anyone used hydrocortisone to help tolerate/utilize thyroid?

FitnessMike

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Did anyone successfully increase cortisol to actually successfully supplement the thyroid?

I was on adrenal cortex but i seem to build a tolerance.

I will be trying tomorrow pregnenolone but im sure i cant tolerate much as i don't sleep 3 days after 100mg.

Few weeks back i was taking around less than grain NDT in total for like a week, it essentially accumulated in my blood, when i did test it was all extremely high, i knew this is what happening as i could not fall asleep due to adrenaline. I did cortisol saliva which indicated normal in the am and then flat low line thru the day. Now im taking 1/6th of the grain and will test how that looks in the blood this weekend.

I am thinking about hydrocortisone in physiological doses, anyone did this succesfully?
 

sweetpeat

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594
Did anyone successfully increase cortisol to actually successfully supplement the thyroid?

I was on adrenal cortex but i seem to build a tolerance.

I will be trying tomorrow pregnenolone but im sure i cant tolerate much as i don't sleep 3 days after 100mg.

Few weeks back i was taking around less than grain NDT in total for like a week, it essentially accumulated in my blood, when i did test it was all extremely high, i knew this is what happening as i could not fall asleep due to adrenaline. I did cortisol saliva which indicated normal in the am and then flat low line thru the day. Now im taking 1/6th of the grain and will test how that looks in the blood this weekend.

I am thinking about hydrocortisone in physiological doses, anyone did this succesfully?
I remember reading that @Wilfrid is doing this.

As far as trying pregnenolone for cortisol enhancement, I think getting the dose right is the tricky part. 100mg sound like a lot to me. Or at least I should say it would be a lot for ME, and make me sleepless as it's doing you. I've had better luck with doses of 10-20mg at a time, dosing anywhere from 1 to 3 times a day.
 

Wilfrid

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711
Yes.
As long as you can determine what’s a physiological dose is.
For self experimentation, hydrocortisone up to 5 mg max, and even stuff like prednisone with a dosage from mcg to 1 mg max are perfectly safe long term.
I think the key here is to split the hydrocortisone dose and to take the larger dose in the morning and the second one with your lunch (ideally between 12 and 2 PM).
I personally take 2/3 of a dose in the morning and the last 1/3 at the end of my lunch.
For the prednisone, I think that the drug should be taken only in the morning and ideally around 8 am.
Other important thing, besides ensuring good nutrition all along, is to keep a high calcium/phosphorus ratio. Calcium here is almost as important as the exogenous hormone you are about to take.
As for the thyroid, sometimes experimenting without any T3 short term and using small amount of T4 only can help for certain cortisol issues. As long as the T4 dose is kept «physiological»....by that, I mean between 12,5 to 25 mcg of T4 max.
You may find, or not, all of the above recommendations useful but seek for medical or specialist advice in case of severe hypothyroidism and/or severe adrenals insufficiencies.
 

FitnessMike

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Yes.
As long as you can determine what’s a physiological dose is.
For self experimentation, hydrocortisone up to 5 mg max, and even stuff like prednisone with a dosage from mcg to 1 mg max are perfectly safe long term.
I think the key here is to split the hydrocortisone dose and to take the larger dose in the morning and the second one with your lunch (ideally between 12 and 2 PM).
I personally take 2/3 of a dose in the morning and the last 1/3 at the end of my lunch.
For the prednisone, I think that the drug should be taken only in the morning and ideally around 8 am.
Other important thing, besides ensuring good nutrition all along, is to keep a high calcium/phosphorus ratio. Calcium here is almost as important as the exogenous hormone you are about to take.
As for the thyroid, sometimes experimenting without any T3 short term and using small amount of T4 only can help for certain cortisol issues. As long as the T4 dose is kept «physiological»....by that, I mean between 12,5 to 25 mcg of T4 max.
You may find, or not, all of the above recommendations useful but seek for medical or specialist advice in case of severe hypothyroidism and/or severe adrenals insufficiencies
So you jumped on hydrocortisone to help with thyroid tolerance?

Im taking only 1/6 grain, anything above that im getting muscle twitches, i hope that with weeks my metabolism will jump a little from the low dose and i will be able to up again and again if the adrenal cortex and pregnenolone fail, i will be thinking about hydrocortisone. On reddit they are stressing out to work with endo etc, but as you say, 5mg doses are perfectly fine. Anyway this weekend i will do the tests and will know where i stand.
 

FitnessMike

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I remember reading that @Wilfrid is doing this.

As far as trying pregnenolone for cortisol enhancement, I think getting the dose right is the tricky part. 100mg sound like a lot to me. Or at least I should say it would be a lot for ME, and make me sleepless as it's doing you. I've had better luck with doses of 10-20mg at a time, dosing anywhere from 1 to 3 times a day.
so you did successfully increase cortisol this way? my buddy said that taking pregnenolone first thing and then going for a brisk walk would increase his cortisol, ray peat said that pregnenolone should help with tolerating thyroid right?
 

Wilfrid

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So you jumped on hydrocortisone to help with thyroid tolerance?

Im taking only 1/6 grain, anything above that im getting muscle twitches, i hope that with weeks my metabolism will jump a little from the low dose and i will be able to up again and again if the adrenal cortex and pregnenolone fail, i will be thinking about hydrocortisone. On reddit they are stressing out to work with endo etc, but as you say, 5mg doses are perfectly fine. Anyway this weekend i will do the tests and will know where i stand.
Yes.
Just remember that split dosing should be considered for hydrocortisone.
Anyway keep us updated.
 

FitnessMike

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Yes.
Just remember that split dosing should be considered for hydrocortisone.
Anyway keep us updated.
Can you write how much and for how long were/are you using? also, did you wean off with time with no problem?
 

Wilfrid

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I began taking regularly HC this year and, up to nowadays, I am still on it.
I sometimes rotate it with cortancyl (prednisone).
For the HC, the dose I take (since the beginning) is around 3,75 mg (2,5 mg in the morning and 1,25 mg at lunch).
For the prednisone, I rotate between 250 and 500 mcg in the morning. The prednisone is a recent addition (mid October).
I do think that when the time will comes I could wean off with absolutely no problem.
I am very cautious about my vitamin A, D, K and calcium intake. I am also currently taking pregnenolone before bed.
 
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sweetpeat

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so you did successfully increase cortisol this way? my buddy said that taking pregnenolone first thing and then going for a brisk walk would increase his cortisol, ray peat said that pregnenolone should help with tolerating thyroid right?
To qualify, I don't have any labs to prove what's happening. Just going by how I feel. But I do know I have low cortisol based on prior blood and saliva labs, so I know it's an issue for me. If I've taken a thyroid dose, say in the morning, and I get a drop in energy like after a meal. a small dose of preg will often pick me up. Unfortunately, it's not a sure thing. Hydrocortisone would probably be more reliable, but I'm just guessing. And I've been to skittish to try it so far.

I've found progesterone is also helpful for raising cortisol, especially in the morning. Taking anywhere from 1 to 3 drops (3-9mg) at bedtime helps to bring on that "wake up" feel in the morning. Taking more than that seems to be suppressive, at least for me, and I end up feeling groggy instead.
 

Wilfrid

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To qualify, I don't have any labs to prove what's happening. Just going by how I feel. But I do know I have low cortisol based on prior blood and saliva labs, so I know it's an issue for me. If I've taken a thyroid dose, say in the morning, and I get a drop in energy like after a meal. a small dose of preg will often pick me up. Unfortunately, it's not a sure thing. Hydrocortisone would probably be more reliable, but I'm just guessing. And I've been to skittish to try it so far.

I've found progesterone is also helpful for raising cortisol, especially in the morning. Taking anywhere from 1 to 3 drops (3-9mg) at bedtime helps to bring on that "wake up" feel in the morning. Taking more than that seems to be suppressive, at least for me, and I end up feeling groggy instead.
Very interesting thing about progesterone, thanks to share.
Are you using it orally or topically?
While I had a bottle of progesterone on hand I never thought about using it for cortisol issue despite what RP have said about it and its potential benefits for adrenals dysfunction. Good to hear about your experience.
What kind of thyroid hormones did you take? A combination of T4/T3? or T4 only?
 

sweetpeat

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Very interesting thing about progesterone, thanks to share.
Are you using it orally or topically?
While I had a bottle of progesterone on hand I never thought about using it for cortisol issue despite what RP have said about it and its potential benefits for adrenals dysfunction. Good to hear about your experience.
What kind of thyroid hormones did you take? A combination of T4/T3? or T4 only?
I use the progesterone orally and vaginally. Not tried it topically, but @marsaday has mentioned using it topically for enhancing cortisol.

I take mostly t4. I currently take a bit of t3 here and there in the form of either cynomel or NDT. I have to be careful with t3. It tends to blunt my cortisol even more. Or at least that's how it feels sometimes.
 

FitnessMike

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I began taking regularly HC this year and, up to nowadays, I am still on it.
I sometimes rotate it with cortancyl (prednisone).
For the HC, the dose I take (since the beginning) is around 3,75 mg (2,5 mg in the morning and 1,25 mg at lunch).
For the prednisone, I rotate between 250 and 500 mcg in the morning. The prednisone is a recent addition (mid October).
I do think that when the time will comes I could wean off with absolutely no problem.
I am very cautious about my vitamin A, D, K and calcium intake. I am also currently taking pregnenolone before bed.
Thanks for sharing mate.

before you started, was your cortisol low throughout the day? did such low dose of HC bring your cortisol to an optimal level thru the day?

also, I'm wondering, if one have low cortisol and use physiological dosages, will that actually benefit our own HPA axis as it would somehow give time to up-regulate/rest their own prouction you think?
 

sweetpeat

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594
I began taking regularly HC this year and, up to nowadays, I am still on it.
I sometimes rotate it with cortancyl (prednisone).
For the HC, the dose I take (since the beginning) is around 3,75 mg (2,5 mg in the morning and 1,25 mg at lunch).
For the prednisone, I rotate between 250 and 500 mcg in the morning. The prednisone is a recent addition (mid October).
I do think that when the time will comes I could wean off with absolutely no problem.
I am very cautious about my vitamin A, D, K and calcium intake. I am also currently taking pregnenolone before bed.
Where do you get your HC and prednisone?
 

Wilfrid

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Nov 26, 2012
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711
@sweetpeat , thanks.
@FitnessMike I never measured my cortisol level via blood or salivary tests.
I started self experimentation because I was feeling subpar while on thyroid meds and especially during the coldest seasons of the year.
I found, without any doubts, myself literally plugged while on HC.
Feeling of anabolic energy and inner peace, more resilient and, by far, better resistance to any kind of stress.
Before that, I was emotionally inconsistent...I mean...I could wake up one day and tolerate any kind of noises or environmental agitation and the next day even the noise of a falling knife on the ground would put me instantly in a strong irritating state....sometimes up to point I could barely tolerate any human communications at all...not very practical while married and with a child....
Plus, some physical signs have improved too, like my eyebrows for example. My hair are also more manageable, more « soft» to the touch, less dry.
 

Unknownuser

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Messages
134
Yes.
As long as you can determine what’s a physiological dose is.
For self experimentation, hydrocortisone up to 5 mg max, and even stuff like prednisone with a dosage from mcg to 1 mg max are perfectly safe long term.
I think the key here is to split the hydrocortisone dose and to take the larger dose in the morning and the second one with your lunch (ideally between 12 and 2 PM).
I personally take 2/3 of a dose in the morning and the last 1/3 at the end of my lunch.
For the prednisone, I think that the drug should be taken only in the morning and ideally around 8 am.
Other important thing, besides ensuring good nutrition all along, is to keep a high calcium/phosphorus ratio. Calcium here is almost as important as the exogenous hormone you are about to take.
As for the thyroid, sometimes experimenting without any T3 short term and using small amount of T4 only can help for certain cortisol issues. As long as the T4 dose is kept «physiological»....by that, I mean between 12,5 to 25 mcg of T4 max.
You may find, or not, all of the above recommendations useful but seek for medical or specialist advice in case of severe hypothyroidism and/or severe adrenals insufficiencies.

Hi Wilfrid,

I was searching the whole web to find the answer to my question. And now found your post. Came here from the "posts of the week" email. So, my question was, is it safe to take 1mg prednisone or 5mg hydrocortisone a day.

In 2012 I had a massive crash. And ever since I am suffering ver bad mentally and physically. Especially mentally. Almost zero memory. It was a looong way until I came to this point. Doctors never were a help and never checked cortisol levels. It was all a guessing game. Until early December 2019 I thought I will die soon because I felt horrible all the time. Then I started taking 25mg Dhea, 10mg Pregnenolone orally and 3-5mg Progesterone as cream, directly after waking up. Within a week I was like reborn. My brain started to function, my energy came back and I finally was feeling confidence again.

It all went good up until around October 2020. In August 2020 I started to take 250 UI HCG EOD (due to PFS) and dropped DHEA and Preg and Prog. I felt pretty good until about 10 weeks later. I think I was hypothyroid and the HCG kickstarted my thyroid. Blood tests show TSH of 2.4, FT3 at higher end of the norm and FT4 mid range. So my theory is, that the restart of my metabolism dropped my already very low cortisol and other hormone levels and made me feel very bad. I have become very depressed, very bad cognitive issues and lots of other stuff.

3-4 weeks ago I took 3mg Prednisone and felt AMAZING for 3 days. It was even too much energy. My depression was blown away within an hour, I had libido after weeks of zero libido and I was back to my very old self. Energetic, funny, confident etc. Unfortunately on Facebook groups they told me it has nothing to do with low cortisol levels but Hydrocortisone makes everybody feel Amazing bla bla be careful with that stuff its very bad for you etc. But I think usually people dose 100mg or more a day.

Yesterday I tried 1mg and again felt pretty good. Not as amazing as on 3mg but still better mood etc. Today I took none and felt depressed and ***t all day. I think in 2012, where I had this mental and physical crash due to 3 months of very chronic stress, alcohol and a heavy flu, my adrenals crashed. As I said, it really was a looong way of own research to come to this point and know about adrenals and their function.

What do you think about my theory that HCG kickstarted my low thyroid and now my adrenals cant keep up with my thyroid and I have signs of low cortisol? I also lost about 3-4 KG while still eating pretty much the same way. Even though I have zero appetite. Also my digestion seem to not work properly again, while it was good pre HCG. I am now going into the underweight direction again, wich I absolutely dont like.

EDIT: Unfortunately I cant get my cortisol checked currently. I am not in my home country. But the worse part is, I had to stop Preg and Dhea for 2 weeks again, wich will set me back again for weeks.
 

FitnessMike

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I was using progesterone cream before bed to help lower cortisol before, but I'm wondering now if using it in the morning would actually help with cortisol.
 

Wilfrid

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Nov 26, 2012
Messages
711
Hi Wilfrid,

I was searching the whole web to find the answer to my question. And now found your post. Came here from the "posts of the week" email. So, my question was, is it safe to take 1mg prednisone or 5mg hydrocortisone a day.

In 2012 I had a massive crash. And ever since I am suffering ver bad mentally and physically. Especially mentally. Almost zero memory. It was a looong way until I came to this point. Doctors never were a help and never checked cortisol levels. It was all a guessing game. Until early December 2019 I thought I will die soon because I felt horrible all the time. Then I started taking 25mg Dhea, 10mg Pregnenolone orally and 3-5mg Progesterone as cream, directly after waking up. Within a week I was like reborn. My brain started to function, my energy came back and I finally was feeling confidence again.

It all went good up until around October 2020. In August 2020 I started to take 250 UI HCG EOD (due to PFS) and dropped DHEA and Preg and Prog. I felt pretty good until about 10 weeks later. I think I was hypothyroid and the HCG kickstarted my thyroid. Blood tests show TSH of 2.4, FT3 at higher end of the norm and FT4 mid range. So my theory is, that the restart of my metabolism dropped my already very low cortisol and other hormone levels and made me feel very bad. I have become very depressed, very bad cognitive issues and lots of other stuff.

3-4 weeks ago I took 3mg Prednisone and felt AMAZING for 3 days. It was even too much energy. My depression was blown away within an hour, I had libido after weeks of zero libido and I was back to my very old self. Energetic, funny, confident etc. Unfortunately on Facebook groups they told me it has nothing to do with low cortisol levels but Hydrocortisone makes everybody feel Amazing bla bla be careful with that stuff its very bad for you etc. But I think usually people dose 100mg or more a day.

Yesterday I tried 1mg and again felt pretty good. Not as amazing as on 3mg but still better mood etc. Today I took none and felt depressed and ***t all day. I think in 2012, where I had this mental and physical crash due to 3 months of very chronic stress, alcohol and a heavy flu, my adrenals crashed. As I said, it really was a looong way of own research to come to this point and know about adrenals and their function.

What do you think about my theory that HCG kickstarted my low thyroid and now my adrenals cant keep up with my thyroid and I have signs of low cortisol? I also lost about 3-4 KG while still eating pretty much the same way. Even though I have zero appetite. Also my digestion seem to not work properly again, while it was good pre HCG. I am now going into the underweight direction again, wich I absolutely dont like.

EDIT: Unfortunately I cant get my cortisol checked currently. I am not in my home country. But the worse part is, I had to stop Preg and Dhea for 2 weeks again, wich will set me back again for weeks.
Hi,
A variety of clinical evidence do support the hypothesis that hCG has intrinsic thyroid stimulating activity.
The alpha-subunit of hCG is identical to the alpha-subunit of TSH, so interactions seem likely to exist.
It also have this similarity with LH and FSH. Do you have any blood tests done about those two?
Low thyroid function and/or low cortisol production can both induce weight loss.
Your recent lab results regarding your thyroid function seem to confirm a subclinical hypothyroidism.
Did you test thyroid antibodies as well?
I think that small dose of prednisone and T4 can probably be helpful to normalize your thyroid function.
I don’t know what is currently available to your location but something like 500 mcg of prednisone (in the morning) and 12,5 mcg of T4 (ideally before bedtime) could be tried for like two weeks and then you can probably reassess your thyroid function via new blood tests. Keeping an eye on how you emotionally feel, tracking your pulse and temperature, your resistance to stress ect.....
Pregnenolone can help tremendously but you have to find a brand and a dosage that’s ideally suit you. It can be tricky as well as money consuming but I think that it can worth the expense depending on your finances. High protein and calcium intake are very important while on those exogenous hormones ( even on low doses ). Vitamin D is important as well but tricky to correctly dosing.
 

Wilfrid

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In this relationship between thyroid and adrenals, thyroid is probably the masterpiece. There is some kind of verticality in the hierarchy process between those two important endocrine glands. Thyroid being at the head, literally and metaphorically, and the adrenals at the bottom, so to speak.
Dr Kenneth Blanchard’s protocol has literally changed my own therapeutic approach to treat my sluggish thyroid and indirectly my sluggish adrenals too.
I had an history of Crohn’s disease and, like RP has rightfully said multiple times, people with hypothyroidism are more likely than others to require cortisol while facing major health issues. So on the paper, fixing thyroid should be enough...unfortunately, people’s biochemistry is far more complex than a piece of paper, mathematical algorithms or "well conducted" medical studies....
Whatever your current health situation, your adrenals are still functioning and in case of severe trauma, fever or illness they are still perfectly able to produce sufficient amount of cortisol (unless very specific adrenal’s diseases).
They only need correct stimulation and support regarding your own and unique organic environmental adaptative and resilience capacities on a day to day basis.
The only thing I, now, disagree with the late Dr Blanchard is the introduction of T3 (even in the micro-dosing range he used to recommend) when signs of hypothyroidism are showing up while on his low dose T4 therapy only. T3 interact with cortisol production and even in micro-doses it still can be a problem for a majority of people with subpar adrenals function.
For people, with a slightly elevated TSH (around 2~3), who have a high freeT3/free T4 ratio, I have the conviction that low dose prednisone (in the mcg range) should be used instead of the T3 (while still on low dose T4). Prednisone is "naturally" a slow-release drug, hence is half-life, and I think it is even preferable to hydrocortisone. It can be substituted safely in lieu of T3 in this particular thyroid pattern.
So called slow-release synthetic T3 are not reliable and now most of the currently available NDT are not constant in their potency.
 
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