Broda Barnes

Discussion in 'Resources' started by ejtwofiftyfive, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. ejtwofiftyfive

    ejtwofiftyfive New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2012
    Messages:
    3
    Hi Everyone,

    First time posting here, and had a question. I recently picked up a copy of Hypothyroidism:The Unsuspected Illness by Broda Barnes since Dr. Peat mentions Broda Barnes quite a bit and it seemed like it would be an interesting read. Read through a bit of it, and got quite the shock when I reached the diet section where he recommends essentially an Atkins diet.

    What gives?
     

    Attached Files:

  2. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,443
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
    ejtwofiftyfive , welcome to the forum. I moved this over to the General Discussion section because I believe it's connected to Ray Peat.

    I have been meaning to get that book. Thanks for bringing the topic up.
     
  3. MrMoose63

    MrMoose63 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2012
    Messages:
    23
    While it does look similiar to Atkins there are some striking similiarities to Peat as well.

    Eggs
    Fruit Juice
    Protein
    Butter
    Fresh Fruit
    Coffee
    Milk
    Most items limited are starchy

    Keep in mind the context. Peat is using sugar emphasize the conversion of T4 to T3, but Broda Barnes traditionally started with Thyroid. Perhaps with this supplementation some of the other variables are less significant.

    From what I've read Peat used to eat ~50% of calories from fat(primarily saturarted), but changed to more sugar to displace additional PUFA. At the time Barnes was practicing I'm not sure that all of the information about PUFA had come to light (or that they were as prevalent in society).
     
  4. j.

    j. Guest

    I was wondering about that too. Apparently, Barnes knew about PUFA.

    This page attributes the statement above to Broda Barnes. Link
     
  5. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,443
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
    Mind=Blown. Again.

    :holysheep
     
  6. j.

    j. Guest

    I wonder what are the differences between the dietary approaches of Barnes and Peat.

    Both are in favor of saturated fats, and against polyunsaturated fats.

    Peat is in favor of a high calcium/phosphorus ratio in the diet. Did Barnes know this?

    Peat is aware that some raw vegetables are anti-thyroid. Did Barnes know this?

    Peat is aware that legumes are anti-thyroid. Did Barnes know this?

    Barnes seemingly had a different view on sugar.
     
  7. kettlebell

    kettlebell Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2012
    Messages:
    417
    Location:
    UK
    I think its just a case of Peat has taken and learned/used the good stuff from Barnes and discarded what he observed as being untrue like any good scientist.

    That is one of the things I have grown to admire about Mr Peat. It is very clear that he is a true scientist. I am certain he would change his mind on any and all of his views without a hint of hesitation if he was presented with good repeatable evidence that an idea of his is wrong.

    I still try to keep an open mind and even question Mr Peat and that causes me to learn by reading into the things he says. What makes him great is that he still continues to question everything he preaches as he is clearly constantly pouring over every bit of research he can get his hands on looking for not only evidence that supports what he says but evidence that does not. When he finds evidence that does not support his view he evidently spends a lot of time really analysing, not only the data, but the people behind the studies, and gets a good full clear picture of the evidence that only I could dream of. He then generally systematically takes that evidence apart :lol: Not because he wants or is driven to by ego, but because he is obliged to as a good scientist.

    Its a real shame that most people who call them scientists really do not deserve the title. Most are dogmatists.
     
  8. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,443
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
  9. montmorency

    montmorency Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2013
    Messages:
    255
    Location:
    Oxfordshire, UK
    It's rather interesting...that comment earlier on apparent similarity to Atkins.


    I came to Peat from a low-carb background (not specifically Atkins...I got into LC via Gary Taubes fairly comprehensive study of the history of dieting "Good Calories, Bad Calories" (aka, "The Diet Delusion").


    The way I liked to think about my approach to diet, prior to discovering Ray, was that I was simply eating "real food", and as close to what we probably or possibly evolved to eat.
    (I never referred to what I did as "paleo" though ... that's an affectation, as far as I'm concerned).


    So I ate beef, lamb (fortunately, I avoided pork as much as possible), and I loved eating meat that had bones, and I made bone broths from time to time. (I loved the fat from those animals as well).

    I quite often used coconut oil, or if not, then beef dripping or butter. Never PUFAs.

    I'd totally eliminated starches.


    So, when I came to discover Ray Peat, I actually discovered more similarities to what I was already doing than differences.

    The main difference was that I'd reduced my fruit to almost none, and I never used sugar.

    So I've added back fruit, maybe too much, and I'm not averse to the odd ice-cream, but I still try to avoid anything processed where possible.


    I've never read any Broda Barnes, but I know Ray is always talking about him, so I really would like to try to remedy my lack of Barnes knowledge.
     
  10. Jenn

    Jenn Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2013
    Messages:
    1,035
    We are how many generations away from the people Barnes was working with? People are not as healthy as people were then, the food was different too. Even in Barnes day, there were some people that thyroid didn't work for...the beginnings of the need for T3?
     
  11. jyb

    jyb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2012
    Messages:
    2,769
    Location:
    UK
    I'm in awe when I look at black in white movies. Men and women had different body proportions than they do now.
     
  12. ilovethesea

    ilovethesea Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2013
    Messages:
    727
    Like how?

    I think both sexes are way fatter now, obviously. But of the people who aren't (like say the young 20s professionals in an urban environment where I live), the biggest thing I notice is that women don't have waists anymore. They are very straight up and down even if they are skinny. I wonder if that has a hormonal reason behind it.

    I think Marilyn Monroe's figure is just about right for females.

    As for men, they seemed leaner then. Not just without pot bellies but also not so artificially jacked up from working out at the gym. That meathead look is so not attractive.
     
  13. montmorency

    montmorency Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2013
    Messages:
    255
    Location:
    Oxfordshire, UK

    I tend to agree with you, but wasn't it common for women to wear girdles back in the days you are probably referring to? (Some men too, probably :) ).

    I was looking at a group photo of my mother and her 6 siblings and their spouses recently. It would have been taken in, maybe 1956-57. Every single one of them is lean looking. They'd be in their late 20s and 30s I think. Most but not all put on a fair amount of weight in middle to old age. Some (but not all) lived or are still living to a ripe age.
     
  14. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,610
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
Loading...