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Aspirin And Bodybuilding - Do They Mix?

Discussion in 'Experiments' started by Lokzo, Sep 13, 2018.

  1. Lokzo

    Lokzo Member

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    As you all know, I love experimenting.

    So, I have been running a log on Meadowsweet extract (Fillipendula Ulmaria) as an Aspirin alternative.

    Since I have been using this, before my workouts, I notice:
    -Blunted Pain during drop sets
    -Reduced fatigue during reps
    -Massively extended endurance
    -Slightly better pumps


    My question is, does Aspirin negate the stimulus for muscle growth? Will it compromise my ability to build muscle (my goal).

    Thanks!
     
  2. Jon

    Jon Member

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    I don't really think it's a great idea to take it around training. It can stunt hypertrophy and adaptation:

    https://www.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/japplphysiol.00044.2013

    I'm interested in taking it during off weeks though, after a couple days of my body healing on its own (96hrs roughly) I'm thinking taking it after this point would just aid in decreasing any lingering inflammation that would interfere with androgen synthesis. In trying to get a concensus on this from experiences users though.
     
  3. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    Aspirin is not a insulin growth factor inhibitor is it?
     
  4. Jon

    Jon Member

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    No but it does inhibit satellite cell activity and prostaglandins and these are essential for hypertrophy.
     
  5. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    To my knowledge staying below 600mg aspirin will not interfere with hypertrophy. I think dosing higher will inhibit PGE2 too much.
     
  6. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    OK I guess I was wrong about PGE2, coz the last study I checked showed aspirin inhibit PGE2 in mice calculated for humans dose of 600mg. But I guess this is not valid conversion.
    Now I found this study says low dose 81mg already inhibit PGE2:

    "Volunteers were given 2 weeks of aspirin
    81 mg daily, and the urinary metabolites of PGE2 (11a-hydroxy-
    9,15-dioxo-2,3,4,5-tetranor-prostane-1,20-dioic acid) was mea
    sured using LC/MS/MS. Because the average PGE-M excretion is
    greater in males (8.2 ng/mg creatinine) than in females (3.6 ng/
    mg creatinine), the effect of aspirin was determined separately by
    gender. Aspirin 81 mg daily was sufficient to reduce urinary PGE
    M levels in healthy females by 56% and in healthy males by 39%.
    When correction is made for the estimated small contribution of
    platelet-derived PGE2 to total PGE2 biosynthesis (see Methods),
    the reduction in extraplatelet PGE2 production by aspirin is 55.4%
    in females and 38.6% in males (Fig. 1). The same aspirin dose also
    inhibited urinary PGI-M by 37% (P < 0.0001, n ¼ 54; Supple
    mentary Fig. S2). Serum thromboxane B2 levels were reduced by
    96.6%. These results demonstrate that low-dose aspirin can
    inhibit nonplatelet prostaglandin production. "

    cancerpreventionresearch.aacrjournals.org/content/9/11/855.full-text.pdf
     
  7. Anders86

    Anders86 Member

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  8. Jon

    Jon Member

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    I can tell you I was weak and took forever to recover from workouts when supplementing aspirin around workouts.
     
  9. Anders86

    Anders86 Member

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    Yeah I get mixed results myself. When I have Aspirin in my "amino acid pre-workout blend" I feel I don`t get as hard of a pump.
    But I often get a better workout, more focus on "muscle mind connection", "stretch and flex" and nose breathing.
    In other words my cortisol drops and I concentrate better. I probably don`t push myself as hard as I could, but I enjoy working out often and with little CNS activation.

    I guess the anti-inflammatory effect is both negative and positive.
    Even though inflammation drives hypertrophy it also drives myostatin and cortisol release, a big factor to catabolism.
     
  10. Jon

    Jon Member

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    I could see how this effect would be good for doing yoga or tai chi though :)
     
  11. vulture

    vulture Member

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    A really nice thing to expect to read.
     
  12. Jon

    Jon Member

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    Oh glad I could help :) I'm gonna be experimenting with some aspirin in about a week so I'll let you and some others know how it went.
     
  13. vulture

    vulture Member

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    Problem is that usually muscle mass gains are reduced month by month, it's hard to tell if it's slowing "too fast" on aspirin or "too fast" because you are getting bigger.
    One would need to have a bunch of lab rats to measure muscle mass gain with similar workout and diet to asses if aspirin tends to decrease gains or not comparing gains across groups.
     
  14. Jon

    Jon Member

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    Well I'm not going to take it near training. I'm going to take it during my monthly training layoff after the first 4 days since for experienced lifters 96hours has been shown to be optimal time for recovery (adaptations) to occur from training. Since these are processes which require inflammation, i don't want to interfere with their completion. After 4 days of no training I should be healed from training stresses and whatever inflammation is left is most likely just residual stress hormone from my metabolism being stressed during my training block so in reality I'm hoping the aspirin will help to rectify any lingering metabolic damage and help to optimize androgen synthesis over the course of the last 3 days of my layoff so that I'm primed and ready to go for the next 4 weeks of progression. We'll see what happens :) there's other small nuances I think I should abide by when taking the aspirin but it'll all be dependent upon how the first day goes if taking it.

    As far as muscle growth goes, at this point in my training career gaining muscle is like watching the grass grow since im very resistant to strength training stimulus after 12 years of consistency. I wouldn't know if aspirin is interfering with that by looks or weight, really only by strength and recovery levels (which are usually not good when taking aspirin around weight training)
     
  15. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    No problem at all, with aspirin plus workout. actually better recovery with less tendon pain.
     
  16. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    No, muscle gains depends on monthly change of routine difficulty or resistance level relative to previous month. like lifting head up, vs full sit-up
     
  17. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    @Jon Hypertrophy is all about repeating training in the time dependant on the window of opputunity the muscle has just repaired itself from the previous account of training. So for you every 96h you need to train again to induce muscle growth. Taking aspirin in that window should be avoided, then for it to not impair growth
     
  18. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    But the increased aldosterone with training is going to increase stressors to HPA, which is oke if one is healthy, else aspirin is a good supplement to prevent excessive stress from the workouts so to not impair recovery of aging or chronic stress that have upped stressors like serotonin, estrogen, prolactin etc.
    aldosterone – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)
     
  19. General Orange

    General Orange Member

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    As we see low dose aspirin having reduction in PGE2 around 50% which could be taken as inhibitors of muscle growth, we cannot exclude that other factors are involved like Fascia expansion, and Insulin Growth Factor that can limit exercise efficiency even before hypertrophy is activated.
     
  20. Jon

    Jon Member

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    General know that I have the utmost respect for you, but I must disagree

    Aspirin has been shown to interfere with satellite cell activity and mTOR both of which are essential in hypertrophic adaptation:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.re...activity_and_skeletal_muscle_regeneration/amp

    https://www.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/japplphysiol.00044.2013

    Muscular gain depends on an increase of total training volume increases (amount of resistance x repetitions) at a minimum of once every two weeks to increase hypertrophy:

    Effects of Training Volume on Strength and Hypertrophy in... : The Journal of Strength & Conditioning Research

    The Science of Detraining: How Long You Can Take a Break from the Gym Before You Lose Muscle Mass, Strength, and Endurance • Sci-Fit

    Here one on recovery times:
    Time course of strength and power recovery after resistance training with different movement velocities. - PubMed - NCBI
     
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