Calories vs. right foods

[marikay]

If you have to choose between getting enough calories and eating the right foods, which one would an informed peatarian choose? Thanks.

 

[Brian]

It's hard to say because other factors can drastically affect how those calories or foods are used. For example, I notice that when I am magnesium deficient (usually because of progesterone/thyroid deficiency/low intake) neither pro-metabolic foods or high calories seem to produce nearly as much energy production as when I am not deficient in those things.

So that is probably why Ray puts a lot of emphasis on supplementing thyroid and pregenolone/DHEA if necessary to get the body producing energy well again so that food, vitamins and minerals can do their work.

That being said higher calories will probably reduce stress better than pro-metabolic foods in too low of quantity in the short term. So if I'm in a situation while traveling where the available food isn't that great I don't worry about it and eat enough to satisfy my hunger.

 

[marikay]

Fantastic answer Brian. Thanks. I just had that situation today. Hungry and only a doughnut and black coffee to pick from. I choose both. But I wasn't sure if I should have waited till I could get away to a 7-11 for a large Coke. I did have the Coke after the meeting was over. I hate to admit it, but the doughnut was delicious. :)

 

[tara]

I think it depends on the quality of the food available, and your individual tolerance for hunger.

Hunger is a major stress trigger for me. Being a couple of hours late with a meal can leave me significantly dysfunctional and in pain for two - three days. Even so, I do my best to avoid high PUFA foods and aged cheeses (apparently a trigger for me). If I had to choose between a donut and no food when I really needed it, I'd probably eat the donut too. I really try to avoid that situation, and I'm getting better at it. If hunger weren't a migraine trigger for me, I might make a different choice (or maybe I wouldn't - I have a pretty strong appetite).

I guess if we can improve our glycogen storage, we will not be faced with this problem so often.

 

[marikay]

Thanks for the thoughts Tara. I am also likely to get a headache if I ignore hunger pangs. And worse for me I became quite good at ignoring hunger in my twenties and now am paying the price for it. I am trying to build a work life that allows me more control over when and what I eat, but it's tricky. I used to be able to count on finding soda (or at least milk and sugar) wherever I went, but not so much anymore. Everything is diet soda these days. Yuck.

 

[Brian]

Thanks for the thoughts Tara. I am also likely to get a headache if I ignore hunger pangs. And worse for me I became quite good at ignoring hunger in my twenties and now am paying the price for it. I am trying to build a work life that allows me more control over when and what I eat, but it's tricky. I used to be able to count on finding soda (or at least milk and sugar) wherever I went, but not so much anymore. Everything is diet soda these days. Yuck.

I ignored my hunger in my early 20's too out of convenience. Big mistake. I can definitely trace the beginning of my health decline to that decision.

If you do well on sugared milk, I would suggest freezing some in jars overnight and then taking them with you to have throughout the day. Very easy, portable, and stays cool all day. It's what I do when I go hiking or camping. I usually carry along fruit and sandwiches with low PUFA ingredients as well if I am on the go.

 

[tara]

I seldom go anywhere without fruit juice and chocolate or dried fruit.

 

[Such_Saturation]

I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

 

[Peatit]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

Isn't it a feeling induced by the harmful endorphins to keep us going to find food?

 

[CoolTweetPete]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96135/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

Isn't it a feeling induced by the harmful endorphins to keep us going to find food?

From a personal perspective I think fasting is a useful tool.

This study highlights increased neuronal autophagy expressed from short-term fasting. Andrew Kim has argued against increasing autophagy by arguing that healthy cells perform "sufficient" autophagy, but I do not understand how it would not be beneficial to cause some short term upregulation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20534972

Subjectively, I feel great benefit and very little downside from short term fasting (12-14 hours). I don't see how this would necessarily activate the stress hormones if liver glycogen storage is sufficient (eating a lot of sugar when not fasting) and the fast is not prolonged.

A good way to do this is to wake up from your 7-8 hours of sleep, and just skip breakfast. I'll have a cup of black coffee, and I pay attention to my mood. If I feel I'm falling into a stress state, I'll immediately break the fast with some OJ or milk with sugar. I have been able to effectively control weight fluctuations with this strategy.

 

[Peatit]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96136/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96135/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

Isn't it a feeling induced by the harmful endorphins to keep us going to find food?

From a personal perspective I think fasting is a useful tool.

This study highlights increased neuronal autophagy expressed from short-term fasting. Andrew Kim has argued against increasing autophagy by arguing that healthy cells perform "sufficient" autophagy, but I do not understand how it would not be beneficial to cause some short term upregulation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20534972

Subjectively, I feel great benefit and very little downside from short term fasting (12-14 hours). I don't see how this would necessarily activate the stress hormones if liver glycogen storage is sufficient (eating a lot of sugar when not fasting) and the fast is not prolonged.

A good way to do this is to wake up from your 7-8 hours of sleep, and just skip breakfast. I'll have a cup of black coffee, and I pay attention to my mood. If I feel I'm falling into a stress state, I'll immediately break the fast with some OJ or milk with sugar. I have been able to effectively control weight fluctuations with this strategy.

I used to think and feel the same but it seems overall that even with high hepatic glycogen stores, glucagon (supposed to act mainly on the liver) triggers a systemic stress response but I can't find the reference atm.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

I fast every night. Anywhere from 6.5 hours to 10 hours.

But yea I agree, I'd rather fast than make myself constipated.

 

[Such_Saturation]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96135/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

Isn't it a feeling induced by the harmful endorphins to keep us going to find food?

I mean, compared to how I used to feel while fasting.

 

[CoolTweetPete]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96154/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96135/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/95645/ I'd rather do a brief fast, usually. It feels quite clean and optimal, actually...

Isn't it a feeling induced by the harmful endorphins to keep us going to find food?

I mean, compared to how I used to feel while fasting.

Indeed.

Fasting on a Peat diet is night and day compared to the 18-24 hour hair shedding "Bulletproof" fasts I used to do.

 

[pboy]

I would starve before eating a non peat food, and risking total ostracization by the community and ray peat rescinding my PUFA free certificate