Anyone Using T + Peating Or AAS + Peating?

[vulture]

Hi

AFAIK one of the main problems with using exogenous T is supression along with aromatization of T, and Peating is supposed to reduce aromatization. Question is basically:

Has anyone tried using important Testosterone or AAS usage while Peating and using some Aromatase Inhibitor foods/substances like mushrooms and MB? What's your experience on this subject?

I'm thinking about how useful could it be boosting my muscle gain with some short Testosterone cycle, aromatase inhibitors and a proviron+MB+mushrooms+zinc+vitamin E to keep aromatization low.

 

[olive]

I take nandrolone as HRT. 500mg/week. It aromatises at a rate of ~20% compared to testosterone. No issues, no need to take an aromatise inhibitor at this dose.

I don’t think running cycles is a good idea. Either do low sporadic dosing to prevent shutdown or perma blast and cruise. The post cycle therapy drugs are horrendous on your health.

I’ve experimented with AAS for years, I’ve tried just about everything. Pulse short esters/orals solo or hop on for ever.

 

[sebastian_r]

Most important factors that impact the rate of aromatisation during a Testo cycle or TRT (besides the actual dosage): your body fat percentage, injection frequency and the ester.

With a lowish body fat around 10% you will get very little aromatisation (it really makes this big of a difference).

Second is the ester. The shorter the ester, the less aromatisation. With test prop you will have less aromatisation than with cypionate / enanthate / decanoate / undecanoate. Long ester give me 10x the side effects than short ester. There are different theories why this is the case, some say higher DHT with prop, some say the ester itself changes the rate of aromatisation...

Third is injection frequency. Daily small injections will result in less aromatisation, than one big weekly injection.

Following the three points (lower aromatisation / lower estrogen), the hpta shutdown will be less severe and recovery will be easier.

Best supps to reduce estradiol during cycle / TRT: Vitamin E / K. Eating collagen and saturated fats seem to help as well.

Don't start running Testo / Steroids without having a real aromatase inhibitor at hand. Neither vitamins nor proviron will help if you have heavy aromatisation.

Plan your PCT before you start running Testo / Steroids as well.

You should read at least 1/2 year about all aspects of Testo / Steroids before you make the dive, if you're happy and healthy right now, it's probably not worth it. You can seriously **** yourself up with that stuff.

 

[sebastian_r]

-

 

[vulture]

Most important factors that impact the rate of aromatisation during a Testo cycle or TRT (besides the actual dosage): your body fat percentage, injection frequency and the ester.

With a lowish body fat around 10% you will get very little aromatisation (it really makes this big of a difference).

Second is the ester. The shorter the ester, the less aromatisation. With test prop you will have less aromatisation than with cypionate / enanthate / decanoate / undecanoate. Long ester give me 10x the side effects than short ester. There are different theories why this is the case, some say higher DHT with prop, some say the ester itself changes the rate of aromatisation...

Third is injection frequency. Daily small injections will result in less aromatisation, than one big weekly injection.

Following the three points (lower aromatisation / lower estrogen), the hpta shutdown will be less severe and recovery will be easier.

Best supps to reduce estradiol during cycle / TRT: Vitamin E / K. Eating collagen and saturated fats seem to help as well.

Don't start running Testo / Steroids without having a real aromatase inhibitor at hand. Neither vitamins nor proviron will help if you have heavy aromatisation.

Plan your PCT before you start running Testo / Steroids as well.

You should read at least 1/2 year about all aspects of Testo / Steroids before you make the dive, if you're happy and healthy right now, it's probably not worth it. You can seriously **** yourself up with that stuff.

Seems that main problem if you are moderate with the cycle is that the PCT usually contains harmful stuff, but AFAIK HcG in lower dosages than usually employed is still kinda effective, problem is that I’m not sure if Peating could make you steer away from Clomid or you have no other option than posing yourself with it to avoid staying supressed
And I’m 72 kg for 1.85 m, really hard to gain decent muscle and erection issues sometimes. Varicoceles, but have had 800 T after Peating 3 months ago, usually had <400 T

 

[vulture]

I take nandrolone as HRT. 500mg/week. It aromatises at a rate of ~20% compared to testosterone. No issues, no need to take an aromatise inhibitor at this dose.

I don’t think running cycles is a good idea. Either do low sporadic dosing to prevent shutdown or perma blast and cruise. The post cycle therapy drugs are horrendous on your health.

I’ve experimented with AAS for years, I’ve tried just about everything. Pulse short esters/orals solo or hop on for ever.

Do you have primary or secundary hypogonadism?

 

[vulture]

Most important factors that impact the rate of aromatisation during a Testo cycle or TRT (besides the actual dosage): your body fat percentage, injection frequency and the ester.

With a lowish body fat around 10% you will get very little aromatisation (it really makes this big of a difference).

Second is the ester. The shorter the ester, the less aromatisation. With test prop you will have less aromatisation than with cypionate / enanthate / decanoate / undecanoate. Long ester give me 10x the side effects than short ester. There are different theories why this is the case, some say higher DHT with prop, some say the ester itself changes the rate of aromatisation...

Third is injection frequency. Daily small injections will result in less aromatisation, than one big weekly injection.

Following the three points (lower aromatisation / lower estrogen), the hpta shutdown will be less severe and recovery will be easier.

Best supps to reduce estradiol during cycle / TRT: Vitamin E / K. Eating collagen and saturated fats seem to help as well.

Don't start running Testo / Steroids without having a real aromatase inhibitor at hand. Neither vitamins nor proviron will help if you have heavy aromatisation.

Plan your PCT before you start running Testo / Steroids as well.

You should read at least 1/2 year about all aspects of Testo / Steroids before you make the dive, if you're happy and healthy right now, it's probably not worth it. You can seriously **** yourself up with that stuff.

Also, haidut said that one of the main problems with AAS is they induce a lack of steroids like allopregnenolone, pregnenolone, etc do you think it’s a good idea to supplement with those hormones while in cycle? Any serious place to read and learn about these stuff? I’d like to plan a cycle with the less side effects possible, especially post cycle supression

 

[sebastian_r]

Also, haidut said that one of the main problems with AAS is they induce a lack of steroids like allopregnenolone, pregnenolone, etc do you think it’s a good idea to supplement with those hormones while in cycle? Any serious place to read and learn about these stuff? I’d like to plan a cycle with the less side effects possible, especially post cycle supression

I personally don't like progesterone or pregnenolone.

Progesterone completely kills my libido (100% ED, would guess DHT suppression).

Pregnenolone gives me estrogenic sideffects (swollen feeds and bloating).

DHEA around 5mg/day I like. Feels androgenic and increases my libido.

When you go to the mainstream bodybuilding boards you will find that they all recommend testosterone as first cycle and then maybe second or third cycle testosterone and nandrolone or an oral. They do cycles between 2-6 months long. And they use long esters. Then they use HCG, clomid and AI for PCT. Then they end up blasting and cruising anyway.

From my experience this is BS.

You will want to use only short esters or orals.

Fast in, fast out.

The longer the ester the more side effects, the more suppression, the longer PCT necessary.

You will want to use something that works stand alone without using testosterone as base.

Using testosterone for gaining muscle comes with so many problems (estrogen sides, dht sides....). It has strong androgenic effects, but you only want anabolic effects.

So you want strong anabolic, low androgenic component.

Components that fit the bill are Turinabol, Boldenone and Primobolan.

Boldenone and Primobolon only comes with long esters, so I don't take them.

I got my best gains from Turinabol anyway. 25-50mg per day. 4-6 weeks max. I found that I can take a day off ever 2-4 days to reduce side effects even more.

You could do Turinabol 40mg/day and use an AI to avoid shutdown via negative feedback loop. Keep running the AI for 2-3 weeks longer as PCT.

Or you could only take an AI for 6-12 weeks to increase your testosterone via negative feedback loop.

And second cycle Turinabol + AI.

 

[vulture]

I personally don't like progesterone or pregnenolone.

Progesterone completely kills my libido (100% ED, would guess DHT suppression).

Pregnenolone gives me estrogenic sideffects (swollen feeds and bloating).

DHEA around 5mg/day I like. Feels androgenic and increases my libido.

When you go to the mainstream bodybuilding boards you will find that they all recommend testosterone as first cycle and then maybe second or third cycle testosterone and nandrolone or an oral. They do cycles between 2-6 months long. And they use long esters.

From my experience this is BS.

You will want to use only short esters or orals.

Fast in, fast out.

The longer the ester the more side effects, the more suppression, the longer PCT necessary.

You will want to use something that works stand alone without using testosterone as base.

Using testosterone for gaining muscle comes with so many problems (estrogen sides, dht sides....). It has strong androgenic effects, but you only want anabolic effects.

So you want strong anabolic, low androgenic component.

I got my best gains from Turinabol. 25-50mg per day. 4 weeks max.

You could do Turinabol 40mg/day and use an AI to avoid shutdown via negative feedback loop. Keep running the AI for 2-3 weeks longer as PCT.

Or you could only take an AI for 6-12 weeks to increase your testosterone via negative feedback loop.

And second cycle Turinabol + AI.

Id like the androgenic effect I have a lot of hair to loss hahaha joke apart, I’d like to see if I get more facial hair and androgen look
Is clomid absolutely necessary for PCT? I think it’s one of the most harmful things

 

[sebastian_r]

Id like the androgenic effect I have a lot of hair to loss hahaha joke apart, I’d like to see if I get more facial hair and androgen look
Is clomid absolutely necessary for PCT? I think it’s one of the most harmful things

You can do an AI only PCT with Aromasin if you only use for example Testosterone or Turinabol and non of the strong suppressive stuff like nandrolone. As well keep the cycle short.

 

[sebastian_r]

You could try DHEA and AI to get more androgenic. Hell, even AI only could to the job. There are many studies out there showing how Letrozole or Aromasin can double Testosterone / DHT levels.

 

[vulture]

You could try DHEA and AI to get more androgenic. Hell, even AI only could to the job. There are many studies out there showing how Letrozole or Aromasin can double Testosterone / DHT levels.

And what’s the Peaty downside of supplementing such a marvelous stuff? Haha

 

[sebastian_r]

DHEA you can find many posts here on the board, biggest downside is increase in estradiol levels which can suppress hpta and lower testosterone. But this should not be the case with 2-5mg/day. And if you take an AI, you estradiol wont increase anyway.
Biggest risk of using AI is going too low with estradiol and the health risks that are related to low estradiol. As well AI can be harsh on lipids. Aromasin seems to be the least harsh on lipids. Many studies out there, since millions of women taking AI every day.

 

[vulture]

What about aromasin + DHEA + HcG? I have some HcG and my LH and FSH was in range. HcG would increase T, AI prevent it to aromatice as well as DHEA

 

[sebastian_r]

I do really really bad on HCG, get massive estrogenic side effects and it completely kills my DHT. Not even Letrozole strong enough to combat the sides. Others love it and get great results.
I would start with the least amount of components and learn what they do on their own.
Otherwise you have no idea where the side effects or desired effects are coming from.
E.g. run Aromasin or DHEA a couple weeks on their own. Observe what is happening, then combine them.

 

[vulture]

I do really really bad on HCG, get massive estrogenic side effects and it completely kills my DHT. Not even Letrozole strong enough to combat the sides. Others love it and get great results.
I would start with the least amount of components and learn what they do on their own.
Otherwise you have no idea where the side effects or desired effects are coming from.
E.g. run Aromasin or DHEA a couple weeks on their own. Observe what is happening, then combine them.

Great ideas. I found that HcG is usually getting used in unnecessary high dosages. Were you using it low dose aside from AAS?

 

[sebastian_r]

Great ideas. I found that HcG is usually getting used in unnecessary high dosages. Were you using it low dose aside from AAS?

yes single shot of 250-500mcg and all hell breaks lose for me, sides take 5-10 days to disappear. nasty stuff. only clomid did me worse.

 

[vulture]

yes single shot of 250-500mcg and all hell breaks lose for me, sides take 5-10 days to disappear. nasty stuff. only clomid did me worse.

Low-Dose Human Chorionic Gonadotropin Maintains Intratesticular Testosterone in Normal Men with Testosterone-Induced Gonadotropin Suppression | The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism | Oxford Academic

 

[vulture]

I personally don't like progesterone or pregnenolone.

Progesterone completely kills my libido (100% ED, would guess DHT suppression).

Pregnenolone gives me estrogenic sideffects (swollen feeds and bloating).

DHEA around 5mg/day I like. Feels androgenic and increases my libido.

When you go to the mainstream bodybuilding boards you will find that they all recommend testosterone as first cycle and then maybe second or third cycle testosterone and nandrolone or an oral. They do cycles between 2-6 months long. And they use long esters. Then they use HCG, clomid and AI for PCT. Then they end up blasting and cruising anyway.

From my experience this is BS.

You will want to use only short esters or orals.

Fast in, fast out.

The longer the ester the more side effects, the more suppression, the longer PCT necessary.

You will want to use something that works stand alone without using testosterone as base.

Using testosterone for gaining muscle comes with so many problems (estrogen sides, dht sides....). It has strong androgenic effects, but you only want anabolic effects.

So you want strong anabolic, low androgenic component.

Components that fit the bill are Turinabol, Boldenone and Primobolan.

Boldenone and Primobolon only comes with long esters, so I don't take them.

I got my best gains from Turinabol anyway. 25-50mg per day. 4-6 weeks max. I found that I can take a day off ever 2-4 days to reduce side effects even more.

You could do Turinabol 40mg/day and use an AI to avoid shutdown via negative feedback loop. Keep running the AI for 2-3 weeks longer as PCT.

Or you could only take an AI for 6-12 weeks to increase your testosterone via negative feedback loop.

And second cycle Turinabol + AI.

Interesting stuff on Turinabol, there’s a Pharmacom Turinabolos for a decent price. Main concern seems the liver, I have read several substances here that are hepatoprotective and aids its recovery

 

[sebastian_r]

Interesting stuff on Turinabol, there’s a Pharmacom Turinabolos for a decent price. Main concern seems the liver, I have read several substances here that are hepatoprotective and aids its recovery

The pharmacom Turinabol is great, it's the one I always used. All oral steroids are more or less harsh on the liver, thats the reason you want it to run max 4-6 weeks. 4 better than 6. The sideeffects as well build up over time, taking a break in between once in a while helps greatly. E.g. 3-4 days on, 1 day off.