Aspirin as effective as pharma blood thinners

haidut

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The study only looked at patients hospitalized for bone fractures, but I don't see why the results would be any different for any other condition and in any other setting (hospitalized or not). This probably at least the 10th study I have seen over the last few years demonstrating that humble (and dirt-cheap) aspirin was only only "non-inferior" to the supper expensive pharma blood thinners, it is much less risky too. Maybe, as the article itself states, FDA will finally start paying attention to these findings and start recommending aspirin as the default drug of choice for all clot-prone patients, unless there is serious evidence (e.g. severe allergy to aspirin) demanding another treatment.

Aspirin as Effective as Blood Thinner Injections to Prevent Deadly Complications in Patients Hospitalized with Bone Fractures
Aspirin as effective as blood thinner injections to prevent deadly complications in patients hospitalized with bone fractures: Multi-center trial of more than 12,000 orthopedic trauma patients likely to change standard of care

"...The study enrolled 12,211 patients with leg or arm fractures that necessitated surgery or pelvic fractures regardless of the treatment. Half were randomly assigned to receive 30 mg. of injectable low molecular-weight heparin twice daily. The other half received 81 mg. of aspirin twice daily. Patients were followed for 90 days to measure health outcomes from the two treatments. The main finding of the study was that aspirin was "non-inferior," or no worse than low molecular-weight heparin in preventing death from any cause -- 47 patients in the aspirin group died, compared with 45 patients in the heparin group. For other important complications, the researchers also found no differences between the two groups in clots in the lungs (pulmonary embolisms). The incidence of bleeding complications, infection, wound problems, and other adverse events from the treatments was also similar in both groups. Of all the outcomes studied, the only potential difference noted was in blood clots in the legs, called deep vein thrombosis. This condition was relatively uncommon in both groups as it occurred in 2.5 percent of patients in the aspirin group, and in 1.7 percent of patients in the heparin group. "This relatively small difference was driven by clots lower in the leg, which are thought to be of less clinical significance and often do not require treatment," said study co-principal investigator Deborah Stein, MD, MPH, Professor of Surgery at UMSOM and Director of Adult Critical Care Services at UMMC."
 

CrystalClear

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Hi Haidut, thanks for your OP.

In 2018 I ended up with a couple of partial blood clots in my lower leg. (Superficial venous thrombosis in the calf). After the ultrasound results, Dr said yep just some asprin until it all goes away. So I did that with some vitamin E.

Very unfortunately, the issue arose again at the beginning of 2020. It was just at the time that I fully realised that what Dr Peat said about staying off Gluten, he wasn't joking. I had realised how much it was affecting my liver. I don't think gluten and the blood clots are related? but not long after I had pain in my lower leg again. The ultrasound found a full clot from my knee to my ankle!

I had heard Dr Peat talk about heparin and wasn't adverse to its use and that (I think) he said it was being studied for cancer treatment?

Dr. put me on a six week treatment but that was no where near long enough. So I went on to aspirin with vitamin E. Vitamin E was just as good as aspirin a lot of the times. The main thing I got from the Dr. was I had to get the inflammation down. So I decided to start taking aspirin according to the recommended dosage on the packet. These were the 300mg tablets that dissovled in water. I took 2 every four hours and made sure everything was calm at bedtime. I really needed to use water therapy too between times for the pain. I either ran cold water down my leg or warm water when showering. Made a big difference. I did this for weeks.

Just as the one leg was starting to recover the other leg started clotting in the same area. Which I cannot explain. So I just did the aspirin routine. It's been over two years without any more issues. I did have a little bit of bleeding inside but only for a day. But Dr freaked because my iron/ blood tests showed big drops. Wanted me to see a specialist who I spoke to on the phone (covid era). Told me low iron can be associated with clots like mine.

I am a post menopausal female. I'd been suffering from a long standing tiredness and my iron results were usually on the low side. I knew I had hypothyroidism but because iron supplementation isn't a big thing with Dr Peat I didn't look at that as being my issue. Just so happens it was my big issue. So I supplement iron every day. I eat plenty of meat and I have worked on healing my gut over the last two years.

I have had VERY dry flaky skin on my lower legs and feet that I recently concluded iron helps improve.

( I admire and respect Dr Peat so much and he always answered my emails. I am so sad due to his loss. I will always be thankful to him for what I learnt about health and nutrition. I was able to build a solid foundation of nutritional knowledge thanks to him. RIP)
 

Warrior

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Serrapeptase is an effective blood thinner.

Way too effective in some cases if the dose is too big and over a sustained period as the blood simply will not clot quickly from a paper cut, for example, and led to them having to use a liquid plaster and staying very still to allow the skin to seal. The person in question did comment on how they were stunned at the viscosity of their blood though so it shows it does what it says on the tin. They also reported lots of improvement in mobility and a general drop in inflammation with commensurate increase in well-being so its an approach worth considering.
 

lamassu

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A good blood thinner should have an agent to readily reverse its effects as well. Does aspirin have such an antidote? Vitamin K?
 
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A pharmaceutical blood thinner is as effective as a pharmaceutical blood thinner, imagine that.
 

bloooeh

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The study only looked at patients hospitalized for bone fractures, but I don't see why the results would be any different for any other condition and in any other setting (hospitalized or not). This probably at least the 10th study I have seen over the last few years demonstrating that humble (and dirt-cheap) aspirin was only only "non-inferior" to the supper expensive pharma blood thinners, it is much less risky too. Maybe, as the article itself states, FDA will finally start paying attention to these findings and start recommending aspirin as the default drug of choice for all clot-prone patients, unless there is serious evidence (e.g. severe allergy to aspirin) demanding another treatment.

Aspirin as Effective as Blood Thinner Injections to Prevent Deadly Complications in Patients Hospitalized with Bone Fractures
Aspirin as effective as blood thinner injections to prevent deadly complications in patients hospitalized with bone fractures: Multi-center trial of more than 12,000 orthopedic trauma patients likely to change standard of care

"...The study enrolled 12,211 patients with leg or arm fractures that necessitated surgery or pelvic fractures regardless of the treatment. Half were randomly assigned to receive 30 mg. of injectable low molecular-weight heparin twice daily. The other half received 81 mg. of aspirin twice daily. Patients were followed for 90 days to measure health outcomes from the two treatments. The main finding of the study was that aspirin was "non-inferior," or no worse than low molecular-weight heparin in preventing death from any cause -- 47 patients in the aspirin group died, compared with 45 patients in the heparin group. For other important complications, the researchers also found no differences between the two groups in clots in the lungs (pulmonary embolisms). The incidence of bleeding complications, infection, wound problems, and other adverse events from the treatments was also similar in both groups. Of all the outcomes studied, the only potential difference noted was in blood clots in the legs, called deep vein thrombosis. This condition was relatively uncommon in both groups as it occurred in 2.5 percent of patients in the aspirin group, and in 1.7 percent of patients in the heparin group. "This relatively small difference was driven by clots lower in the leg, which are thought to be of less clinical significance and often do not require treatment," said study co-principal investigator Deborah Stein, MD, MPH, Professor of Surgery at UMSOM and Director of Adult Critical Care Services at UMMC."
Heparin via IV is normally given when you come in hospital with a DVT or PE to dissolve clots. But who likes giving heparin injections to themselves everyday at home when you can take aspirin... I think higher dose of aspirin should be taken though for preventative purposes instead of the 81 mg.
 

A-Tim

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Heparin via IV is normally given when you come in hospital with a DVT or PE to dissolve clots. But who likes giving heparin injections to themselves everyday at home when you can take aspirin... I think higher dose of aspirin should be taken though for preventative purposes instead of the 81 mg.
I remember Haidut suggesting that lower doses of aspirin have a greater blood thinning effect than higher doses (counter-intuitively). When asked why he thought that, if I recall correctly, he said he was just reporting what he'd read in some studies. I think many of the studies suggesting aspirin as a preventative used a baby aspirin, and that seemed quite effective. In general, minimum effective dose is a good strategy.
 

bloooeh

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I did see that and baby aspirin is better than nothing but I was speaking about people that have had DVT or PE. Maybe a full tablet of 325mg?. In my observation there are pts that have been on baby aspirin for awhile that come in the hospital with stroke and PE (pulmonary embolism)... Dosage maybe individually based imo... I take a full tablet but I also take K2 MK4.
 

CrystalClear

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There may be the underlying causes as in my cause iron was too low. A small amount of aspirin and K2 didn't put a dint in the big clot in my leg (2nd time) as I was taking them from the first time I had partial clots. I use iron supplements now and only use aspirin when I feel any twinges in my leg - in which case I know iron has been dropping. Aspirin is good for thinning but it opposes iron and causes leakage from capillaries. I developed a whole lot around feet and ankles while dissolving the clot.
 

pubh12

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There may be the underlying causes as in my cause iron was too low. A small amount of aspirin and K2 didn't put a dint in the big clot in my leg (2nd time) as I was taking them from the first time I had partial clots. I use iron supplements now and only use aspirin when I feel any twinges in my leg - in which case I know iron has been dropping. Aspirin is good for thinning but it opposes iron and causes leakage from capillaries. I developed a whole lot around feet and ankles while dissolving the clot.
What dose of aspirin were you taking for the second time?
 

CrystalClear

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What dose of aspirin were you taking for the second time?
Doctor recommended a half dose but I ended up taking the dosage stated on the packaging - 2 tablets every four hours. I thought if that is the safe dosage I will do it until I get relief and the clot dissolves. It did cause a little bleeding in the stomach and my iron dropped very low.
 

pubh12

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Doctor recommended a half dose but I ended up taking the dosage stated on the packaging - 2 tablets every four hours. I thought if that is the safe dosage I will do it until I get relief and the clot dissolves. It did cause a little bleeding in the stomach and my iron dropped very low.
Ah I misunderstood. I thought you were saying that two tabs every four hours didn’t work to dissolve it.
 
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I doubt when doctors prescribe blood thinners they consider other factors, like blood type and diet. An “O” blood type already has thinner than other blood types. Because I am that type I have to be careful about taking aspirin and ingesting other blood thinning foods and substances like vitamin E, foods high in vitamin E and alcohol, prescribing me a blood thinner would probably give me a stroke. On the flip side of that coin, though vitamin K1 foods are beneficial to me to help clot my blood, a person with a thicker blood type eating daily salads and lots of other green vegetables, liquid oils and other PUFA laden foods is a recipe for disaster. Simple things like aspirin, vitamin E and “grounding” would be my first choice for a blood thinner.
 

pubh12

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I doubt when doctors prescribe blood thinners they consider other factors, like blood type and diet. An “O” blood type already has thinner than other blood types. Because I am that type I have to be careful about taking aspirin and ingesting other blood thinning foods and substances like vitamin E, foods high in vitamin E and alcohol, prescribing me a blood thinner would probably give me a stroke. On the flip side of that coin, though vitamin K1 foods are beneficial to me to help clot my blood, a person with a thicker blood type eating daily salads and lots of other green vegetables, liquid oils and other PUFA laden foods is a recipe for disaster. Simple things like aspirin, vitamin E and “grounding” would be my first choice for a blood thinner.
Forgive my ignorance , why would thinning the blood too much give you a stroke ?
 
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