Boron—Essential To Ray Peat Health?

yourke

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Boron supplementation markedly elevated the serum concentrations of 17 beta-estradiol and testosterone; the elevation seemed more marked when dietary magnesium was low.
FASEB J. 1987 Nov;1(5):394-7.
Effect of dietary boron on mineral, estrogen, and testosterone metabolism in postmenopausal women.
Nielsen FH1, Hunt CD, Mullen LM, Hunt JR.
 
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Queequeg

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The question is whether or not the good effects of boron outweigh its estrogenic effects. I add about a 1/4 tspn of borax to my drinking water to detox flouride. I wonder if there is a better way to detox
 

BibleBeliever

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Boron DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements

According to this link boron is needed when manganese levels are in excess. Boron apparently lowers excessive manganese.
Manganese is very estrogenic.
So it is quite possible that the estrogen rise is from its lowering effect of manganese.
Excess of manganese is associated with hypothyroidism.
Women tend to have more much manganese than men, which makes sense since they have much more estrogen. Interestingly hypothyroidism is also more common amongst women. (is excessive manganese a major culprit?)

On anabolicmen they speculate that is only causes an estrogen rise in women and a testosterone rise in men.

If calcium, vitamin d, k2 and magnesium appear to give negative effects, perhaps boron is needed.
A manganese-rich diet increases the need for boron; so lots of strong coffee(high in manganese), bananas, potatoes, many fruits; herbs (cloves has an insane amount), garlic and a non-ending list of manganese rich foods.

Raisins and beets are good food sources of boron.
 

sileindigo

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I am considering supplementing boron. I know there are divided opinions on it here but the conclusion I've come to thus far is that it would probably be something we'd be getting more of from veggies grown in optimal soil. And I don't eat a lot of vegtables, and doubt they are grown in optimal soil. A lot of the benefits sound very interesting espeically in terms of bone/ teeth health. I'm interested to hear anyone elses experiences with boron supplementing?
 

Rand56

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The question is whether or not the good effects of boron outweigh its estrogenic effects. I add about a 1/4 tspn of borax to my drinking water to detox flouride. I wonder if there is a better way to detox

Are you still doing this amount of borax, and were/are you doing that amount daily? I remember awhile back I was doing 1/8th of a teaspoon 5 days a week, and got a decent libido boost. I got away from taking it, after Haidut said it was highly estrogenic. Started taking it again a few days ago, but staying low with it, just a pinch.
 

LeeLemonoil

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Nothing Boring About Boron

"Nothing Boring About Boron"


seems to be a worthwhile overview/read on boron's purported health-effects:
"The trace mineral boron is a micronutrient with diverse and vitally important roles in metabolism that render it necessary for plant, animal, and human health, and, possibly, as recent research suggests, for the evolution of life on Earth. The current review focuses primarily on boron’s most salient effects on human health, including its impact on bone development and regeneration, wound healing, the production and metabolism of sex steroids and vitamin D, and the absorption and use of calcium and magnesium. In addition, boron has anti-inflammatory effects that can help alleviate arthritis and improve brain function and has demonstrated such significant anticancer effects that boronated compounds are now being used in the treatment of several types of cancer. A summary of the evidence suggesting that boron should be given consideration as an essential micronutrient is provided, together with leading dietary sources and intake recommendations."
 

schultz

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This study might shed some light how Boron is achieving some of its effects.

Up-regulatory impact of boron on vitamin D function -- does it reflect inhibition of 24-hydroxylase? - PubMed - NCBI

"Clinical studies also suggest that nutritional boron can up-regulate 17beta-estradiol levels in women, including postmenopausal women receiving hormone replacement therapy. The catabolism of this hormone is achieved by microsomal enzymes catalyzing vicinal hydroxylations -- a description that also applies to 24-hydroxylase. This suggests the more general hypothesis that nutritional boron can inhibit a range of microsomal enzymes which insert hydroxyl groups vicinal to existing hydroxyls in steroids -- including the enzymes which catabolize estradiol and 25-hydroxyvitamin D."


Inhibiting the enzyme which catabolizes estradiol seems like a bad thing. As for the effect on bone, it seems that just taking adequate vitamin D will accomplish the same thing.

I am suspicious of its anti-inflammatory effect. I suspect it may be suppressing the immune system. Does anybody know how it is achieving its anti-inflammatory action?
 

achillea

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Boron also has a half life of 21 hours and for parathyroid function it is essential. It easily washes out of soil, thus why it is in Turkey and the Mojave Desert. Same toxicity as salt. very influential in Mg and Ca . Those countries with low boron have huge problem with arthritis
. Jorge Flechas MD on Boron
 

BibleBeliever

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Are you still doing this amount of borax, and were/are you doing that amount daily? I remember awhile back I was doing 1/8th of a teaspoon 5 days a week, and got a decent libido boost. I got away from taking it, after Haidut said it was highly estrogenic. Started taking it again a few days ago, but staying low with it, just a pinch.
Yeah, but the article he linked also showed that it boosted testosterone, seeming to indicate that is boosts hormone production; thus taking it with anti-estrogens would combat it. Vitamin b1 is anti-estrogen, gelatin is anti-estrogen, many others too.

Then there are one's like this:
Comparative effects of daily and weekly boron supplementation on plasma steroid hormones and proinflammatory cytokines. - PubMed - NCBI

"he mean plasma free testosterone increased and the mean plasma estradiol decreased significantly. Dihydrotestosterone, cortisol and vitamin D was elevated."

It antagonizes manganese as well, which is estrogenic.

Borax has 11% boron by weight. So 100 mg has 11mg of boron; most pills have 3mg. Probably wouldn't go over 100 mg of borax, which is 1/50th a teaspoon.

Boron is found in water, some waters have 1.4mg per liter.
 

BibleBeliever

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According to acu-cell copper is a boron synergist. They also state that copper is estrogenic. So I wonder if boron has estrogenic effects it is due to increasing copper.
Boron DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements

According to this video posted above at 31:45 boron helps increase DHT and convert estrogen to the weakest of forms:


Borax has a very high ph, 9.3
Sometimes I will try a couple pinches of that too. I've had it give a strong desire to work out and deepen the voice quite a bit.
The other day I did this and had about 10 ml of apple cider vinegar with it (to help counter the high ph of borax), honey and salt(since acv lowers blood sugar and salt)
I had about 5mg of b6 and hydroxyb12 earlier too.
That night when I went to sleep I produced the most heat in a long time. It took me 3 hours to fall asleep. It did not feel adrenaline based, it was very calming, my mind felt great peace/euphoric.
Everywhere in my body was very warm to the touch. My forehead, my neck, my legs, my hands sweating, my feet. I had the window open and it was about -1 out. I just had endless energy and endless heat, it felt incredible, like a mini-oven.
So based on this I assume it caused incredible thyroid stimulation.
 

Amazoniac

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Zeus said:
Boron is HIGHLY estrogenic. The bodybuilding community was crazy about it in the 1990s, but then they found out first hand that it raises estrogen (I think all 3 types) and dumped it. Boron has similar effects to cadmium, nickel, cobalt, etc and they are all estrogenic and carcinogenic in higher doses.
Peat is right that unless you are deficient you'd better not mess with it. See below for a study in men.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02785299

"...Supplementation with 10 mg B/d for 4 wk resulted in 84% of the supplemented dose being recovered in the urine. Plasma estradiol concentrations increased significantly as a result of supplementation (51.9±21.4 to 73.9±22.2 pmol/L;p<0.004) and there was a trend for plasma testosterone levels to be increased. However, there was no difference in plasma lipids or the oxidizability of low-density lipoprotein Our studies suggest that the absorption efficiency of B is very high and estimation of the urinary B concentration may provide a useful reflection of B intake. In addition, the elevation of endogenous estrogen as a result of supplementation suggests a protective role for B in atherosclerosis."
The boron content of selected foods and the estimation of its daily intake among free-living subjects
About 1 mg of boron for every 100 g of dates. It isn't difficult to reach those 10 mg a day, although in foods it would be more balanced.
 

michael94

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amazoniac if you had to guess how many studies/research papers do you think you have linked on this forum total?

hmm interesting that animal products have very little boron
 

michael94

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According to acu-cell copper is a boron synergist. They also state that copper is estrogenic. So I wonder if boron has estrogenic effects it is due to increasing copper.
Boron DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements

According to this video posted above at 31:45 boron helps increase DHT and convert estrogen to the weakest of forms:


Borax has a very high ph, 9.3
Sometimes I will try a couple pinches of that too. I've had it give a strong desire to work out and deepen the voice quite a bit.
The other day I did this and had about 10 ml of apple cider vinegar with it (to help counter the high ph of borax), honey and salt(since acv lowers blood sugar and salt)
I had about 5mg of b6 and hydroxyb12 earlier too.
That night when I went to sleep I produced the most heat in a long time. It took me 3 hours to fall asleep. It did not feel adrenaline based, it was very calming, my mind felt great peace/euphoric.
Everywhere in my body was very warm to the touch. My forehead, my neck, my legs, my hands sweating, my feet. I had the window open and it was about -1 out. I just had endless energy and endless heat, it felt incredible, like a mini-oven.
So based on this I assume it caused incredible thyroid stimulation.

borax already has sodium btw, just no chloride

interesting experience, i like to put borax in an enema with baking soda and msm 1:1:1 ratio

I havent taken borax orally since I was really sick like 2 years ago. lets get to the bottom of the best ways to take this stuff. Were off to a good start with yours and amzoniacs post
 

Amazoniac

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Boron supplementation markedly elevated the serum concentrations of 17 beta-estradiol and testosterone; the elevation seemed more marked when dietary magnesium was low.
FASEB J. 1987 Nov;1(5):394-7.
Effect of dietary boron on mineral, estrogen, and testosterone metabolism in postmenopausal women.
Nielsen FH1, Hunt CD, Mullen LM, Hunt JR.
https://pubag.nal.usda.gov/pubag/downloadPDF.xhtml?id=47755&content=PDF#page=3 (table 3)
With just 3 mg/d of supplemental boron (sodium Borat) the increase in circulating estrogen is impressive.

1 g of aluminium daily for 24 days, then repeat the process for another 24 days. Nice.
 

Glassy

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https://pubag.nal.usda.gov/pubag/downloadPDF.xhtml?id=47755&content=PDF#page=3 (table 3)
With just 3 mg/d of supplemental boron (sodium Borat) the increase in circulating estrogen is impressive.

1 g of aluminium daily for 24 days, then repeat the process for another 24 days. Nice.

It kinda matches the impressive increase in testosterone. Just what every post menapausal woman wants.

1g of aluminium a day? Damn.

I’ve read that boron is supposed to help with retaining Ca & Mg in the right place but I can’t help wonder if they’re basing these assertions off sketchy studies like this.
 

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