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Anybody Here Fixed Sibo?

Discussion in 'Digestion, Gut Flora' started by Motif, Dec 3, 2018.

  1. Motif

    Motif Member

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    if so, how?
    Seems like impossible for most.
     
  2. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    I start to believe your start to believe it makes no sense to kill gut bacteria and there's other reasons for food intolerances and "sibo" symptoms
     
  3. somuch4food

    somuch4food Member

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    Have you read Nathan Hatch's book F*ck portion control?

    It has some good chapters on gut bacteria.

    I do think killing them won't solve anything, they will just come back.

    You have to change gut dysbiosis to gut symbiosis. There might be a storm between the two states.
     
  4. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    No, didn't read it. Could you tell me roughly what he recommends to get rid of bad bacteria ?
     
  5. tca300

    tca300 Member

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    Experiment strictly with different foods until you find out which ones you aren't personally digesting well. Its basically leaving undigested food matter to excessively feed the critters in the digestive tract.
     
  6. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    Histamine and salicylates, so almost everything.

    And I'm constipatet all my life. Might be fat related
     
  7. TeaRex14

    TeaRex14 Member

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    Try some activated charcoal, I'm a real big fan of AC. I know Ray has said a carrot salad and cooked mushrooms are the best for intestinal issues but I responded best to the activated charcoal. I took/take it right before bed, a couple hours after I've eaten my last meal and supplements. I figure this is the best way to do AC without it robbing me of my nutrients. Because AC has a tendency to absorb not just endotoxins but nutrients as well.
     
  8. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    But the charcoal is not getting rid of bacteria , right ? You take it everyday ?
     
  9. TeaRex14

    TeaRex14 Member

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    AC absorbs the byproducts (i.e endotoxins) of the bacteria, which is what's causing all the unwanted side effects. As for the bacteria itself, correcting your metabolism and thyroid will increase your stomach acid and will likely remove the overgrowth. For your constipation, try mixing some cascara with your charcoal. As charcoal by itself might actually make the constipation worse.
     
  10. CLASH

    CLASH Member

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    @Motif
    Minus some of the subjective points of view this is pretty spot on:



    So, essentially increasing the fat in your diet from saturated sources that are long chain may help, it helped me tremendously hormonally and gut wise. Sources include beef tallow, lamb fat, cocoa butter, possibly butter or ghee (these latter two may have a decent dose of hormones if your in the US), coconut oil thrown in for good measure as an addition but doesnt have the same effect. Personally I’ve found about 40-50% of my diet as fat, mostly long chain saturated fatty acids to be helpful.

    I think the fat helps to stimulate intestinal peristalsis and sterilize the small intestine through bile and direct effects as well as protecting the liver and providing a base energy for which sugar can be taken on top of.
     
  11. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    I think fat does the complete opposite to me.

    I only have pretty regular bowels when I take ox bile
     
  12. CLASH

    CLASH Member

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    @Motif
    Fat strongly promotes the release of bile from the gallbladder. How much/ what type have you been eating? How long have you tried it?
     
  13. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    I eat a lot of butter and coconut oil. Fatty cheeses and curd too, but without ox bile I'm super constipatet
     
  14. CLASH

    CLASH Member

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    @Motif
    Fatty cheese can slow down your intestinal peristalsis due to the opiate effect of the casein protein. Curd can do the same.

    Coconut oil doesnt stimulate bile release so its effects are not the same. MCT’s are directly absorbed without bile.

    Butter can bother people due to the hormone content it has depending on where the cows are from, what they ate and when they were milked. The fats in butter are pretty good though.

    I would try beef tallow and/or cocoa butter and I think you will get a much different effect. Both of these can strongly stimulate bile release.
     
  15. OP
    Motif

    Motif Member

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    Ok cool, thx. And avoid all the stuff I mentioned?
     
  16. ecstatichamster

    ecstatichamster Member

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    do you think people with SIBO are hypothyroid?
     
  17. CLASH

    CLASH Member

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    @Motif
    I would test things out individually to see how you feel, its the only way to know. I personally avoid dairy because it doesnt sit well with me. I stick with beef tallow and coconut oil for fats, and beef and seafood for protein. I tried to make dairy work for a year but my body didnt like it, it made me gain weight, become bloated, lowered my sex drive and motivation, and made me super constipated. Plus it gave me slight gyno, acne on my back, and some hair shedding.

    @ecstatichamster
    Is that question for me?
     
  18. Daniel11

    Daniel11 Member

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    Maybe Oregano oil capsules.

    This is good testing.

    “We use the advanced science developed for National Security at the Los Alamos National Lab to identify every strain of every organism (bacteria, viruses, fungi, yeast and mold) in your gut, assess how active these organisms are in your gut, and analyze the nutrients and toxins being produced by these organisms.”

    “We feed all of this information to our state-of-the-art artificial intelligence engine to recommend the exact foods you should be eating and foods you should be minimizing to keep your gut balanced and keep you free from chronic conditions.”

    Our science | Viome
     
  19. Cirion

    Cirion Member

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    My response is gonna be unpopular... at least if there are any hardcore fructose lovers here... but I think it's caused by fructose. More accurately, too much fructose. Many of us here go way overboard with the fructose. Sometime awhile back there was a good discussion on fructose and it seems that < 100 gram fructose a day seems relatively safe for most people, maybe < 50 if you have lots of problems.

    This is my current strategy. We'll see how it goes. I definitely feel more energy when I have increased my glucose relative to my fructose, which implies to me that is healthier than what I was doing. And yes, starch too, as long as it is good sources. Although tonight I'm desperate for glucose so I'm kinda cheating and going for brown rice that is unsprouted. I will make sure to beg forgiveness from RP for my sin later this evening.

    I second the advice from Nate hatch, but honestly his tips haven't been helping me, and I think because of the excess fructose. So, the tips will only work if you fix whatever is causing the problems alongside it otherwise it's like trying to drain the tub while filling it up faster than you're draining it.
     
  20. CLASH

    CLASH Member

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    @Cirion
    I dont neccesarily think your wrong, but i dont think fructose intolerance is whats leading to a constipation based IBS type symptomatology. With fructose intolerance there is generally diarrhea based issues from excess fermentation in the small intestine. The constipation seems to be more associated with dairy in this case considering the opiate effect of casein. Cheese is known to constipate as are narcotic opiate drugs like percocet, morphine, fentanyl etc. Also bile deficiencies are know to cause constipation as well. Liver disease with jaindice generally presents with hard clay colored stools due to lack of bile.

    Also, I wouldnt say fructose excess is the issue even in that case. I would say an abnormally elevated fructose to glucose ratio is the issue. When fructose is 1:1 with glucose there is no issue with absorption except in cases of inherited enzyme deficiency disorders. Its only when fructose goes in excess of glucose in large quantities, depending on the individual, that issues arise.

    The numbers of less than 100g or less than 50g of fructose a day, I believe come from lustigs works in regards to fructose’s supposed pathogenic effects on the liver. I dont think this has to do with intestinal absorption. I also dont think this is an issue at all really. I think the liver, atleast in my experience, can handle large amounts of fructose daily, as long as adequate protein, glucose and nutrients are eaten as well. In the context of a real food diet (meat, fruit, seafood, veg), it would be difficult to get too much excess fructose without those other aspects.

    I would say the biggest realistic issues with fructose are bacterial fermentation, not neccesarily metabolic derangement directly by the sugar. Fructose alone or in purified formats is easily accesible to bacteria and provides a great substrate for growth and multiplication. It is so valuable as an energy source that it is prized by the bacteria, atleast thats the way I see it. Most fructose studies show a rise in portal endotoxin from consumption of purified fructose.

    The solution to the fructose issue is to avoid purified forms and get it through fruits and fruit juice, preferably fruit/ juice sources that have close to a 1:1 ratio of fructose to glucose. I personally use grape juice and pinapple juice but orange juice works as well as long as its tolerated.

    A bit tangential but many people think you can only eat high fat diets or high carb diets, but you cant eat a diet that has an adequate amount of both because they cancel eachother out to some extent when being oxidized for energy. I think this may be somewhat true on a cellular level but on macro organismic level this isnt the case considering carbs and fats have multiple different functions besides pure energy sources. I seem to be doing best on a 40-50% fat, 30-40% carb, 20% protein diet. These percentages match up to some extent with the percentages mentioned in the video above of carnivores, herbivores, and omnivores regardless of the dietary strategy to achieve the macro breakdown.

    @Daniel11
    I think the new microbiome work is going to wind up somewhat like the old human genome work.
     
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