Brutal PFS insomnia, please help

[marcolainen]

Hi,

so a bit of backround infos first: i am 34 years old, currently 155 pounds and 6ft, rather skinny than skinny fat. I smoke and used to enjoy alcohol (wine and sometimes beer) in moderate amounts on a daily basis until all this started, i also kind of abuse weak opiates/SNRIs (Tramadol - drug of choice for that)/take them as prescribed for chronic back pain on a regular basis. I am also a medical professional but that doesn't matter.

I began visibly balding at 19 with typical recession, had strong balding genes on my father's family side, but it was a rather slow process after the initial shedding and i kept a NW3 until 30. 2.5 years ago it was getting worse and i took Finasteride 1mg for like 3 weeks. I was very busy at that time and aside from feeling a bit mellow and slight bloat in the face id didn't feel side effects. That was until a sexual encounter when i struggled to get hard and had embarassing premature ejaculation. I ditched the Fin afterwards and forgot about it.

14 months ago i was in a bad place, i had back surgery twice, probably because of abusing my body in the gym and instead of listening to the signals i just dulled the pain with opiates. Sure, i had a nice sixpack and ripped 175 pounds but i could hardly walk at that point. After the surgery and following Heparin injections my hair thinnned out diffusely like never before and i tried to save it.

I took Fin again, this time 0.25mg EOD. I also did a hormone panel before, high Total and free Test, high Estradiol, middle range DHT, high SGBH. After the initial surge of test with oily skin and high libido i began feeling like ***t, lethargic, cold all the time and unrestful sleep. Also, i realized that after 3-4 weeks of this my midsection that used to be tight got soft as was my face. I stopped the Fin again and after a couple of days i was back to my old self, at least mentally.

Last summer/autumn i tried again as i could not like myself with a shaved head/buzzcut. This time i actually took 1mg EOD together with 0.25-0.5 Arimidex to minimize feminizing effects, for 3 months. In december i stopped because i was feeling and looking horrible. After 3-4 weeks i had the crash, dreadful anxiety which i never felt before followed be severe depression. Opiates and alcohol would make me feel even worse.

Since than i recovered somewhat, i don't have anxiety anymore and the depression gave way to anhedonia. The physical changes also reversed, midsection toned down and my face is lean again.

But my problems is that i developed severe maintenance insomnia. I used to sleep 7-8 hours with really deep sleep before. Now i suddenly wake up after about 2-4 hours and cannot go back to sleep. Alcohol makes it worse, Benzos or other sleeping pills don't help, i still wake up after aprox. 3 hours, jsut groggy from the medication but still can't go back to sleep. I actually began dreading going to bed because of this.

This is really getting to me, the few nights i actually managed to sleep for 6-7 hours straight i felt good the next day. But right now i feel like a freaking zombie and don't enjoy life anymore.

I have acces to every phamaceutical in europe, i was really thinking to try a course of HCG. I browsed the other thread regarding HCG, would really apreciate if some of you who used it would describe the effects on their sleep. Also, if someone experienced the same dreadful insomnia, what is/was it that helped you the most?

Cheers

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Hi,

so a bit of backround infos first: i am 34 years old, currently 155 pounds and 6ft, rather skinny than skinny fat. I smoke and used to enjoy alcohol (wine and sometimes beer) in moderate amounts on a daily basis until all this started, i also kind of abuse weak opiates/SNRIs (Tramadol - drug of choice for that)/take them as prescribed for chronic back pain on a regular basis. I am also a medical professional but that doesn't matter.

I began visibly balding at 19 with typical recession, had strong balding genes on my father's family side, but it was a rather slow process after the initial shedding and i kept a NW3 until 30. 2.5 years ago it was getting worse and i took Finasteride 1mg for like 3 weeks. I was very busy at that time and aside from feeling a bit mellow and slight bloat in the face id didn't feel side effects. That was until a sexual encounter when i struggled to get hard and had embarassing premature ejaculation. I ditched the Fin afterwards and forgot about it.

14 months ago i was in a bad place, i had back surgery twice, probably because of abusing my body in the gym and instead of listening to the signals i just dulled the pain with opiates. Sure, i had a nice sixpack and ripped 175 pounds but i could hardly walk at that point. After the surgery and following Heparin injections my hair thinnned out diffusely like never before and i tried to save it.

I took Fin again, this time 0.25mg EOD. I also did a hormone panel before, high Total and free Test, high Estradiol, middle range DHT, high SGBH. After the initial surge of test with oily skin and high libido i began feeling like ***t, lethargic, cold all the time and unrestful sleep. Also, i realized that after 3-4 weeks of this my midsection that used to be tight got soft as was my face. I stopped the Fin again and after a couple of days i was back to my old self, at least mentally.

Last summer/autumn i tried again as i could not like myself with a shaved head/buzzcut. This time i actually took 1mg EOD together with 0.25-0.5 Arimidex to minimize feminizing effects, for 3 months. In december i stopped because i was feeling and looking horrible. After 3-4 weeks i had the crash, dreadful anxiety which i never felt before followed be severe depression. Opiates and alcohol would make me feel even worse.

Since than i recovered somewhat, i don't have anxiety anymore and the depression gave way to anhedonia. The physical changes also reversed, midsection toned down and my face is lean again.

But my problems is that i developed severe maintenance insomnia. I used to sleep 7-8 hours with really deep sleep before. Now i suddenly wake up after about 2-4 hours and cannot go back to sleep. Alcohol makes it worse, Benzos or other sleeping pills don't help, i still wake up after aprox. 3 hours, jsut groggy from the medication but still can't go back to sleep. I actually began dreading going to bed because of this.

This is really getting to me, the few nights i actually managed to sleep for 6-7 hours straight i felt good the next day. But right now i feel like a freaking zombie and don't enjoy life anymore.

I have acces to every phamaceutical in europe, i was really thinking to try a course of HCG. I browsed the other thread regarding HCG, would really apreciate if some of you who used it would describe the effects on their sleep. Also, if someone experienced the same dreadful insomnia, what is/was it that helped you the most?

Cheers

I can only relate to a couple of things and that is staying asleep has been an issue for me and alcohol makes it worse. With that being said organic white tequila has been a lifesaver giving me amazing sleep. I wont even touch any other alcohol now it makes me feel that good! One or two drinks does the trick!. On other nights gelalatin with vitamin C before bed knocks me out, with dreaming like I did as a kid, with flying and craziness! Times when i do happen to wake up now I refuel my liver stores with a big spoonful of raw honey or some sugar salt water, maybe even take a baby aspirin. Before discovering Ray Peat 4.5 years ago sleep had always been an issue, but no more!

 

[marcolainen]

Thanks you for the response.

I also forgot to mention that i did a hormone panel not long ago again, my free test dropped by 40% but is still middle range, all other parameters also dropped slightly, DHT is just about the same.

So for the last months i had the mentioned insomnia, at some point i actually ditched all the toxics in my life, nicotine, alcohol and opiates just to sleep right again. But even that after 2 weeks didn't bear results, i still got up in the middle of the night.

Still can not believe this is happening to me...

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Thanks you for the response.

I also forgot to mention that i did a hormone panel not long ago again, my free test dropped by 40% but is still middle range, all other parameters also dropped slightly, DHT is just about the same.

So for the last months i had the mentioned insomnia, at some point i actually ditched all the toxics in my life, nicotine, alcohol and opiates just to sleep right again. But even that after 2 weeks didn't bear results, i still got up in the middle of the night.

Still can not believe this is happening to me...

I have never been on any medications of any sort and it was an ongoing thing forever for me. Up until discovering Ray Peat, 4.5 years ago and applying what I had learned, I did not have any positive results either guaranteeing a way to sleep. I think in my 20's I was underweight at 106 pounds at 5'4 and probably my body got into some bad sleeping habits because of it. I find too if I rely on my tequila trick too many nights in a row the next couple of nights I am wide awake and need the help of honey, gelatin or salt water. Until you retrain yourself to sleep, like a newborn baby, you are gonna need to try some new things. Let me tell you stressing about it is gonna make it a lot worse! I would get myself upset and in a panic laying there as the the hours ticked by! It is a common problem so don't think too much past that it is a pain in the butt. Oh and one of THE best investments I made for my sleep too, for $20, is a sound machine! I put it on the "rain" setting and oh my goodness does it make me sleep better, not noticing every little sound. Turn on the bathroom fan until you can get one ?

 

[Cooper]

It is your GABA man, and it is related to neurosteroids. Melcangi proved this with studies too. Start supplementing neurosteroids. Progesterone or HCG i would say. Read about GABA and Fin.

Hopefully you don't have PFS and just NeuroS. issues, you are so so lucky. You don't even know how lucky you are :)

 

[marcolainen]

It is your GABA man, and it is related to neurosteroids. Melcangi proved this with studies too. Start supplementing neurosteroids. Progesterone or HCG i would say. Read about GABA and Fin.

Hopefully you don't have PFS and just NeuroS. issues, you are so so lucky. You don't even know how lucky you are :)

Did you experience insomnia and got better? I might still have some libido problems, anxiety but i think they are tied to the very poor sleep i'm getting...it's the first time in my life when i actually realize how important proper sleep is.

 

[Cooper]

To raise GABA: Taurine, theanine, magnesium, valerian root, bacopa, gotu kola. However im not sure if is purely a gaba issue. Research what hormone or transmitter causes bad sleep issues.

Nah personally i didn't have any sleep issues.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

SLEEP

“Good sleep requires fairly vigorous metabolism and a normal body temperature. In old age, the metabolic rate is decreased, and sleep becomes defective.” -Ray Peat I must have hit old age in my twenties, because I had terrible insomnia back then. Looking back now, and knowing more now than I...

raypeatforum.com