Anyone Have Success Building Muscle On A Peat Diet?

[Hans]

Hey guys,
Just a quick background of me.
I'm 25year old male that lifts weights. I've been reading Peats articles and this forum for a while now. Very interesting and I do learn alot, especially from @haidut. My wife and I are currently doing the PUFA depletion for 30 days, but we might go on longer than that.

So my question is...has anyone gained considerable amounts of muscle and strength with weight lifting, while doing Peat diet and not using steroids or even pro-hormones of any kind, only nutritional supplements?

I'm wondering, because I want to know if Peat diet will give me the fastest possible results for my training. I know weight training is frowned upon (kinda) here. I know Peat diet will definitely be the best for health, but will it be best for building muscle. I was thinking of going Peat for 1 year while training and see my results, then do it Vince Gironda way for 1 year and then compare results.

I'm planning on training 3-5 times a week for 30 min workouts. I already have 6 years training experience.

Vince Gironda's methods are guarenteed to give great results, it will just not be the most healthy way (Vince admitted this himself).

 

[Prosper]

I gained some additional muscle without even working out when I started peating.

I already have 6 years training experience.

It's likely you are already close to as big as you're ever going to get.

 

[Ron J]

I've built muscle following Ray Peat's diet. I don't see why you wouldn't, considering how anabolic and anti catabolic it is.
Edit: "I know weight training is frowned upon (kinda) here." Why? And do you often come across rude people?

 

[Hans]

I know weight training is frowned upon (kinda) here." Why? And do you often come across rude people?

Not really no, but just because it's an additional stressor, and here it is encouraged to avoid stressors such as weight training.

It's likely you are already close to as big as you're ever going to get.

I wasn't training optimally during that time and my diet was horrible. I believe there is much more to gain. Just have a look at how Vince is looking. 17" arms at 5'8". I'm 5'10" with 15" arm.
I don't want to be a steroid monkey looking out of proportion guy, but just have some quality muscle. Check Vince out to see what I'm talking about.

 

[theLaw]

@Salmonamb

Getting Ripped With Dr Peat

 

[raypeatclips]

Not really no, but just because it's an additional stressor, and here it is encouraged to avoid stressors such as weight training.


I wasn't training optimally during that time and my diet was horrible. I believe there is much more to gain. Just have a look at how Vince is looking. 17" arms at 5'8". I'm 5'10" with 15" arm.
I don't want to be a steroid monkey looking out of proportion guy, but just have some quality muscle. Check Vince out to see what I'm talking about.

Come on, Vince gironda diet? Nothing but steak and eggs 80 percent of the time? Surely you can see that isn't a healthy diet. Just Google all the low carb, zero carb, paleo etc people that have crashed after a year of feeling amazing. I don't see why you can't eat a good amount of meat and some eggs and still have a good diet. I don't think extreme diets ("Peat diet" included) are a good idea.

 

[Hans]

Come on, Vince gironda diet? Nothing but steak and eggs 80 percent of the time? Surely you can see that isn't a healthy diet. Just Google all the low carb, zero carb, paleo etc people that have crashed after a year of feeling amazing. I don't see why you can't eat a good amount of meat and some eggs and still have a good diet. I don't think extreme diets ("Peat diet" included) are a good idea.

Well yes, the steak and egg diet is his rip course. He has many others that's geared towards building muscle. I'm not trying to lean down though, that is the easy part. Building more muscle is what I'm aiming for. Vince trained hundreds of bodybuidling champions and he knew how to do it as fast as possible.
Yes, I did mention in my head post that Vince himself said he is an athletic nutritionist that will get you gains, but it won't be the best for your health. It's not detrimental but definitely much healthier than steroids.

I just want to compare results (building muscle) from a Peat diet vs a Vince diet.

Also, I like to be extreme haha. Do a Peat diet to the letter for the best benefits it has to offer. All the effort for all the results.

Thanks @theLaw, I will check it out.

 

[Nstocks]

Where do you start with this?

I consider myself slim, very little muscle but a stomach of second trimester appearance.

Do I try and get diet down for a month and stick to it and then do bodyweight exercises? (no money or interest in working out at a gym)

 

[Hans]

Where do you start with this?

I consider myself slim, very little muscle but a stomach of second trimester appearance.

Do I try and get diet down for a month and stick to it and then do bodyweight exercises? (no money or interest in working out at a gym)

I'd say stick to dr. Peat's recommendations, moderate protein, high carbs (sugar/fructose) and minimal fat. Get your thyroid working optimally and you'll burn it off. Stay strict.

 

[Nstocks]

I'd say stick to dr. Peat's recommendations, moderate protein, high carbs (sugar/fructose) and minimal fat. Get your thyroid working optimally and you'll burn it off. Stay strict.

I've been 'doing' Peats recommendations for years. Always struggle with super low protein (under 50g) without having to consume litres of milk. I don't think burning it off is enough for the overall physique, I need to gain quite a bit of muscle too.

 

[DuggaDugga]

Sure have. I needed to up my muscle meat intake to meet protein needs though.
Get plenty of sugar to support the pentose phosphate pathway required for growth.
Avoid stress and make sure you're fully healed before lifting again.

 

[raypeatclips]

It's not detrimental.

I 100% disagree with that. Eating steak and eggs, and nothing else for the majority of your diet will definitely cause your health to deteriorate, I have no doubts about that. Also comparing the safety of something with steroids doesn't seem like a sensible reason to start something.

If you are seriously considering this diet, I am not sure what use you are going to find on this forum. Nobody sane on this forum will agree with you that you should eat nothing but steak and eggs for your diet. The usual bodybuilding forums seem more suited to what you want.

 

[Hans]

Sure have. I needed to up my muscle meat intake to meet protein needs though.
Get plenty of sugar to support the pentose phosphate pathway required for growth.
Avoid stress and make sure you're fully healed before lifting again.

Do you mind me asking, how much muscle have you gained? Weight, length and maybe measurements. Plus how much is your lifts?

 

[Hans]

I 100% disagree with that. Eating steak and eggs, and nothing else for the majority of your diet will definitely cause your health to deteriorate, I have no doubts about that. Also comparing the safety of something with steroids doesn't seem like a sensible reason to start something.

If you are seriously considering this diet, I am not sure what use you are going to find on this forum. Nobody sane on this forum will agree with you that you should eat nothing but steak and eggs for your diet. The usual bodybuilding forums seem more suited to what you want.

I'm sure that you misunderstood me and clearly have no understanding of Vince's methods.
As I stated, steak and eggs is his rip coarse, which he only recommends to do for 3 months maximum. He himself stated that such a high protein diet is unhealthy and that's why you need to cycle.
But please reread my post, as I did say that I am not interested in doing his rip coarse, but rather building more muscle.

However, I did not only compare the safety of his methods with steroids but also the results. And as a natural bodybuilder your diet is your steroids.
You have to take extreme measures to reach extreme body composition naturally. If you don't you will not be able to reach that level of success naturally. Vince has also tested all the diets and methods there are, over extended periods of time, and has seen what is the best for building muscle.
I repeat: He would not advise this diet to everyone or just anyone. He himself ate a well balanced diet when he wasn't trying to build muscle.

I'm on this forum because I learn a lot and like to read intellectual information.
I am not a steroid using bodybuilder (including pro-hormones) and have no interest in bodybuilders who use them or in the methods they use. Building muscle naturally is an art and you have to be smart in order to understand how to do so successfully.
So to get back on topic, I simply asked if someone here is having success building considerable amounts of muscle while following a Peat diet.

 

[raypeatclips]

I'm sure that you misunderstood me and clearly have no understanding of Vince's methods.
As I stated, steak and eggs is his rip coarse, which he only recommends to do for 3 months maximum. He himself stated that such a high protein diet is unhealthy and that's why you need to cycle.
But please reread my post, as I did say that I am not interested in doing his rip coarse, but rather building more muscle.

However, I did not only compare the safety of his methods with steroids but also the results. And as a natural bodybuilder your diet is your steroids.
You have to take extreme measures to reach extreme body composition naturally. If you don't you will not be able to reach that level of success naturally. Vince has also tested all the diets and methods there are, over extended periods of time, and has seen what is the best for building muscle.
I repeat: He would not advise this diet to everyone or just anyone. He himself ate a well balanced diet when he wasn't trying to build muscle.

I'm on this forum because I learn a lot and like to read intellectual information.
I am not a steroid using bodybuilder (including pro-hormones) and have no interest in bodybuilders who use them or in the methods they use. Building muscle naturally is an art and you have to be smart in order to understand how to do so successfully.
So to get back on topic, I simply asked if someone here is having success building considerable amounts of muscle while following a Peat diet.

Your first post specifically states you were thinking of doing the Vince gironda diet for up to a year, which isn't what you seem to be saying now.

I am not sure what subtle nuances of the Vince gironda diet I am missing, I would be happy for you to explain for me. My quick research into it boasted how simple and easy it was and that you ate steak and eggs, and that was it for 4 days out of 5, then ate whatever you wanted. I didn't realise there was more to it than that, unless you are just trying to defend the diet.

I worry you are going to sacrifice your health for the quest of achieving more muscle and chasing that "perfect body" by extreme ways. I do not think this is the forum for you.

"First do no harm."

 

[DaveFoster]

I went from ~190 to ~230 lbs while Peating and lifting over a few years. I'm about 20% body fat.

Carbs and cortisol matter.

 

[Hans]

I went from ~190 to ~230 lbs while Peating and lifting over a few years. I'm about 20% body fat.

Carbs and cortisol matter.

Nice. How long did this take you?
What was your macros?
And what is your length?

 

[DuggaDugga]

Do you mind me asking, how much muscle have you gained? Weight, length and maybe measurements. Plus how much is your lifts?

Roughly eight pounds. I was a maybe 152 before lifting and now I'm at 160. No "bulk phase" or anything, just a gradual increase in mass.
My lifts aren't impressive. I usually just throw a plate on each side for squat, dead lift, and bench. Lots of free weights. I don't really have weight goals. I just enjoy the process and getting lean. Whenever I'm not enjoying it anymore, when I feel it's becoming stressful, I go stretch, eat some fruit, and call it a day.

 

[Hans]

Roughly eight pounds. I was a maybe 152 before lifting and now I'm at 160. No "bulk phase" or anything, just a gradual increase in mass.
My lifts aren't impressive. I usually just throw a plate on each side for squat, dead lift, and bench. Lots of free weights. I don't really have weight goals. I just enjoy the process and getting lean. Whenever I'm not enjoying it anymore, when I feel it's becoming stressful, I go stretch, eat some fruit, and call it a day.

I agree, enjoying what you are doing is one of the most important factors for health and happiness.

 

[DuggaDugga]

I'm sure that you misunderstood me and clearly have no understanding of Vince's methods.
As I stated, steak and eggs is his rip coarse, which he only recommends to do for 3 months maximum. He himself stated that such a high protein diet is unhealthy and that's why you need to cycle.
But please reread my post, as I did say that I am not interested in doing his rip coarse, but rather building more muscle.

However, I did not only compare the safety of his methods with steroids but also the results. And as a natural bodybuilder your diet is your steroids.
You have to take extreme measures to reach extreme body composition naturally. If you don't you will not be able to reach that level of success naturally. Vince has also tested all the diets and methods there are, over extended periods of time, and has seen what is the best for building muscle.
I repeat: He would not advise this diet to everyone or just anyone. He himself ate a well balanced diet when he wasn't trying to build muscle.

I'm on this forum because I learn a lot and like to read intellectual information.
I am not a steroid using bodybuilder (including pro-hormones) and have no interest in bodybuilders who use them or in the methods they use. Building muscle naturally is an art and you have to be smart in order to understand how to do so successfully.
So to get back on topic, I simply asked if someone here is having success building considerable amounts of muscle while following a Peat diet.

If you want to get into the weeds of biochemistry and physiology, I think you might enjoy reading about the pentose phosphate pathway, which is involved in recycling vitamins, protecting from oxidative stress, and the synthesis of nucleotides, among other things. All of these are relevant to health in general, but are especially relevant someone actively growing muscle mass through resistance training. I think it really solidifies the relevance of sufficient carbohydrates before, after, and perhaps during work-out. It's one of those things that low-carb advocates seem to overlook constantly, which is unfortunate given how fundamental it is to health.

The pentose phosphate pathway (PPP) is a fundamental component of cellular metabolism. The PPP is important to maintain carbon homoeostasis, to provide precursors for nucleotide and amino acid biosynthesis, to provide reducing molecules for anabolism, and to defeat oxidative stress. The PPP shares reactions with the Entner–Doudoroff pathway and Calvin cycle and divides into an oxidative and non-oxidative branch. The oxidative branch is highly active in most eukaryotes and converts glucose 6-phosphate into carbon dioxide, ribulose 5-phosphate and NADPH. The latter function is critical to maintain redox balance under stress situations, when cells proliferate rapidly, in ageing, and for the ‘Warburg effect’ of cancer cells. The non-oxidative branch instead is virtually ubiquitous, and metabolizes the glycolytic intermediates fructose 6-phosphate and glyceraldehyde 3-phosphate as well as sedoheptulose sugars, yielding ribose 5-phosphate for the synthesis of nucleic acids and sugar phosphate precursors for the synthesis of amino acids. Whereas the oxidative PPP is considered unidirectional, the non-oxidative branch can supply glycolysis with intermediates derived from ribose 5-phosphate and vice versa, depending on the biochemical demand. These functions require dynamic regulation of the PPP pathway that is achieved through hierarchical interactions between transcriptome, proteome and metabolome. Consequently, the biochemistry and regulation of this pathway, while still unresolved in many cases, are archetypal for the dynamics of the metabolic network of the cell. In this comprehensive article we review seminal work that led to the discovery and description of the pathway that date back now for 80 years, and address recent results about genetic and metabolic mechanisms that regulate its activity. These biochemical principles are discussed in the context of PPP deficiencies causing metabolic disease and the role of this pathway in biotechnology, bacterial and parasite infections, neurons, stem cell potency and cancer metabolism.

The return of metabolism: biochemistry and physiology of the pentose phosphate pathway

If you prefer videos, Chris Masterjohn is a solid resource:


We could probably start a whole thread on optimizing muscle-building efficiency, which would likely include avoiding catabolic hormones such as cortisol/adrenaline, minimizing metabolism-suppressing potential of tryptophan while getting sufficient protein, etc. This is something I've been starting to read on, so I'd be happy to contribute.