Breathing Exercises Made My Hypothyroid

[Lizb]

The reason for breathing less is to retain more CO2. That's Buteyko's aim. I'm not sure if will necessarily lower BMR. Because more CO2 ensures optimal tissue oxygenation. But the one thing breathing less would do is the possibility that there will be less alveolar exhange of gases - where CO2 is released and oxygen taken in by the blood. But how are we to know that the reduced breathing rate is not enough to provide the oxygen needed for respiration? If you're at the 40-45 CP and you take your oxygen saturation values, you will see that your spO2 is high enough.

I slowly came to understand why Buteyko needs coaching to be done right. The exercises gradually increasing your control pause, as the control pause is a surrogate measure of how much CO2 the blood holds. The higher the control pause, the higher the CO2 content. We can hold our breath longer because the higher CO2 content allows more oxygen to be released to the tissues, keeping tissues well supplied with oxygen. At the same time, higher CO2 content likely puts our blood pH closer to the optimal value of 7.4. As we hold our breath longer, this pH will get more acidic (from the products of metabolism) and as this pH moves toward 7.35, the urge to breathe gets stronger until we let go. The closer to optimal our blood pH is, the longer we can hold our breath.

So, I think we can remove lack of oxygen supply as a cause for the putative hypothyroidism from practicing Buteyko.

I'll have to backread some more.

p.s. I didn't explain why coaching is needed,

With each Buteyko session, we force our blood to increase the CO2 content. CO2 increases acidity and we can't increase acidity too much beyond where it pH goes lower than 7.35. Some people may in their fervor overdo their Buteyko (the false logic of more of a good is even better). Some people take maintenance drugs (which already disturbs the electrolyte balance), or have really acidic blood, that this may cause great harm. It may disturb the way the heart muscle contracts and relaxes, and lead to an emergency situation.

Good post.

I've been trying to Buteyko for four years with instruction. I make progress and fall back. I eventually stopped as I just couldn't maintain the difficulty. I'm now in a really low cp level with a serious lung condition. Very worried.

 

[yerrag]

Good post.

I've been trying to Buteyko for four years with instruction. I make progress and fall back. I eventually stopped as I just couldn't maintain the difficulty. I'm now in a really low cp level with a serious lung condition. Very worried.

Thanks.

What condition are you in, if you don't mind?

 

[Lizb]

Thanks.

What condition are you in, if you don't mind?

Bronchiectasis and asthma

 

[yerrag]

Bronchiectasis and asthma

I imagine it makes it hard to breathe without a cough getting in the way.

Did you have asthma first before developing bronchiectasis? How did that condition develop?

 

[Bogdar]

It’s possible. Perhaps raising CO2 causes the body to compensate by dropping metabolic rate.

He (gbolduev) even predicted it would make someone hypothyroid as a compensation. Can't find back the quote right now. I know he's polemic but still some ideas were interesting

 

[Lizb]

I imagine it makes it hard to breathe without a cough getting in the way.

Did you have asthma first before developing bronchiectasis? How did that condition develop?

I don't cough much. Hardly at all. I have periods when I'm quite productive and times when I clear my throat alot. Currently, no coughing and throat clearing, well you wouldn't notice. Asthma first. At a time of severe stress and menopause.

 

[Lizb]

He (gbolduev) even predicted it would make someone hypothyroid as a compensation. Can't find back the quote right now. I know he's polemic but still some ideas were interesting

Practitioners always say that it increases metabolism (when I've asked).
Maybe enough co2 and a good ph replaces the need for a good metabolism?

 

[Bogdar]

Practitioners always say that it increases metabolism (when I've asked).
Maybe enough co2 and a good ph replaces the need for a good metabolism?

Fwiw I think it's more complex than that. As usual we're trying to say the less the better or the more the better but the truth is most probably contextual and an equilibrium. Maybe there's somewhere where too much CO2 is just too much to handle, so body compensates while still having some benefit.

Something I'm thinking about is that maybe breath and buteyko's aren't ONLY about CO2, I know for a fact that breathing with diaphragm helps blood to move in the abdomen area with all essential organs. It's just an example. We can also feel the relaxation when we take deep breaths, which I don't feel when I breathe in a bag; I think breathing well has some kinda mysterious empirical benefits that go beyond CO2...

 

[Lizb]

Fwiw I think it's more complex than that. As usual we're trying to say the less the better or the more the better but the truth is most probably contextual and an equilibrium. Maybe there's somewhere where too much CO2 is just too much to handle, so body compensates while still having some benefit.

Something I'm thinking about is that maybe breath and buteyko's aren't ONLY about CO2, I know for a fact that breathing with diaphragm helps blood to move in the abdomen area with all essential organs. It's just an example. We can also feel the relaxation when we take deep breaths, which I don't feel when I breathe in a bag; I think breathing well has some kinda mysterious empirical benefits that go beyond CO2...

Sounds entirely plausible. I embarked on Ray Peat from Buteyko feeling that there was a missing link and Ray Peat would fill it. I have had some extraordinary good days, but cannot work out how that was achieved. These were days when I was doing both Buteyko and using much of Ray's knowledge.

Unfortunately I just don't have the mental capacity to take it all in. If I did I might have been able to work it wou. - i.e. What worked on those days.

 

[yerrag]

I don't cough much. Hardly at all. I have periods when I'm quite productive and times when I clear my throat alot. Currently, no coughing any throat clearing, well you wouldn't notice. Asthma first. At a time of severe stress and menopause.

In this case, are your lungs in any way obstructed to get optimal alveolar exchange of gases, where CO2 is released and oxygen absorbed?

 

[Lizb]

In this case, are your lungs in any way obstructed to get optimal alveolar exchange of gases, where CO2 is released and oxygen absorbed?

The bronchiectasis means the alveolar are distended and compromised so will not function normally, at the base of the lungs. Is that what you mean?

 

[yerrag]

The bronchiectasis means the alveolar are distended and compromised so will not function normally, at the base of the lungs. Is that what you mean?

I see. And yes. That does make it hard to get your lungs to work optimally. That makes it difficult for you.

What are your thoughts as to whether Buteyko would still help you nonetheless?

 

[Tristan Loscha]

Bronchiectasis and asthma

For both is Vitamin D as D3 reccomended.
5000IU and up to 10000IU are reported safe for long term consumption.

 

[Lizb]

For both is Vitamin D as D3 reccomended.
5000IU and up to 10000IU are reported safe for long term consumption.

I'm taking d3/k2 combination - the d3 is working out at 3000 a day. I should up it then.

 

[Lizb]

I see. And yes. That does make it hard to get your lungs to work optimally. That makes it difficult for you.

What are your thoughts as to whether Buteyko would still help you nonetheless?

I'm trying at the moment. Going for a gentle approach. The last company of practioners I used followed the classical method which is quite 'violent'. I spoke to this company this week. They said don't let cp go down below 20 and MPs must be at least 80. I tried and managed but I just can't sustain it.

I can get my numbers up. For example after a walk I can have a cp of 43-70. However it falls away quickly. Hot. flushes and associated adrenaline don't help.

I have at times been able to get a morning cp of 40! But now unfortunately 10-18!

 

[Tristan Loscha]

I'm taking d3/k2 combination - the d3 is working out at 3000 a day. I should up it then.

I believe so.2x5000IU/d.
I took 4000IU for a long time,testing now 10000IU.

 

[Lizb]

I believe so.2x5000IU/d.
I took 4000IU for a long time,testing now 10000IU.

Do you have asthma and bronchiectasis?
Did you notice a difference?

 

[yerrag]

I'm trying at the moment. Going for a gentle approach. The last company of practioners I used followed the classical method which is quite 'violent'. I spoke to this company this week. They said don't let cp go down below 20 and MPs must be at least 80. I tried and managed but I just can't sustain it.

I can get my numbers up. For example after a walk I can have a cp of 43-70. However it falls away quickly. Hot. flushes and associated adrenaline don't help.

I have at times been able to get a morning cp of 40! But now unfortunately 10-18!

Are you aware that there are other ways that can improve your cp without practicing Buteyko? Buteyko is just one way, and other ways can complement your practice of Buteyko. If your lactic acid is high, you can take thiamine to lower it. This lowers your acidity. While this is a band-aid, another way is to improve your glucose metabolism to an optimal level where plenty of carbon dioxide is produced as an end product.

What you want to achieve is to have optimal blood/ecf pH and at the same time contain plenty of CO2 in your blood. The more CO2 in your blood, the less other metabolic acids such as lactic acid and keto acid, as well as acids such as sulfuric acid and hydrochloric acid. But you have to have optimal metabolism to produce less lactic acid and keto acids, and you should be able to minimize external acidic loads outside of what you need for nutrition. Too much lean meat contain plenty of cysteine that breaks down into sulfates, for example, which forms sulfuric acid. Taking supplements such as magnesium chloride provide the chloride that turns into hydrochloric acid.

When your body's metabolism produce plenty of CO2 and its processes produce less acidic metabolites, CO2, in the form of carbonic acid will be a major factor in providing the acidic component that pulls the pH from alkaline (higher than pH 7.4) into its optimal pH of 7.4. When the pH is closer to optimal, there's less need to exhale CO2 (to lower acidity) and so you naturally don't have to breathe at a high rate. And when there is plenty of CO2 in blood, tissue oxygenation is enhanced. Your CP will naturally be at a high value, since it takes longer for your blood acidity to increase to the point when the body will want to breathe. If this isn't clear, compare your blood pH at 7.4 (optimal) and your body pH at 7.38 (sub-optimal). If pH 7.35 is the trigger to induce the breathing reflex, it's easy to see that it will take longer to reach the trigger when you're at the optimal state.

Minimize fatty acid oxidation. Minimize glycolysis. Maximize oxidative respiration, where glucose metabolism goes past glycolysis, into the Krebs Cycle, into the ETC involving the mitochondria.

Also take in a balance of foods where the acidic load is balanced by the alkaline load. Meat alone without fruits and green leaves, for example, would produce a net acidic load. Having adequate electrolyte minerals sodium (salt), calcium (milk and green leaves), potassium (fruits, and magnesium (green leaves) would go a long way in balancing the acidic intakes of protein from meat.

Moreover, this state means that the kidneys don't have to keep working to excrete acidic waste from the body. I think this also preserves the kidneys and allows it to have a longer service life.

 

[Coderr]

Does drinking sparkling water help increase cp?

 

[yerrag]

Does drinking sparkling water help increase cp?

Not sure, but possible. When you make sparkling water using cold water, you'll be amazed that a lot of CO2 gets dissolved into the water.