Benificial To Take T3 / T4 Combo When Pulse Is Low (60bpm)

[thms]

Hey all,

Been trying to raise my pulse and body temperature for about a year now and got it from 48 bpm to 60 bpm

mainly by adding fruit to my diet and not drinking too much water or cold liquids , stopped working out daily, cut back to 2-3 times/week

i eat daily potatoes, white rice, melons, cherries, egg yolks, eggshell calcium, cod, red meat, beef liver, rice cakes, oj not too much because it bloats me a LOT, ) this is all i eat. no cheating or anything

been reading a lot that a "optimal" pulse should be around 80 - 85

any tips to get it higher? Been thinking about adding thyroid but dont know where to start at what dosages.

any help is welcome thank you all again.

THMS

 

[DaveFoster]

Ray Peat, PhD on Thyroid, Temperature, Pulse, and TSH – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

"A therapeutic trial was the final test of the validity of the diagnosis: If the patient’s symptoms disappeared as his temperature and pulse rate and food intake were normalized, the diagnostic hypothesis was confirmed. It was common to begin therapy with one or two grains of thyroid, and to adjust the dose according to the patient’s response. Whatever objective indicator was used, whether it was basal metabolic rate, or serum cholesterol, or core temperature, or reflex relaxation rate, a simple chart would graphically indicate the rate of recovery toward normal health.”

Personally, I can only tolerate specific, minuscule increments of T4. Anything more than a 0.005 mcg increase every day, and I begin to experience the adrenaline sensitization that Dr. Peat mentions. Even 0.01 mcg increased daily results in a dramatic and uncomfortable increase in pulse. I'm writing more about the topic in my book, Aspirin: More Than Just a Painkiller.

 

[thms]

Ray Peat, PhD on Thyroid, Temperature, Pulse, and TSH – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

"A therapeutic trial was the final test of the validity of the diagnosis: If the patient’s symptoms disappeared as his temperature and pulse rate and food intake were normalized, the diagnostic hypothesis was confirmed. It was common to begin therapy with one or two grains of thyroid, and to adjust the dose according to the patient’s response. Whatever objective indicator was used, whether it was basal metabolic rate, or serum cholesterol, or core temperature, or reflex relaxation rate, a simple chart would graphically indicate the rate of recovery toward normal health.”

Personally, I can only tolerate specific, minuscule increments of T4. Anything more than a 0.005 mcg increase every day, and I begin to experience the adrenaline sensitization that Dr. Peat mentions. Even 0.01 mcg increased daily results in a dramatic and uncomfortable increase in pulse. I'm writing more about the topic in my book, Aspirin: More Than Just a Painkiller.

thank you

do you feel like there are better / other ways to raise pulse/warmth for me? supplements or other foods? or would patience alone be enough?

 

[DaveFoster]

thank you

do you feel like there are better / other ways to raise pulse/warmth for me? supplements or other foods? or would patience alone be enough?

Patience without action will accomplish little. Although necessary, a good diet often remains insufficient. Supplements, if selected for quality and effectiveness can support the thyroid and often assist supplemented thyroid hormone in its regulation of metabolism, but relying on supplements misses the point of Dr. Peat's work.

 

[thms]

can someone help me out on dosages?

 

[Jsaute21]

can someone help me out on dosages?

Dosing with thyroid sucks, no way Around it. I recommend looking into pregnenolone and potentially t3 and starting conservatively with both.

However, your diet looks great and you seem to be making progress. I would say you are on the right track but to be mindful and listen to your body more closely. Do you feel happy, how is sex drive, motivation etc...your pulse will probably be at 70 or so before you know it.

 

[ddjd]

Try protein. A steak would really raise it

 

[thms]

Try protein. A steak would really raise it

from what ive read , beef shuts off the thyroid gland?

 

[thms]

Dosing with thyroid sucks, no way Around it. I recommend looking into pregnenolone and potentially t3 and starting conservatively with both.

However, your diet looks great and you seem to be making progress. I would say you are on the right track but to be mindful and listen to your body more closely. Do you feel happy, how is sex drive, motivation etc...your pulse will probably be at 70 or so before you know it.

sex drive is ok, motivation could be a bit better, happy not really but not really depressed or anything.

i feel that dropping down to 2-3 workouts a week have made a great diffrence in sexdrive though..

my next goal is to improve my hair, i am getting a little widows peak , seems to be getting worse when consuming a lot of dairy and sugar?

 

[Jsaute21]

from what ive read , beef shuts off the thyroid gland?[/QUOTE

Remember it is better to be a mile deep and in inch wide, than a mile wide and an inch deep. Becoming neurotic about food will be the worst thing for your metabolism. Beef is a very nutritious food that when over consumed and combined with a lack of milk protein in the diet, can often lead to an abundance of iron or histamine. Absolutely nothing wrong with beef. In fact, it is a micronutrient dense food and a great source of protein.

 

[thms]

thank you for this good piece of information,
i dont take in any milk protein whatsoever....

is this negatively impacting me? i feel when i take in milk cheese from either cows or goats i get bloated,. lethargic and itchy schalp

 

[Jsaute21]

thank you for this good piece of information,
i dont take in any milk protein whatsoever....

is this negatively impacting me? i feel when i take in milk cheese from either cows or goats i get bloated,. lethargic and itchy schalp

You know far more about your body than i do. Eat what you crave, while adhering to the importance of micronutrients, adequate carbohydrate & adequate protein. There are very healthy people that eat a lot of meat and not a lot of dairy, as well as vice versa. In order to heal yourself, you are going to have to discover what your body responds best to, while not looking for others to give you the exact protocol of what works. It is a hard concept to grasp, especially when in a state of low metabolism. (I have been there and behaved the same way so do not take this as me being harsh.)

As helpful as this forum is, sometimes getting off of it can be the best thing you can do. Do not take in an excess of information unless you are in a state of mind to properly use it.

 

[paymanz]

Its good if you check your thyroid hormones level.

On raypeat site there is a article where he suggest a starting dose of thyroid.

Thyroid: Therapies, Confusion, and Fraud

an effective way to use supplements is to take a combination T4-T3 dose, e.g., 40 mcg of T4 and 10 mcg of T3 once a day, and to use a few mcg of T3 at other times in the day. Keeping a 14-day chart of pulse rate and temperature allows you to see whether the dose is producing the desired response. If the figures aren't increasing at all after a few days, the dose can be increased, until a gradual daily increment can be seen, moving toward the goal at the rate of about 1/14 per day

Its start point, then you realize how your body reacts to it.

I personally sometimes take a break from t4 and just take t3 , depending on how I feel. Like 25-75mcg a day.

But be careful until you find out how you react.start low dose.specially with t4 ,as it has longer half life.

 

[mayweatherking]

I highly, highly, highly, definitely recommend buying the course from benedicte. She's linked from raypeat.com in his links section.

Actually im telling you, buy it before you start doing thyroid. Because she has a very through chapter on thyroid dosing and talks about all the popular brands and their ratios amd explains every thing you meed to know about t3 and t4.

Trust me, you keed to buy this. Look how many posts i have and how lojg I've been a member here. BUY IT.

anyway, the reason t4 can be bad is because if you are in a stressed state, your body cant covert t4 to t3, so some people will grt a bad reaction because they are making no t3. This is why peat recommends micro dosing of t3, using preg, aspirij, frequent eating, to keep the body metabolism high so t3 can continued to be made. And the body expects a certain ratio too.

This is not something to mess around with my friend uninformed. You need to understand ratios and dosing. Buy her course.

 

[bodacious]

Personally, I can only tolerate specific, minuscule increments of T4. Anything more than a 0.005 mcg increase every day, and I begin to experience the adrenaline sensitization that Dr. Peat mentions. Even 0.01 mcg increased daily results in a dramatic and uncomfortable increase in pulse. I'm writing more about the topic in my book, Aspirin: More Than Just a Painkiller.

I get high adrenaline symptoms after taking ~3mcg of Cynomel. Any info on how I could better approach this?

 

[DaveFoster]

I get high adrenaline symptoms after taking ~3mcg of Cynomel. Any info on how I could better approach this?

Did you not read the post you quoted?

 

[bodacious]

Did you not read the post you quoted?

I did.

All of the info I've read implies that one must start very small and increase the dose gradually until the temps normalise.

This is the same as the Wilson protocol (Free eBook - A Reversible Low Temperature Problem - Wilson's Syndrome)

But I'm not sure what is the sensible thing to do when even the smallest practical dose seems to cause high adrenaline symptoms in me (lower temp, anxious, flushed look).

Can you point me in the direction of more info on that specifically?

 

[DaveFoster]

I did.

All of the info I've read implies that one must start very small and increase the dose gradually until the temps normalise.

This is the same as the Wilson protocol (Free eBook - A Reversible Low Temperature Problem - Wilson's Syndrome)

But I'm not sure what is the sensible thing to do when even the smallest practical dose seems to cause high adrenaline symptoms in me (lower temp, anxious, flushed look).

Can you point me in the direction of more info on that specifically?

I've come across a few comments here and there, but there's this site that offers an analogy, and some tidbits of helpful information:

ThyroPhoenix - Adjusting Doses - Body adjusts to thyroid hormone

I get liquid synthetic T3 and synthetic T4 (as in haidut's Tyromix or BSP's T3 and T4), and I dilute them in another dropper bottle, so I fill the second empty bottle with some solvent (DMSO, ethanol, or water), and I put a single drop of T3 and drop of T4 (or a drop of a pre-mixed combination of the two) in the new solvent, so it's a 1/1200th dilution (say in a 60 mL bottle with 1200 drops).

Depending on the concentration of the original T3 and T4 solution, you could add another drop of the original solution to the diluted solution daily, or every two or three days, or even every several days if you find you still have adrenergic symptoms.

Regularly measuring your pulse and using a BP monitor can be helpful, and the beta-blocker propranolol can bring you heart rate down if it gets above 120, as can raw cabbage juice or propylthiouracil.