Bad Jaw Pain For Days

[MyUsernameHere]

As the title states. For the past few days I've been dealing with this. I think I just woke up with it one day, as if someone had given me a good left hook when I was sleeping.

I can't bite down hard on anything, moving my jaw in any significant capacity causes this. Pain is particularly bad and constant if I hang my head back (looking up at the ceiling). The joint doesn't seem loose or dislocated, just painful on movement. It was really bad the first 2 days, now it seems maybe 5% improved but still painful. It happened about 3-4 days before I had a short fever, not sure if it is related or not. Doesn't respond to any supplements (whether taking or not taking them) or red light.

And it happens only on the right side, absolutely no pain on the left side.

I'm beginning to get worried that I might have to get X-Rays or something, cause I dunno WTF's going on and it's not getting much better.

Ideas?

 

[S-VV]

Are you taking or have taken bisphosphonates?

 

[MyUsernameHere]

Are you taking or have taken bisphosphonates?

Definitely not though I have been on tamoxifen 6 weeks ago for about 2 weeks.

 

[mostlylurking]

As the title states. For the past few days I've been dealing with this. I think I just woke up with it one day, as if someone had given me a good left hook when I was sleeping.

I can't bite down hard on anything, moving my jaw in any significant capacity causes this. Pain is particularly bad and constant if I hang my head back (looking up at the ceiling). The joint doesn't seem loose or dislocated, just painful on movement. It was really bad the first 2 days, now it seems maybe 5% improved but still painful. It happened about 3-4 days before I had a short fever, not sure if it is related or not. Doesn't respond to any supplements (whether taking or not taking them) or red light.

And it happens only on the right side, absolutely no pain on the left side.

I'm beginning to get worried that I might have to get X-Rays or something, cause I dunno WTF's going on and it's not getting much better.

Ideas?

Do you have a good dentist? I used to have bouts of this problem about 25 years ago. My dentist, who had his mastery in dentistry, would stand behind me while I sat in the dental exam chair, and take my lower jaw with his hands and "chatter"/jiggle my jaw up and back to reset my bite. It seemed to help, but it did not cure the problem.

My TMJ (bruxism) problem (this is what I think you are describing) disappeared about 6 years ago when I found Ray Peat and did these things: cleaned up my diet, doubled my thyroid medication, started taking a fairly large dose of progesterone to address my estrogen dominance problem. Sorry I can't pinpoint what cured me any better than that. I haven't had any issues with the jaw in 6 years.

Don't let them talk you into surgery. Mine went away on its own. TMJ surgery is a really big business. I had a friend who went through hell with jaw surgery and braces for this problem; they never could undo the damage they did to him. He died at 35.

The Ray Peat email exchange Ray Peat Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki yielded this:

Bruxism / Restless leg syndrome​

I think it's caused by irritation and inflammation in the intestine, increasing serotonin. Starches and fibers support bacterial growth and can increase serotonin. Restless leg syndrome is another night-time reaction to bacterial overgrowth..

 

[MyUsernameHere]

Do you have a good dentist? I used to have bouts of this problem about 25 years ago. My dentist, who had his mastery in dentistry, would stand behind me while I sat in the dental exam chair, and take my lower jaw with his hands and "chatter"/jiggle my jaw up and back to reset my bite. It seemed to help, but it did not cure the problem.

My TMJ (bruxism) problem (this is what I think you are describing) disappeared about 6 years ago when I found Ray Peat and did these things: cleaned up my diet, doubled my thyroid medication, started taking a fairly large dose of progesterone to address my estrogen dominance problem. Sorry I can't pinpoint what cured me any better than that. I haven't had any issues with the jaw in 6 years.

Admittedly I don't go to the dentist very often since my teeth are mostly fine and don't cause me any noticeable issues. Is it possible I developed a cavity without knowing, if that makes sense? I have no dental pain of any kind.

I definitely do have an estrogen dominance problem right now so that could contribute, but then I've had for a while and this just appeared literally overnight...

Don't let them talk you into surgery. Mine went away on its own. TMJ surgery is a really big business. I had a friend who went through hell with jaw surgery and braces for this problem; they never could undo the damage they did to him. He died at 35.

The Ray Peat email exchange Ray Peat Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki yielded this:

Bruxism / Restless leg syndrome​

I think it's caused by irritation and inflammation in the intestine, increasing serotonin. Starches and fibers support bacterial growth and can increase serotonin. Restless leg syndrome is another night-time reaction to bacterial overgrowth..

Dear God, I can't even believe that. Terribly sorry to hear about your friend - honestly I avoid interaction with doctors like the plague, sometimes they seem more like butchers.

I don't think this is in the realm of surgery... it seems more acute, like there is inflammation in the joint rather than it needing anatomical correction. I think you're in the ballpark though, estrogen, irritated gut. I have big estrogen problems and my gut is bloated most of the time, I've added the carrot salad recently and have been taking monolaurin against bacteria, but can't quantify if it's doing much. The fact that I took tamoxifen which is anti-estrogen (bad for joints) doesn't help here.

 

[mostlylurking]

I don't think this is in the realm of surgery... it seems more acute, like there is inflammation in the joint rather than it needing anatomical correction. I think you're in the ballpark though, estrogen, irritated gut. I have big estrogen problems and my gut is bloated most of the time, I've added the carrot salad recently and have been taking monolaurin against bacteria, but can't quantify if it's doing much. The fact that I took tamoxifen which is anti-estrogen (bad for joints) doesn't help here.

Mine was acute. Then went away. Then acute again. The most memorable was when I was cutting fabric with a rotary cutter on a 36" high table one day, leaned over a little to cut, and my jaw locked down with my mouth closed. It stayed that way for hours, I could not open my mouth. That was the worst. It was only on the right side. Then, like magic, it went away, like someone turned a key to the right spot and I could eat food again.

I do think that Dr. Peat is right, this is related to endotoxin/gut inflammation. I'd focus on that first. I've moved on to eating lots and lots of cooked mushrooms. I seem to do better on them than the carrot salad. I have had a history of leaky gut and multiple food allergies. I'm better now but my gut is very delicate and I have to be careful what I eat. I cut out all complex carbs and high fiber foods except for the carrot salad and the cooked mushrooms. I'm very sensitive to serotonin; that may play a part in the jaw symptom too.

 

[mostlylurking]

The fact that I took tamoxifen which is anti-estrogen (bad for joints) doesn't help here.

I don't understand what you are saying in this sentence. Are you saying Tamoxifen is anti-estrogen so it is bad for joints?