Baking Soda Is Helping Me So Much - Looking To Clarify A Few Things

Birdie

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Doesn't Peat question the use of vinegar except for small amounts for flavoring?
 

skycop00

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Just a heads up, I’d try to increase stomach acid before a meal, rather than fix the post meal reflux.

So taurine, enzymes, ACV with or without freshly squeezed lemon... will all increase stomach acid which may change your life
Bitters work extremely well with the innate system!
 

skycop00

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I should maybe mention I am a 28-year-old female in case that's relevant. My skin is still clearing up, on my face, shoulders, even places where I don't get clogged pores it's just getting really extra clear, and I have no eczema on my hands as I'm usually prone. I've never ever had anything work to help my skin like this. My hand joints also look healthy, a lot of times they look swollen.

@tara @yerrag Urinary pH seems like something good to be aware of. I have had a UTI before and it's not fun, and from my understanding acidic pH is part of how they're prevented. If I get any symptoms of anything like that I will be honest about that.

@EIRE24 I'm not really being that precise about when I dose. Definitely once in the morning before I eat. Then I just try to space the other two doses at least four or so hours apart.
Adding in some B5 may help as well. I use it with my Cystic Acne folks with great success. Thins the sebum, and with bodybuilders it really works wonders!
 

yerrag

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Urinary pH seems like something good to be aware of. I have had a UTI before and it's not fun, and from my understanding acidic pH is part of how they're prevented. If I get any symptoms of anything like that I will be honest about that.

How does acidic pH prevent UTI?

I don't think acidic pH prevents UTI as much as it indicates the absence of a bacteria (in a form of UTI) that breaks down urea into ammonia, which causes the urine to be alkaline.

I find that when I drink a lot of fruit juice, my urine pH ends up being alkaline as well. But I don't think this makes me more susceptible to UTI on account of the higher pH reading.
 

artist

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@artist Here's a thread on sodium acetate that could shed more light on your experience: Has Anyone Tried Sodium Acetate ? (for SIBO?)
Thanks. someone referenced Nathan's protocol vaguely on here and it was one of the things that inspired me to try this idea, glad to have the source material now. I wonder what gave him the idea in the first place but I don't know if the answer will be worth the $30 for his book

Does baking soda contain aluminum tho?
you're thinking of baking powder

Adding in some B5 may help as well. I use it with my Cystic Acne folks with great success. Thins the sebum, and with bodybuilders it really works wonders!
I already get b5 most days from an energy drink I favor but that is good to know. I don't get cystic acne myself (unless I eat soy or certain forms of dairy), it's just all-over congested, dull, textured skin.

I'm still going strong by the way. Yesterday I used fragranced hair product with no reaction, drank wine and felt fine, had milky coffee, no immediately apparent reaction. I do think the milk (and/or wine?) made me feel a little more groggy and blah for a bit this morning but nothing serious, no full-blown reactions, and my skin's still getting better by the day. I probably should try not to get crazy with my diet (eating the riskiest things that I know I usually react to) until I can run an elimination diet in the new paradigm (of not having SIBO or not lacking sodium or whatever is happening.) I'm a little dazed by the whole thing. Scared to get attached to not being sick and also having some survivor's guilt at the prospect. I also feel so different psychologically that it's a little disorienting and scary because I am not used to not being anxious and depressed lol
 

artist

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How does acidic pH prevent UTI?

I don't think acidic pH prevents UTI as much as it indicates the absence of a bacteria (in a form of UTI) that breaks down urea into ammonia, which causes the urine to be alkaline.

I find that when I drink a lot of fruit juice, my urine pH ends up being alkaline as well. But I don't think this makes me more susceptible to UTI on account of the higher pH reading.

You may be right! A person’s diet, acidity of urine may affect susceptibility to UTIs | The Source | Washington University in St. Louis

"Conventional wisdom in medicine favors the idea that acidic urine is better for restricting bacterial growth. But their results were surprising because samples that were less acidic, closer to the neutral pH of pure water, showed higher activity of the protein siderocalin and were better at restricting bacterial growth than the more acidic samples."

I had been going off that conventional wisdom but this article is the first thing that came up when I Googled UTI and pH. More food for thought.
 

tara

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Do you have references as to how they arrive at these values?
Not really. There's a thread on RBTI and Reams, but it doesn't go into that level of detail. I think he found that range to be empirically useful, as well as having his own chemical explanations for it. For people battling cancer, I think he tended to favour the higher end of the range. He had a detailed understanding of chemistry, biochemistry, horticulture, soil, etc. I think he said it was the range needed for healing to take place (along with the other parameters he measured). Some people need support to bring it more acid, some to more alkaline, depending on their state. I think he said it tends to reflect the extra-cellular pH. Peat has talked about intra- and extra-cellular pH being different. I don't see why UpH would be the same as intracellular pH. But I still struggle with this area.

People who don't eat enough of the alkalinising foods might be likely to run too acid, and need to modify diet to get it more alkaline. I don't think either Reams or Peat would endorse some of the common lists of alkaline/acid foods, or the commonly published recommendations about alkaline UpH. I think they would have agree about some ideas and disagreed about others, more generally. Reams tended to generally favour vegetarian diets, but not he same one for everyone.

I think I've come across some ideas from other people, too, about contexts where it can be useful to briefly push a bit more in one direction or the other away from the usual optimal range for a particular purpose - eg for a short -term fight against pathogens. (I keep forgetting which way they say to go against viruses/bacteria/fungus/cancer etc.) People have used baking soda as part of some such schemes.

These are things I've read about somewhat superficially, not studied deeply or tested out thoroughly, so don't take me as an expert. Intuitively, I'm inclined to be going with Peat and Reams on that UpH range at this stage, though those short term interventions interest me too.

Admittedly, the world is not going to be filled with people who can practice caution. There are many gotchas to deal with. It is always necessary to keep reminding people to be careful. People should really not touch baking soda by themselves, if they can help it. But they can't help it. There are no doctors out there who understand the use of baking soda, and so one is left with two choices: self-experiment with baking soda, or just stay away from baking soda.
This is why I think it's good to have some DIY way of checking whether one is getting too far out of range pH-wise, and not going over the top, especially longer term.
 

tara

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I have had a UTI before and it's not fun, and from my understanding acidic pH is part of how they're prevented.
I've had them too. Never want another one! I'd not heard that acid UpH prevents. urinary alkalinisers are often used as part of treatment. Cranberry juice can apparently be helpful (I've heard it's served in some elder care facilities fr this reason, and it seemed to work for me.) Others have recommended lemon juice. Some here swear by D-mannose.

Does baking soda contain aluminum tho?
Baking powder apparently often does. Baking soda ought to be pstraight sodium bicarbonate. Baking powder is a mixture of
 

artist

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I've had them too. Never want another one! I'd not heard that acid UpH prevents. urinary alkalinisers are often used as part of treatment. Cranberry juice can apparently be helpful (I've heard it's served in some elder care facilities fr this reason, and it seemed to work for me.) Others have recommended lemon juice. Some here swear by D-mannose.
You may be right! A person’s diet, acidity of urine may affect susceptibility to UTIs | The Source | Washington University in St. Louis

"Conventional wisdom in medicine favors the idea that acidic urine is better for restricting bacterial growth. But their results were surprising because samples that were less acidic, closer to the neutral pH of pure water, showed higher activity of the protein siderocalin and were better at restricting bacterial growth than the more acidic samples."

I had been going off that conventional wisdom but this article is the first thing that came up when I Googled UTI and pH. More food for thought.
 

Evandrojr

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Hi @artist , have you come around to trying baking soda with water (no vinegar?). The reason I ask is that I started using baking soda with water upon waking and clearly see benefits, however it feels counterintuitive because I normally wake up craving acids... however, I am somewhat afraid of chugging 2 Tsp of vinegar on an empty stomach because I have a history of real bad gastritis. So I’d love to hear your experience and if you’ve seen differences in benefits of the baking soda between with and without the vinegar. Thanks!!!

Thanks. someone referenced Nathan's protocol vaguely on here and it was one of the things that inspired me to try this idea, glad to have the source material now. I wonder what gave him the idea in the first place but I don't know if the answer will be worth the $30 for his book


you're thinking of baking powder


I already get b5 most days from an energy drink I favor but that is good to know. I don't get cystic acne myself (unless I eat soy or certain forms of dairy), it's just all-over congested, dull, textured skin.

I'm still going strong by the way. Yesterday I used fragranced hair product with no reaction, drank wine and felt fine, had milky coffee, no immediately apparent reaction. I do think the milk (and/or wine?) made me feel a little more groggy and blah for a bit this morning but nothing serious, no full-blown reactions, and my skin's still getting better by the day. I probably should try not to get crazy with my diet (eating the riskiest things that I know I usually react to) until I can run an elimination diet in the new paradigm (of not having SIBO or not lacking sodium or whatever is happening.) I'm a little dazed by the whole thing. Scared to get attached to not being sick and also having some survivor's guilt at the prospect. I also feel so different psychologically that it's a little disorienting and scary because I am not used to not being anxious and depressed lol
Hi
 

managing

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Hi @artist , have you come around to trying baking soda with water (no vinegar?). The reason I ask is that I started using baking soda with water upon waking and clearly see benefits, however it feels counterintuitive because I normally wake up craving acids... however, I am somewhat afraid of chugging 2 Tsp of vinegar on an empty stomach because I have a history of real bad gastritis. So I’d love to hear your experience and if you’ve seen differences in benefits of the baking soda between with and without the vinegar. Thanks!!!


Hi
I just started baking soda (1/2 t) with ACV (1 T). If you get the proportions right, it is a weak base after it reacts, not acidic. Just combine them and wait 5 minutes (probably 30 seconds is enough though).

Its made a HUGE difference to me. Its only been a week but its dramatically reduced my asthma/allergy symptoms. It gave me mild flu symptoms for a few days and has sped up transit time while overall reducing bloating and gas.
 

Evandrojr

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@managing , many thanks for sharing your experience. I’m still in doubt though, why do you think having the baking soda with an acid is superior to having it with just water? According to the research that Haidut recently posted on the benefits of sodium bicarbonate as an anti-inflammatory substance, the subjects were ingesting it with water only, that’s why I ask.

I just started baking soda (1/2 t) with ACV (1 T). If you get the proportions right, it is a weak base after it reacts, not acidic. Just combine them and wait 5 minutes (probably 30 seconds is enough though).

Its made a HUGE difference to me. Its only been a week but its dramatically reduced my asthma/allergy symptoms. It gave me mild flu symptoms for a few days and has sped up transit time while overall reducing bloating and gas.
 

managing

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@managing , many thanks for sharing your experience. I’m still in doubt though, why do you think having the baking soda with an acid is superior to having it with just water? According to the research that Haidut recently posted on the benefits of sodium bicarbonate as an anti-inflammatory substance, the subjects were ingesting it with water only, that’s why I ask.
Its a good question.

I've done both. I am sure the effects are somewhat different. When reacted with ACV you are primarily getting sodium acetate.

I would say that baking soda in water only affects my respiration more. And with ACV affects my digestion (and other mucous membranes) more.
 

Ras

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artist
Have you tried the baking soda without vinegar? Are you still experiencing benefits from this therapy?
 

artist

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artist
Have you tried the baking soda without vinegar? Are you still experiencing benefits from this therapy?
(Tagging @Evandrojr as well)
I haven't tried the baking soda by itself as I want enough time to observe before changing things around. I had a hiccup caused by various life circumstances, including being too excited to eat/expose myself to every single thing Im usually sensitive to and eventually tipping the scales back to inflammation (dumb), as well as (Sry tmi) constipation seemingly induced by this protocol. I always get this issue from anything that has an antibiotic effect for some reason. In this case I considered that maybe it's partly induced by increased usage of magnesium as I have heard sodium can have that effect, so I increased magnesium and that pretty much squared that away. Still I have a ways to go to figure out a new equilibrium with the baking soda+vinegar in the mix so that transit time doesn't slow down too much. I'm curious if this problem is just my own as I see @managing saw digestion speed up instead. The positive effects on my joints and skin are holding the most steady but my skin did get worse for a bit while the constipation was at its worst, and it's getting back to being glowy and nice again now. Will let you all know in another few weeks if I'm still getting good effects.
 
Last edited:

Ras

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(Tagging @Evandrojr as well)
I haven't tried the baking soda by itself as I want enough time to observe before changing things around. I had a hiccup caused by various life circumstances, including being too excited to eat/expose myself to every single thing Im usually sensitive to and eventually tipping the scales back to inflammation (dumb), as well as (Sry tmi) constipation seemingly induced by this protocol. I always get this issue from anything that has an antibiotic effect for some reason. In this case I considered that maybe it's partly induced by increased usage of magnesium as I have heard sodium can have that effect, so I increased magnesium and that pretty much squared that away. Still I have a ways to go to figure out a new equilibrium with the baking soda+vinegar in the mix so that transit time doesn't slow down too much. I'm curious if this problem is just my own as I see @managing saw digestion speed up instead. The positive effects on my joints and skin are holding the most steady but my skin did get worse for a bit while the constipation was at its worst, and it's getting back to being glowy and nice again now. Will let you all know in another few weeks if I'm still getting good effects.
Thanks for the update.
 

Evandrojr

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Hi @artist , on the “tmi front”, I have struggled with constipation my entire life and to be honest I’m still trying to figure out some parts of puzzle. However, there a few things that I have learned through extensive experimentation, and one of them is that when I have too much acid in my diet (normally OJ, but sometimes I experimented with ACV, as well as pineapple, kiwis, etc), the following day I’ll be constipated for sure.

Talking to a good friend who’s a gastroenterologist, he says that the colon needs to be at a certain PH to function properly, and it is obviously a lot less acidic than the stomach (I don’t really remember, but I think colon needs to be around 6.8, which would be considered slightly acidic I guess since it’s a notch less than 7). So if we introduce to much acid in the diet, be it citric, acetic, or even hydrochloric, there’s a risk of us creating an “acidic colon”, which could really halt peristalsis.

I suppose there might be a similar risk of the colon being to alkaline, which I would speculate is why sometimes when people have acidic foods (such as OJ for example), it will trigger a bowel movement. So I suppose there’s a certain balance here that we need to find, in terms of PH, for the colon to function properly (along with good thyroid function and all of that, but I’ll assume that’s a given for us here in the forum).

I have noticed that even with coffee. Too much coffee always contributes to constipatipn for me, but when I switched to darker roasts (less acidic), I saw a big improvement. When I have too much dairy on the other hand, that also contributes to constipatipn but that probably from the alkalinozing properties of calcium (big guess here), and on these days I’ll crave more acid.

What I am suggesting is that it is not necessarily the baking soda that is contributing to your constipation, but maybe the ACV?

(Tagging @Evandrojr as well)
I haven't tried the baking soda by itself as I want enough time to observe before changing things around. I had a hiccup caused by various life circumstances, including being too excited to eat/expose myself to every single thing Im usually sensitive to and eventually tipping the scales back to inflammation (dumb), as well as (Sry tmi) constipation seemingly induced by this protocol. I always get this issue from anything that has an antibiotic effect for some reason. In this case I considered that maybe it's partly induced by increased usage of magnesium as I have heard sodium can have that effect, so I increased magnesium and that pretty much squared that away. Still I have a ways to go to figure out a new equilibrium with the baking soda+vinegar in the mix so that transit time doesn't slow down too much. I'm curious if this problem is just my own as I see @managing saw digestion speed up instead. The positive effects on my joints and skin are holding the most steady but my skin did get worse for a bit while the constipation was at its worst, and it's getting back to being glowy and nice again now. Will let you all know in another few weeks if I'm still getting good effects.
 

JohnA

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Mark Sircus's book "Sodium Bicarbonate: Nature's Unique First Aid Remedy" gives a solid explanation for why baking soda works. https://www.amazon.com/Sodium-Bicarbonate-Natures-Unique-Remedy/dp/075700394X

Two key quotes from the book: 1) "Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) immediately reacts when it mixes with stomach acid. NaHCO3 + HCl → NaCl + H20 + CO2. That is: Sodium bicarbonate + stomach acid yields salt + water + carbon dioxide." 2) "According to Henderson, carbon dioxide exerts at least three well-defined influences: 1.It is one of the prime factors in the acid-base balance of the blood. 2.It is the principal control of respiration. 3.It exerts an essential tonic influence upon the heart and peripheral circulation."
 

Evandrojr

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Mark Sircus's book "Sodium Bicarbonate: Nature's Unique First Aid Remedy" gives a solid explanation for why baking soda works. https://www.amazon.com/Sodium-Bicarbonate-Natures-Unique-Remedy/dp/075700394X

Two key quotes from the book: 1) "Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) immediately reacts when it mixes with stomach acid. NaHCO3 + HCl → NaCl + H20 + CO2. That is: Sodium bicarbonate + stomach acid yields salt + water + carbon dioxide." 2) "According to Henderson, carbon dioxide exerts at least three well-defined influences: 1.It is one of the prime factors in the acid-base balance of the blood. 2.It is the principal control of respiration. 3.It exerts an essential tonic influence upon the heart and peripheral circulation."

Tbh, I have trouble understanding how the Carbon Dioxide resulting from the reaction in the stomach would enter the bloodstream or have any systemic effect on metabolism. Don’t we just burp it out?
 
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