Calcirol - Liquid Vitamin D3

[haidut]

Magnesium Malate any good?

Not bad, if it does not irritate the stomach as malate salts tend to do.

 

[haidut]

Vitamin K2 is useless under the doses of vitamin D we have employed

So, what does that mean? Useless without vitamin D or useless below the doses of vitamin D used.

 

[haidut]

I have been applying 1 to 3 drops to my temples/forehead daily in the morning for about a week.

Results are no daytime sleepiness at all. No crashes after food. No fading out in the afternoon at office.

This is a major improvement and something that has never happened with my previous oral vitamin D supplementation attempts.

So, big thank you to haidut!!

Excellent, thanks for the feedback!

 

[Amazoniac]

So, what does that mean? Useless without vitamin D or useless below the doses of vitamin D used.

Useless within the range that they employ. I suspect that only mk-7 was used (not sure!), and perhaps it would change the whole story if mk-4 was used instead. It's up to the patient to use it or not.
He says that high doses of vit D have a marked action on calcium deposition but also removal from bones to the point of risking net loss. In practice he found that there are two ways to counteract the loss: brief (30 min) daily exercise, according to him, calcitonin is involved; or the classic bisphosphonates.

Regarding calcium restriction, he comments that it can vary. Some people have to adhere when doses are lower than 10000IU whereas some can handle doses up to 20000IU without needing to restrict. I believe everyone above 20000IU is advised to avoid calcium-rich foods. He claims that doses of at least 7000IU are needed to replete deficiencies in his experience.

 

[haidut]

but also removal from bones to the point of risking net loss

What is the proposed mechanism for vitamin D removing calcium from bones?? AFAIK, vitamin D is one of the few agents known to increase osteocalcin synthesis, which lowers bone resoprtion/turnover and increases osteoblast formation. So, it should have bone building effects regardless of the dose, especially when combined with vitamin K (which also raises osteocalcin).

 

[Amazoniac]

What is the proposed mechanism for vitamin D removing calcium from bones?? AFAIK, vitamin D is one of the few agents known to increase osteocalcin synthesis, which lowers bone resoprtion/turnover and increases osteoblast formation. So, it should have bone building effects regardless of the dose, especially when combined with vitamin K (which also raises osteocalcin).

Zeus, I'm not sure if he ever explained in detail why exactly, if I come across I'll let you know. But from his brief mentions, I think it's because the vit D resistance that some people experience is not generalized, the doses needed in enough amounts for a therapeutic effect can surpass those that are related to calcium regulation, so the effect on calcium deposition from those doses is so strong that the person is at risk of constantly responding to the lowered calcium with its removal from bones.

 

[haidut]

Zeus, I'm not sure if he ever explained in detail why exactly, if I come across I'll let you know. But from his brief mentions, I think it's because the vit D resistance that some people experience is not generalized, the doses needed in enough amounts for a therapeutic effect can surpass those that are related to calcium regulation, so the effect on calcium deposition from those doses is so strong that the person is at risk of constantly responding to the lowered calcium with its removal from bones.

Thanks, if you do find his explanation please send. I don't know of a mechanism by which vitamin D will increase calcium deposition so much that it would lead to leeching from the bones to deposit...again in the bones.

 

[Amazoniac]

Thanks, if you do find his explanation please send. I don't know of a mechanism by which vitamin D will increase calcium deposition so much that it would lead to leeching from the bones to deposit...again in the bones.

No, I mean, if anything, to keep blood levels in range and stable.
As a related example, he often mentions the risk of excessive PTH suppression to undetectable levels followed by hypercalcemia and kidney damage.

 

[Lee Simeon]

This has probably been asked before, but is there an upper limit to SFA esters?

 

[haidut]

This has probably been asked before, but is there an upper limit to SFA esters?

You mean upper limit of safety from administration? Studies with oral administration in humans show no toxicity until about 15g dose, which means an entire bottle of say Kuinone would have to be swallowed in one sitting. Hopefully, this is not something done by people as even the vitamin K at such dose would probably cause more issues.

 

[RobertJM]

I have been applying 1 to 3 drops to my temples/forehead daily in the morning for about a week.

Results are no daytime sleepiness at all. No crashes after food. No fading out in the afternoon at office.

This is a major improvement and something that has never happened with my previous oral vitamin D supplementation attempts.

So, big thank you to haidut!!

How are you going with this now?

 

[GAF]

I moved application to wrists because the ethanol was trying out temple area and eyelids but noticed fading out returned so went back to forehead and careful to keep application a bit higher up and benefit returned.

 

[raypeatclips]

I moved application to wrists because the ethanol was trying out temple area and eyelids but noticed fading out returned so went back to forehead and careful to keep application a bit higher up and benefit returned.

I put vitamin D on my wrists for months and noticed no change in blood levels. In an email discussion I had with Peat he mentioned that the wrists was not a good place to put vitamin D, that it was too small of an area, and suggested legs.

 

[Braveheart]

I put vitamin D on my wrists for months and noticed no change in blood levels. In an email discussion I had with Peat he mentioned that the wrists was not a good place to put vitamin D, that it was too small of an area, and suggested legs.

but his was not ethanol based

 

[raypeatclips]

but his was not ethanol based

True, maybe that is a factor, but he didn't mention any differences in oil, or ethanol to me, simply "vitamin D" I am simply relaying what he said.

"I think a large surface is needed, tops of feet, calves, and arms, for example, for vitamin D. Vitamin A needs less area."

 

[haidut]

True, maybe that is a factor, but he didn't mention any differences in oil, or ethanol to me, simply "vitamin D" I am simply relaying what he said.

"I think a large surface is needed, tops of feet, calves, and arms, for example, for vitamin D. Vitamin A needs less area."

I think shoulders and neck are also good areas. Temples are also great, as @GAF found out by himself. The temple area probably benefits the brain more than anything else but still it is a good place to try.

 

[Fractality]

I think shoulders and neck are also good areas. Temples are also great, as @GAF found out by himself. The temple area probably benefits the brain more than anything else but still it is a good place to try.

Temples are a smaller surface area than say, forearms, no?

 

[raypeatclips]

Temples are a smaller surface area than say, forearms, no?

Depends how big your head is

 

[raypeatclips]

I think shoulders and neck are also good areas. Temples are also great, as @GAF found out by himself. The temple area probably benefits the brain more than anything else but still it is a good place to try.

I usually think about how a supplement might get rubbed off. Unless I am topless I would think shoulders would get rubbed into clothing straight away. I usually put vitamins on my feet, rubbing them together, then wrapping them in plastic wrap under my socks. I have no idea if this saves any vitamins or not but it makes sense to me.

 

[haidut]

I usually think about how a supplement might get rubbed off. Unless I am topless I would think shoulders would get rubbed into clothing straight away. I usually put vitamins on my feet, rubbing them together, then wrapping them in plastic wrap under my socks. I have no idea if this saves any vitamins or not but it makes sense to me.

Our supplements usually dry off within 30sec to a minute, so if you can weight that long it should not be an issue applying to the shoulders.