thanks for writing in, I'll look into those. Seems like you wrote ahead of Sea and suggested redlight and salt and look at the OJ. Thank you very much!

 

[frankfranks]

Try going heavy with high concentration topical salicylic acid. It's easy to buy 20% SA peels. The directions say to leave the stuff on only a minute and rinse it off, and to use it only once a week. But I think every other day and leave the stuff on overnight is fine, personally. It'll be obvious how much you can tolerate.

 

[johns74]

E for oxidative stress possibly by high iron

It's a blood thinner and so is aspirin.

 

[knockinondoors]

Re frankfranks and Johns74

Success #1
Thank you for writing in. I've actually went for the pledge and got myself some aspirin yesterday and I can only say it was quite helpful in the anti-inflammatory effect. I finally managed to stop some of the inflammation of the wounds (reduced edema of wounds). I'm sort of worried about the recovery of wounds will be decreased by the blood thinner (maybe) so I'm taking a low dose (also to avoid depletion of vitamin K before I can get my supplements in order)

For the first time I had enough energy to think calmy and go out and get some sun in.

I'll have to experiment more for now but I'll say the mood-calming effect must have correlation with its anti-inflammatory effect. I am much more calmer right after (maybe placebo), but I digress.

I think the critical part of this success right here also has the other part to it - the mental aspect. When you are lacking sleep and have heavy inflammation going on, none of your thinking make sense and you enter a state of learned helplessness (i knew precisely that I was in it, as I've been there many times), but taking aspirin gave me a sense of calm and helped me to regain my memory of how I did it back then (not perfect, but near perfect recovery)

So this time around, finally I have something that is ALWAYS available in the arsenal unlike before. something I can fall back on and know my mood will at least be back.

Will report back in terms of placebo effect or not.

Success #2 ? maybe
Ate a whole lot of ice cream last night just to make myself feel better. Surprisingly no diarrhea (maybe due to anti-biotic), despite bloating through the entire night. The night was the usual insomnia and itching but by day time I could finally catch some sleep. This is a plus considering even morning when cortisol goes back up I still usually struggle with sleep.

Symptom changes
Corticolsteroid has helped me these few days to deal with the stress but combining with aspirin last night alone have made some huge improvements over my skin.
Increased signs of hunger - Either due to increased sensitivity towards hunger (decreased stress hormone) or using up nutrients faster than before.

Also starting to really see I've been undereating my whole life, adding heavy lifting. No wonder my libido has been getting worse and worse when I stick to rigorous workout schedule but get way better when I don't do anything (typical holidays). Must be the under calories.

We shall see. I'm going for 100% perfect recovery and the know-hows.

 

[knockinondoors]

Quick update:
Inflammation and itching stablized after supplementing with D3 10,000 IU daily per drop supplement orally.
Anti-histamine continuing
Chronic dry skin persists
Fatigue and tiredness symptoms persist
After high sugar+milk coffee, felt really sleepy.. Probably sign of adrenaline decrease due to energy supply?

Consuming liver 3-4 times /week right now to ensure vitamin A efficiency.
NDT 1 grain only to ensure enough T3 but not boosting metabolism until nutrients are covered.
Libido = zero currently.

 

[Vita3]

Do you drink milk?

Friend of mine he gets eczema when he drinks milk. He does fine with butter and cheese thought.
You could also take a bath in epsom salt.

 

[knockinondoors]

I drink about 1 cup of milk a day mixed into coffee. When heated by coffee and sugar i seem to so fine . but i also used to not tolerate milk very well (diarrhea).maybe i should take it out

 

[Vita3]

Yes, try to avoid milk for sometime.

 

[knockinondoors]

Blood test result

Serum T4: 11.6 (ref. range 9.0-19.0 pmol/L)
TSH : 0.02 L (ref. range 0.35-4.94 mIU/L)

Please help! It's quite useless though as its the governmental screening test.

 

[Sea]

post 103064
Question for Sea:

So you think the skin and digestion is related and my eczema is probably due to digestive problems?
Similar to point views of Josh Rubin (HCL deficiency)

May you point me to some relevant articles of Ray Peat?
And I've been having several times of diarrhea since taking the anti-biotic last night (started tonight)
What do you think of that? Simply bacteria dying off?

I think that when your metabolism is still slow it is caused by not adequately digesting something which lets bacteria eat and produce toxins. When your metabolism starts to speed up deficiencies in vitamin A and in rarer cases vitamin B6 can cause it. Basically if you are bloating or having any digestive upset from a food then it is probably going to negatively affect your skin as well as energy. Diarrhea doesn't always indicate a problem with a food because a food could have given the body energy to expel some toxins, but if diarrhea is consistent with a food then that food is not digesting well enough. Ray Peat has said this about the skin and vitamin A:

"Yes, it's definitely hard to get them coordinated when there's an imbalance in one direction or the other. For several years, when I had an extremely high metabolic rate, I needed 100,000 units per day during sunny weather to prevent acne and ingrown whiskers, but when I moved to a cloudy climate, suddenly that much was too much, and suppressed my thyroid. The average person is likely to be hypothyroid, and to need only 5,000 units per day. Avoiding large amounts of carotene, and getting plenty of vitamin B12 to be able to convert any carotene that's in your food, helps to use vitamin A efficiently.

Yes, vitamin A and estrogen are antagonistic, and while estrogen promotes keratinization (shedding of skin cells), vitamin A opposes it. Since vitamin A is highly unsaturated, in excess it suppresses the thyroid, so it has to be balanced with the thyroid; the combination is effective for increasing progesterone and decreasing estrogen, slowing the turnover of skin cells, and making the skin cells function longer before flaking off. Plugged pores, combined with a local shift toward synthesizing inflammatory substances, foster bacterial infection. Bright light stimulates the production of steroids, and consumes vitamin A very quickly, but when the balance is right, the acne clears up in just a day or two. Cream, butter, eggs, and liver are good sources of vitamin A. When people supplement thyroid and eat liver once or twice a week, their acne and dandruff (and many other problems) usually clear up very quickly. It was acne and dandruff that led me into studying the steroids and thyroid, and in the process I found that they were related to constipation and food sensitivity." - Ray Peat

So since you are just starting out its unlikely to be from a vitamin A deficiency, and more likely the result of bacteria eating your food.

Diarrhea from an antibiotic is just those bacteria being killed off and a lot of toxins being quickly built up that need to be expelled. Eventually, you won't notice any symptom from the antibiotic and won't be able to distinguish even a higher dosage from a placebo. And, at this point the antibiotic will have done most of what it can in the short term and you could revisit the antibiotic in a month or 2, but you probably won't need as much after the initial bombing to maintain a clean gut and as your metabolism increases the effect will become more permanent. You can also always take days off from taking the antibiotic. If you feel low on energy you can just take some days off until you feel strong enough for another dosage. I don't think taking breaks makes much of a difference in the long term result.

 

[knockinondoors]

"When nothing seems to help, I go and look at a stonecutter hammering away at his rock perhaps a hundred times without as much as a crack showing in it. Yet at the hundred and first blow it will split in two, and I know it was not that blow that did it, but all that had gone before." by Jacob Riis

I don't know what else better describe me right now, the stonecutter hammering away like a maniac hoping something would happen?

several clues with my condition right now
1. Hives breakout from carrot salad i posted elsewhere, about a week and a bit before. I'm suspecting a gut issue
2. Another course of antibiotic showing clues - gut issue (endotoxin)? Constant diarrhea, bloating and enlarged stomach like a balloon. Passing a lot of gas and pretty much have diarrhea for the whole day especially post-meal
3. Skin stabilized in terms of inflammation (still red and dry, sign of skin aging from eczema), I was able to decrease my use of antihistamine (from uncontrollable to controllable), but still a lot of dry skin production (lowest form of skin renewal?)
4. Need to supplement K2 due to recent use of Aspirin in hope of stabalizing my condition (Don't know if it's doing ***t but only to stablize my mood sometimes and ease pain from wounds)
5. Infections under control a bit but still some skin infections
6. Almost at end of 1 week Augmentin
7. Lymphnodes enlarged about 1.5 weeks ago near groin area due to probably skin infection near my groin and inner thighs

I've been trying to drink 2 box of milk a day to ensure vitamins and calories, mixed with sugar..I drink coffee without much problem..(Yes, box milk, best I can do here)

I don't even know what to do anymore honestly. This health crap is like the worst nightmare ever.

Future direction:
1. Since Eczema is an "autoimmune" condition, according to haidut I should experiment with niacinamide to improve NAD+/NADH ratio. I did find some research on the use of niacinamide improving the dry skin barrier.
2. Endotoxin+Serotonin Paradigm - This is where I'm confused as hell..I'm on antibiotic and situation is improving (?) in terms of skin (lowered infection..lessened itchiness) but still red and dry..And digestion is going to shits? So endotoxin is too crazy right now? Once I stop antibiotic, everytime constipation ensures...Something doesn't add up here..
3. Vitamin Deficiencies - This one is a bit simpler..try experimenting with Vitamins until fixed..

I don't even know what to do anymore quite honestly.

 

[knockinondoors]

Long awaited update, finally some progress after deep soul-searching (or what I call long nights of google-ing)

Thanks to Haidut I've made aware that eczema may be an interplay between serotonin and estrogen, I've found more symptoms that correlate a lot with these two hormones.

It took some deep end-stage symptoms to realize, but basically in the end stage of my eczema, I got extreme fibrosis of the skin and extreme water retention. The fibrosis didn't really appear apparent until the water retention issue have been resolved over time (with careful attention to water/salt intake), but the estrogenic symptoms have been apparent the whole time. I suspect now that eczema is basically an interplay of hormones/signaling substance gone haywire. Usually serotonin and estrogen can be processed by your liver, but in a compromised state your liver also goes under function, allowing the signaling substance to stay too long.

I believe the liver is a key player in eczema as well, as my liver enzymes were elevated now out of the lab ranges, and I get occasional pain now that I take cyproheptadine and caffeine.

It'd probably take some nutritional care to solve my liver issue honestly, until then the hopeful balance is carefully tracking cyproheptadine, caffeine and how it affects my liver.

Cyproheptadine doesn't seem to stress my liver as much as caffeine so I might have to back down from the caffeine intake.

Hopefully I can regain optimal health soon and be back in the game of life.

 

[Orion]

post 114017 Long awaited update, finally some progress after deep soul-searching (or what I call long nights of google-ing)

Thanks to Haidut I've made aware that eczema may be an interplay between serotonin and estrogen, I've found more symptoms that correlate a lot with these two hormones.

It took some deep end-stage symptoms to realize, but basically in the end stage of my eczema, I got extreme fibrosis of the skin and extreme water retention. The fibrosis didn't really appear apparent until the water retention issue have been resolved over time (with careful attention to water/salt intake), but the estrogenic symptoms have been apparent the whole time. I suspect now that eczema is basically an interplay of hormones/signaling substance gone haywire. Usually serotonin and estrogen can be processed by your liver, but in a compromised state your liver also goes under function, allowing the signaling substance to stay too long.

I believe the liver is a key player in eczema as well, as my liver enzymes were elevated now out of the lab ranges, and I get occasional pain now that I take cyproheptadine and caffeine.

It'd probably take some nutritional care to solve my liver issue honestly, until then the hopeful balance is carefully tracking cyproheptadine, caffeine and how it affects my liver.

Cyproheptadine doesn't seem to stress my liver as much as caffeine so I might have to back down from the caffeine intake.

Hopefully I can regain optimal health soon and be back in the game of life.

I am currently in the same battle but acne. But I definitely think all these skins conditions are liver related. My latest experiment was to really increase my caffeine intake last week (from 100mg/day to 500mg/day), did it for about 3 days, acne exploded. Since my liver is not storing glycogen properly, stress response was very much increased. I see the same result from aspirin, niacinamide, methylene blue, vitamin A... these uncouplers increase your need for your liver to be able to provide glycogen, and when the liver is not doing this properly = adrenaline/cortisol/estrogen = skin issues.

I good approach might be to start low with caffeine and real liver for small amounts of K2, B vitamins. I am back to this and my skin is calming down again. Caffeine and K2 will help with getting the liver storing glycogen. Proof for me is my sleep is improving, its not perfect yet, but enough sugar storage to get me through the night. Slowly/weekly up the caffeine with meals, watch for stress response, cold hands/feet, pulse, temp. Once you can handle more caffeine, then add one uncoupler, small amounts, see how you react. I find trying them all at the same time, in my livers poor state, just doesn't work, and makes a big negative reaction.

I also take 1mg/day DHEA, 10mg/day pregnenolone and one grain NDT (down from 3) seems to have calming effect on my skin. I eat about maybe 1/2 ounce of liver per day. I am at about 3x75mg caffeine per day now and take white sugar 1 tablespoon every 30mins, when I start to get cold fingers/toes, this would be in between meals

I guess my advice is to go slowly. Everytime I have tried to throw in more uncouplers, or take things to fast, my liver 'crashes'. I suspect that my liver has been crashed for about 25yrs, so will take some time to reverse things. Also when taking lots of them, it will be hard to pinpoint if something is worsen your condition.

 

[Orion]

post 114059 Cyproheptadine

Oh forgot to mention, that Cyproheptadine give me uncoupler style reactions, although I didn't take it isolated. So am going to wait for more time with just caffeine, before I attempt it again. Hopefully you will have a better response :)

 

[ecstatichamster]

I think this is and has been a gut problem that feeds endotoxins to the liver.

I've had good results with Sacchoromyces Boulardii and soil based organisms taken with psyillium fiber at night.

It may not be Peat-like, but I think these help lower endotoxins causing skin problems.

 

[Pliskin]

Ray Peat explained that when he was hypothyroid he consumed around 9000 calories/day.

Hey Sea, Any chance you can remember where Ray said this^?