Caffeine And Sweating

LUH 3417

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Hi everyone,

I started drinking more coffee and am having issues with sweating, chills, and feeling feverish. I'm a full time student and try to eat enough protein/fat/sugar but am having a hard time doing that as I have a long commute to school and long blocks of class without break. I already had sweating issues since I was a child and had surgery for it when I was a teenager. Sometimes it subsides and doesn't bother me but since I started eating more sugar and drinking more coffee its becoming more severe. I mostly sweat from my hands and feet but also my trunk and underarms. Does anyone have any advice regarding this or any experience pertaining to regulating my body temp? It's really uncomfortable to deal with especially with winter coming.

Also any advice on how to eat better while on the go all the time would help. Ideally I would love to have more time to pay attention to my diet and eat better but thats not really an option right now unfortunately. I'm hoping to spend more time reading and understanding Ray Peat's work when I am done with this semester. In the meantime I would really appreciate any advice.

I don't have any diagnosed health issues. I have struggled with depression for about 10 years (I am 25 now), and I am not trying to gain or lose any weight but I don't have much of an appetite so I imagine I am probably under-eating. At one point my doctor told me I was pre-diabetic, h/e my lab tests 6 months after that showed I was back in the normal range. I haven't had a blood test in about 2 years as I really don't like going to the doctor but I was low in zinc, Mg, and vitamin D so i supplemented with those for a while and now I am doing k2, vitamin D, vitamin A, and Mg. I also have a raw glandular supplement with kelp in it and some fillers so I've been hesitant to take that.

I'm almost positive I have some sort of metabolic issue as I oscillate between high strung, happy and super energetic, to really lethargic, unfocused, with little to no motivation to pursue anything.
I am eating: eggs cooked in butter/coconut oil, fresh fruits like kiwi, freshly squeezed orange juice, yogurt with jam, raw milk, brie cheese, lamb, bone broth, carrots, potatoes, chocolate...

My priority is stabilizing my body temp & sweating issues as it really effects my quality of life and has been an ongoing issue. Thank you :)
 

Orion

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Not having enough stored glycogen in your liver, will cause adrenaline/cortisol issues if you consume to much caffeine. Adrenaline causes cold sweaty hands and feet.

Best to start low and slow with caffeine if you run on stress hormones. Limit PUFA(close to zero as you can get), at least 100g protein, and avoiding starch and muscle meat will help as well.
 

Orion

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I started drinking more coffee and am having issues with sweating, chills, and feeling feverish.

Forgot to mention, lots of sugar and milk with coffee will protect against the blood sugar crash from caffeine depleting your liver sugar stores.
 

WestCoaster

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So you had what's called hyperhydrosis as a teenager and had surgery? What does that involve? I'm curious.

If cortisol is elevated (which could happen from too much coffee), it can suppress thyroid, which will in turn make your hands and feet cold. Now the question is, do you ever wake up in the middle of the night sweating or with cold sweats? This can be attributed to a drop or a quick drop in blood sugar. This very well could be a case of just stabilizing blood sugar. If you're undereating then most certainly the blood sugar might be chronically low which can lead to excessive sweating. Have you physically taken your body temperature both upon waking and throughout the day?

As for advice for eating on the go, your best bet might be to eat some sort of nutrient/calorie dense salty food in the morning; think pancakes, syrup, bacon, eggs, etc.. with minimal liquid. Eating on the go is tricky, especially when you plan to eat something and you either A) don't have time to eat it, or B) simply not hungry, but this is where your hunger signals come to play, but also in your case, how your body actually feels. My first piece of advice is simply, if you are not hungry, don't eat, but if you are hungry, eat. Secondly, try at all costs to eat in such a way that it prevents your blood sugar from getting too low or crashing (causing the sweating). If you've got to that point where you feel it's too low and/or the sweating is getting bad, this is where you eat somethings sugary and salty, often a cookie will do the trick. This however is a last resort as you don't want to get to that point and rely on that type of food. If you're on the go, take with you easy to pack items like beef jerky and fruit like bananas or apples. Salty and sugary, and it also might not hurt to carry a little container of milk with you.

The trick is though, you have to try eating in such a way that prevents you from getting to that point in the first place.
 

Birdie

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One helpful thing for on the go is to prep your carrots and keep them soaking in water in the fridge. Then, take a snack baggie with your serving in it. That way you can munch in the car when you aren't in a stressful part of the drive.

I usually take a container of milky coffee with me in the car. In summer, cold and in winter, hot. Bananas are off my list, but a little container of applesauce works for me. The coffee mixture (with sugar or maple syrup) really helps so that I don't get over hungry and go into craving mood or low blood sugar...

I always have a container of non-iodized salt along.
And some T3 that is cut into bits.

A container of your greek yogurt with the jam or honey might be good too.
:darts: good luck!
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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Thanks so much for your reply. I was having bouts of cold sweats at night - waking up drenched usually around 3 am every few months. Thinking back it seems as though the night sweats coincided with my starting a new diet (vegetarianism, low carb, no sugar, etc) although I could just be making connections for the sake of making connections lol.

The surgery for hyperhidrosis involved clamping or cutting off a nerve in my thoracic cavity. At the time I was just really desperate for a cure. It has not helped at all. It basically just redistributed where i sweat from without decreasing the amount of sweat.

At some point I was taking a blend of Ayurvedic herbs and not drinking any caffeine and that was the most success I've had with minimizing
the sweating. But I actually really like the mood enhancement that comes with caffeine as well as the taste/ritual of coffee drinking so I would like to be able to handle it better.

I have a digital thermometer that I have been taking my auxiliary/oral temps with. It always seems too off and too much of a discrepancy between the two for me to trust it's reliability but I'm usually around 97.9. Will try to stick to measuring my temps more often and maybe invest in an accurate thermometer.

Thanks again for the food recommendations. I really appreciate you taking the time :).

So you had what's called hyperhydrosis as a teenager and had surgery? What does that involve? I'm curious.

If cortisol is elevated (which could happen from too much coffee), it can suppress thyroid, which will in turn make your hands and feet cold. Now the question is, do you ever wake up in the middle of the night sweating or with cold sweats? This can be attributed to a drop or a quick drop in blood sugar. This very well could be a case of just stabilizing blood sugar. If you're undereating then most certainly the blood sugar might be chronically low which can lead to excessive sweating. Have you physically taken your body temperature both upon waking and throughout the day?

As for advice for eating on the go, your best bet might be to eat some sort of nutrient/calorie dense salty food in the morning; think pancakes, syrup, bacon, eggs, etc.. with minimal liquid. Eating on the go is tricky, especially when you plan to eat something and you either A) don't have time to eat it, or B) simply not hungry, but this is where your hunger signals come to play, but also in your case, how your body actually feels. My first piece of advice is simply, if you are not hungry, don't eat, but if you are hungry, eat. Secondly, try at all costs to eat in such a way that it prevents your blood sugar from getting too low or crashing (causing the sweating). If you've got to that point where you feel it's too low and/or the sweating is getting bad, this is where you eat somethings sugary and salty, often a cookie will do the trick. This however is a last resort as you don't want to get to that point and rely on that type of food. If you're on the go, take with you easy to pack items like beef jerky and fruit like bananas or apples. Salty and sugary, and it also might not hurt to carry a little container of milk with you.

The trick is though, you have to try eating in such a way that prevents you from getting to that point in the first place.
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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2,990
One helpful thing for on the go is to prep your carrots and keep them soaking in water in the fridge. Then, take a snack baggie with your serving in it. That way you can munch in the car when you aren't in a stressful part of the drive.

I usually take a container of milky coffee with me in the car. In summer, cold and in winter, hot. Bananas are off my list, but a little container of applesauce works for me. The coffee mixture (with sugar or maple syrup) really helps so that I don't get over hungry and go into craving mood or low blood sugar...

I always have a container of non-iodized salt along.
And some T3 that is cut into bits.

A container of your greek yogurt with the jam or honey might be good too.
:darts: good luck!


Thank you!! ✨
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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Not having enough stored glycogen in your liver, will cause adrenaline/cortisol issues if you consume to much caffeine. Adrenaline causes cold sweaty hands and feet.

Best to start low and slow with caffeine if you run on stress hormones. Limit PUFA(close to zero as you can get), at least 100g protein, and avoiding starch and muscle meat will help as well.

Thank you! Do you know if any other mechanism or vitamin/mineral deficiency may be coming into play?

I'm curious since I've had this condition as long as I can remember and I can't imagine having such bad glycogen storage even as a child to cause such extremes of temperature regulation.
 

Orion

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Thank you! Do you know if any other mechanism or vitamin/mineral deficiency may be coming into play?

I'm curious since I've had this condition as long as I can remember and I can't imagine having such bad glycogen storage even as a child to cause such extremes of temperature regulation.

Having cholesterol over 200 would be protective. RP has mentioned studies were people were using vitamin A from 10k to 100k IU per day, the more used the less people had any type of health issue. Vitamin A is required with cholesterol to manufacture all your protective steroids (Pregnenolone, Progesterone, DHEA...). When taking vitamin A monitor temps and pulse, in higher doses it can make you hypothyroid, start low and increase. It would be something to try.

Sugar (white, OJ, honey, fruit) will help to raise cholesterol. Sugar will also energize your liver to help convert T4 to T3, also help with liver sugar stores (glycogen), and keep insulin stable, and help to turn down stress response. Are your feet and hands cold during the day, when you are sweating?

Carrot salad away from meals, but have some sugar before hand, it can lower blood sugar. Carrot will help to remove endotoxin, which is another serious burden on the liver.

What was your diet like as a kid?
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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Having cholesterol over 200 would be protective. RP has mentioned studies were people were using vitamin A from 10k to 100k IU per day, the more used the less people had any type of health issue. Vitamin A is required with cholesterol to manufacture all your protective steroids (Pregnenolone, Progesterone, DHEA...). When taking vitamin A monitor temps and pulse, in higher doses it can make you hypothyroid, start low and increase. It would be something to try.

Sugar (white, OJ, honey, fruit) will help to raise cholesterol. Sugar will also energize your liver to help convert T4 to T3, also help with liver sugar stores (glycogen), and keep insulin stable, and help to turn down stress response. Are your feet and hands cold during the day, when you are sweating?

Carrot salad away from meals, but have some sugar before hand, it can lower blood sugar. Carrot will help to remove endotoxin, which is another serious burden on the liver.

What was your diet like as a kid?
What's funny is my cholesterol was over 200 as a kid and I remember my mom making us switch to drinking skim milk when I was about 8. I ate cereal or eggs and some breakfast meat for breakfast, a turkey tuna or pbj sandwich with some fruit for lunch, some protein starch and vegetable for dinner plus snacks cookies and processed 90s food in between.
Thank you for the info regarding vitamin a. I have started supplementing and noticed it helps my dandruff.
Yes my feet and hands are cold even though I feel like I am having a hot flash.
 

Orion

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What's funny is my cholesterol was over 200 as a kid and I remember my mom making us switch to drinking skim milk when I was about 8. I ate cereal or eggs and some breakfast meat for breakfast, a turkey tuna or pbj sandwich with some fruit for lunch, some protein starch and vegetable for dinner plus snacks cookies and processed 90s food in between.
Thank you for the info regarding vitamin a. I have started supplementing and noticed it helps my dandruff.
Yes my feet and hands are cold even though I feel like I am having a hot flash.

Muscle meat and starch are very powerful at raising insulin, much more so than sugar. This causes a stress response to stabilize blood sugar, using up glycogen in the process, to balance out the insulin. I think skim milk is ok, due to its very low PUFA content.

Hot flash with cold hands/feet definitely sounds like the stress response. As an experiment you could try a warm 1 cup of skim or low fat milk, with 2-3TBsp of honey or sugar, and pinch of canning salt. Try this every 2 hours and see how you feel. If this helps I would start using this along with avoiding excessive muscle meats, starch and PUFA.

OJ, apple juice, cooked or very ripe fruit, lots of milk, cheese, shellfish, raw carrot away from meal

Keep caffeine low until you feel warmer and are not hot flashing.
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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Muscle meat and starch are very powerful at raising insulin, much more so than sugar. This causes a stress response to stabilize blood sugar, using up glycogen in the process, to balance out the insulin. I think skim milk is ok, due to its very low PUFA content.

Hot flash with cold hands/feet definitely sounds like the stress response. As an experiment you could try a warm 1 cup of skim or low fat milk, with 2-3TBsp of honey or sugar, and pinch of canning salt. Try this every 2 hours and see how you feel. If this helps I would start using this along with avoiding excessive muscle meats, starch and PUFA.

OJ, apple juice, cooked or very ripe fruit, lots of milk, cheese, shellfish, raw carrot away from meal

Keep caffeine low until you feel warmer and are not hot flashing.


Thanks so much that is helpful advice and I really appreciate it. Just wondering what your take is on skim milk vs whole milk. I found a raw dairy farm by my house and have been getting sour cream, milk, and cheese from them and all the products are whole milk and full fat.
 

Orion

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Thanks so much that is helpful advice and I really appreciate it. Just wondering what your take is on skim milk vs whole milk. I found a raw dairy farm by my house and have been getting sour cream, milk, and cheese from them and all the products are whole milk and full fat.

I think both are great, but it depends on how much stored PUFA you have. Growing up on the North American food pyramid means you probably have lots of stored PUFA, so I would recommend only coconut oil as the fat you use, and stick with lots of skim, 0% fat cottage cheese, low fat cheeses, minimal eggs until you feel better, sleep well, warm hands/feet, good pulse. RP mentions that eating SFA and going low PUFA, it could take about 4yrs for your body to turnover/excrete the stored PUFA. If you go low very fat, this turnover can happen quicker, especially if you are already lean. Older and obese people will have to commit more time to reduce PUFA stores.

PUFA is the root problem, it blocks thyroid, vitamin A, increases effects of endotoxins, which up-regulate estrogen, then up-regulate serotonin, and in turn increases cortisol/adrenaline... and the vicious cycle continues as long as PUFA is entering your system. Animal studies and anecdotal stories show that a zero fat diet is very helpful, animals on zero fat have superior resistance to stress and are very hard to kill. Humans on zero fat have reported all health problems vanishing and having lots of energy. Just need to remember to get adequate calories from sugar and protein, milk and OJ/apple juice can do a really good job of this. Attached a daily intake for me, just need to click to fullpage and zoom in, since its length.

Full fat diary contains PUFA at around ~2% I believe, but can add up quickly if you drink lots of full fat milk and eat lots of hard cheese.

RP is ok with store bought pasteurized milks, believes they are better option then excessive muscle meats, starch or processed foods. Calcium to phosphate ratio of milk is another good booster to the metabolism as it will help keep your parathyroid and prolactin levels down, which will also help reverse the vicious cycle above.
 

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Orion

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Thanks so much that is helpful advice and I really appreciate it. Just wondering what your take is on skim milk vs whole milk. I found a raw dairy farm by my house and have been getting sour cream, milk, and cheese from them and all the products are whole milk and full fat.

Forgot to mention, salt is usually involved with excessive sweating. I would advise getting lots of salt, you could experiment up to a full Tablespoon per day, and see how you react. Start with maybe an extra teaspoon, and salt all food to taste. Have some salt/sugar/fat/protein before bed, that can help nightime adrenaline down.

Just make sure the salt is canning/pickling, no additives like Morton's.
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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Thank you. Your posts are so helpful!! I typically eat the real salt brand sea salt. Is that ok?
 

Orion

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I typically eat the real salt brand sea salt. Is that ok?

I would go for canning salt. I think the real salt brand has the brown specs in it? Could be iron, and want to avoid that. But getting extra salt in the meantime, I would use the Real brand.
 
OP
LUH 3417

LUH 3417

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You're like the female version of me :)

Eating salt to taste throughout the day helps in serotonin excretion (15g a day can be required) and also to lower adrenaline. I think the 'hyperhydrosis' is a kind of serotonin/adrenaline issue; pharmaceutically cyproheptadine has some interesting research and I;ve noticed that for myself the drugs mirtazpine (I do not recomend this) and ondasterone have stopped underarm sweating immensely

"It (cyproheptadine) can relieve SSRI-induced sexual dysfunction[20] and drug-induced hyperhidrosis (excessive sweating)" -wikipedia

Idealab's "lapodin" is helpful and I keep meaning to order it again although it did cause me some skin irritation. The improvement could be from several different actions it has like blocking certain "stress" enzymes and improving liver function and steadying oxidative metabolism.

Steroids that may help could be progesterone and androsterone. Making to sure to get enough carbohydrate and some of it as fructose seems good as blood sugar plays a role in the issue it seems. Red light is helpful for a few hours.

I am a coffee addict as well and even though it causes some negative symptoms for me it is required to get through the day. From this it seems clear that the issue has to do with adrenaline, blood sugar, overstimulating metabolism, poor liver glycogen stores. I don't have all the answers but working with the variables seems like a good place to start. It could also be somewhat rooted in psychology as I've noticed that drinking coffee when I'm at home all day vs drinking coffee while at school has a huge degree of difference, have you noticed the same?
First off first thank you so much - I'm looking forward to researching some of the things you mentioned and experimenting. As far as psychology goes I notice a definite psychological component. if I'm overwhelmed or feeling socially inept in a situation I'll start to cold sweat and get really bad muscle aches. My body is very strange. It's been a journey and I'm hoping it will lead me to some truth. I also feel like the huge differences in mymetabolism make me act like a different person depending on what I'm feeling like physiologically. and since my physical responses are kind of extreme it also translates into my thoughts being extreme. I'm trying tomake the best of it and see it as a potentially creative source if I can justsomehow tame the beast! But I reallydon't think pure science can explain it.
 
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meatbag

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First off first thank you so much - I'm looking forward to researching some of the things you mentioned and experimenting. As far as psychology goes I notice a definite psychological component. if I'm overwhelmed or feeling socially inept in a situation I'll start to cold sweat and get really bad muscle aches. My body is very strange. It's been a journey and I'm hoping it will lead me to some truth. I also feel like the huge differences in mymetabolism make me act like a different person depending on what I'm feeling like physiologically. and since my physical responses are kind of extreme it also translates into my thoughts being extreme. I'm trying tomake the best of it and see it as a potentially creative source if I can justsomehow tame the beast! But I reallydon't think pure science can explain it.

I forgot to mention that taking some baking soda a some salt can be used to stop the sweating immediately.
 

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