Any One Read The Book Calcium Lie? (Robert Thompson)

[Dave Clark]

Hi @Dave Clark,

In chemistry, elements were originally placed in the same column of the Periodic Table due to their similar properties.

This was later explained by the way electrons arrange themselves in peculiar orbits around the nucleus.

Copper, silver and gold are in the same column. They all have the same number of electrons in their outermost shell - the part of the atom that interacts with other atoms.

Eg. Copper and gold have a similar property in that they have pretty colours in their metallic state, whereas most other metals look like stainless steel.

We might expect cells to sometimes deal with silver and copper in similar ways, yet get slightly different results.

Another example is cadmium or mercury being toxic because they can displace zinc, but they don't always behave like zinc.

The body can deal somewhat with common metals in the same column like sodium vs potassium, or calcium vs magnesium, though we should probably consume them in the genetically expected proportions!

Heavy metals are rare, and there may not be any systems to detect and reject the impostor elements!

I wouldn't eat silver or gold foil on fancy chocolate cakes unless you want royal medical problems!

Thanks. funny you should post this, I just happened to watch a video with Thompson where he eluded to what you are saying. It sounds good in theory, however, I wonder if clinically it is relevant. I know some people use silver on an on-going basis, but I think most people gravitate to it when they are challenged with microbes, etc. Some experts do not like nano-liver, because it is a nano molecule, but the nano-silver has only very small amounts of silver, so maybe it wouldn't have the same competing problems.

 

[dreamcatcher]

Hi @Dave Clark,

In chemistry, elements were originally placed in the same column of the Periodic Table due to their similar properties.

This was later explained by the way electrons arrange themselves in peculiar orbits around the nucleus.

Copper, silver and gold are in the same column. They all have the same number of electrons in their outermost shell - the part of the atom that interacts with other atoms.

Eg. Copper and gold have a similar property in that they have pretty colours in their metallic state, whereas most other metals look like stainless steel.

We might expect cells to sometimes deal with silver and copper in similar ways, yet get slightly different results.

Another example is cadmium or mercury being toxic because they can displace zinc, but they don't always behave like zinc.

The body can deal somewhat with common metals in the same column like sodium vs potassium, or calcium vs magnesium, though we should probably consume them in the genetically expected proportions!

Heavy metals are rare, and there may not be any systems to detect and reject the impostor elements!

I wouldn't eat silver or gold foil on fancy chocolate cakes unless you want royal medical problems!

Excellent. Can you elaborate on the 'we should probably consume them in the genetically expected proportions!'? What do you eat @Richiebogie ? Thank you.

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @cinderella,

I'm not sure what the perfect nutrient proportions are for a human.

It could be that we are best on a mostly vegetarian high glucose, low fat, low protein diet, OR a mostly carnivorous low glucose, high fat, moderate protein diet... not both at once!

According to "The Calcium Lie", we are over-consuming calcium relative to other nutrients.

I'm not sure if Robert Thompson believes that the daily allowances of calcium are too high, and were set this high in order to promote the dairy industry.

There are a couple of other writers who promote low calcium. Are you avoiding dairy or just calcium supplements?

 

[Collden]

This guy claims ascorbic acid is useless because its actually the other molecules complexed to ascorbic acid that are having the "Vitamin C" effect. How does he account for animals synthesising such vast quantities of ascorbic acid? I doubt they are synthesising the various co-factors like tyrosinase or bioflavanoids (or all those minerals) to match this production.

 

[dreamcatcher]

Hi @cinderella,

I'm not sure what the perfect nutrient proportions are for a human.

It could be that we are best on a mostly vegetarian high glucose, low fat, low protein diet, OR a mostly carnivorous low glucose, high fat, moderate protein diet... not both at once!

According to "The Calcium Lie", we are over-consuming calcium relative to other nutrients.

I'm not sure if Robert Thompson believes that the daily allowances of calcium are too high, and were set this high in order to promote the dairy industry.

There are a couple of other writers who promote low calcium. Are you avoiding dairy or just calcium supplements?

Hi @Richiebogie thank you for your reply!
Dr Thompson doesn't recommend dairy products in general, he thinks that most people have excess calcium levels; which he tests via a hair mineral analysis. (He recommends ionic trace minerals by Trace Minerals which contain more than 72 minerals that our body needs. He believes that our soil doesn't provide enough nutrients anymore and sea minerals contain minerals essential for the human body in a balanced form.)
I stopped consuming dairy products after reading his book. I also had a hair mineral analysis and according to the test, my calcium levels are above normal. Interestingly, I developed arthritis in my fingers during the time when I used to drink 2 litres of milk daily along with other dairy products..I no longer have it.
I agree that a combined high fat high sugar diet is detrimental to one's health.

 

[dreamcatcher]

Hi @cinderella,

I'm not sure what the perfect nutrient proportions are for a human.

It could be that we are best on a mostly vegetarian high glucose, low fat, low protein diet, OR a mostly carnivorous low glucose, high fat, moderate protein diet... not both at once!

According to "The Calcium Lie", we are over-consuming calcium relative to other nutrients.

I'm not sure if Robert Thompson believes that the daily allowances of calcium are too high, and were set this high in order to promote the dairy industry.

There are a couple of other writers who promote low calcium. Are you avoiding dairy or just calcium supplements?

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @cinderella,

Thanks for the page scans.

I recently gave up chocolate, tea and coffee which got rid of my asthmatic wheezing which would occur as the caffeine, theobromine & theophylline wore off each morning!

I had been eating more than 100g of 70% cocoa dark chocolate each day, so I started eating butter to replace the saturated fats from chocolate.
Butter seems quite filling / satisfying.

After a few weeks on butter I reintroduced aged cheddar cheese for the calcium and vitamin k2, but on about day 4 of cheese I have an excessively runny nose.

They say dairy is mucus-forming. Which component do they blame for that? Milk has peculiar components with odd sugars like lactose, strange proteins, hormones, fats... Could it be the excessive calcium?

I will try dropping the cheese and going back to keeping butter as my sole dairy product.

Maybe I would do better with coconut oil instead of butter! That would be another test!!!

That's great you got rid of your athritis.

Are you eating more sea salt or are you having more seafood since studying Dr Thompson?

 

[dreamcatcher]

Hi @cinderella,

Thanks for the page scans.

I recently gave up chocolate, tea and coffee which got rid of my asthmatic wheezing which would occur as the caffeine, theobromine & theophylline wore off each morning!

I had been eating more than 100g of 70% cocoa dark chocolate each day, so I started eating butter to replace the saturated fats from chocolate.
Butter seems quite filling / satisfying.

After a few weeks on butter I reintroduced aged cheddar cheese for the calcium and vitamin k2, but on about day 4 of cheese I have an excessively runny nose.

They say dairy is mucus-forming. Which component do they blame for that? Milk has peculiar components with odd sugars like lactose, strange proteins, hormones, fats... Could it be the excessive calcium?

I will try dropping the cheese and going back to keeping butter as my sole dairy product.

Maybe I would do better with coconut oil instead of butter! That would be another test!!!

That's great you got rid of your athritis.

Are you eating more sea salt or are you having more seafood since studying Dr Thompson?

Hi @Richiebogie

It's really good that you found some relief from the asthmatic symptoms by excluding certain foods.

I think aged cheeses can cause a histamine reaction. I'm not too worried about the calcium atm. Have you tried cooking with homemade ghee?

I don't know which component of the milk causes the mucus but I do know that it is believed in ayurveda and Chinese medicine that milk is damp by nature and mucus forming. It is advised to avoid milk products for people who are having a cold for instance or who are heavier built by nature.

Lately, I try to eat a wide variety of foods which are not necessarily approved by Dr Peat. But since my hair greatly deteriorated since the last 5 years on the Ray Peat diet, I decided to experiment.
These are small amounts of nuts and seeds, lots of vegetables, avocado and fatty fish and some grains, such as buckwheat and quinoa..no dairy for now. I also reintroduced some green powders: moringa, kelp, barley grass, wheat grass, chlorella and spirulina which I add to water or homemade smoothies. The texture of my hair has changed since adding these. It is the first time in my life having really silky hair. Perhaps I was low in iodine. I stopped using shampoo recently as well and only wash my hair with a mixture of eggs, ashwaghanda powder and chickpea flour; and condition it with camomile tea. The water is really hard in the area I live. Even though I removed the water filter about a month ago, I'm surprised that my hair is very soft and manageable. Even the elastic band falls out of my hair.

I removed all sugars and lowered fructose from fruits and since then the 10 year long persistent insomnia is gone.

I normally use pink Himalayan salt and Utah Sea Minerals by Trace Minerals. I also have sea salt mixed with different seaweeds.

What I follow today, I might not follow tomorrow. I used thyroid supplements recommended by Dr Peat but stopped using all about a month ago.

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @cinderella,

Sounds like you are doing well on your latest way of eating. I have been avoiding greens but I will test reintroducing them soon. Are you eating raw or cooked nuts and seeds?

Are you eating any animal products?

After a week I have found that cheese does not agree with me. I can probably get by with a little butter but not too much!

Which low fructose fruits if any are you eating?

Are you sharing your diet with a partner, a parent or any children?

It would be good to know if it is working for others.

 

[dreamcatcher]

Hi @Richiebogie

What's the reason that you're avoiding greens?

I normally soak the nuts overnight before eating them raw. Dr Thompson thinks that if nuts are roasted, they lose almost all their nutritional value and become toxic, oxidized, rancid fat like you find in virtually all store bought peanut butter.

Yes, I eat eggs; meat, mostly beef, lamb and chicken; and all types of fishes/seafood. Sometimes I would eat pigs feet.

Hope you can enjoy butter as much as you like.

I eat berries and seasonal fruits-atm. gooseberries, and some bananas when I crave sugar.
I sometimes soak chia seeds in coconut milk and eat it as a dessert.

I take stabilised rice bran daily as it contains a lot of vitamins and minerals.

My daughter who lives with me would eat anything I do, since she's still little. She doesn't eat junk food 99% of the time. She's healthy and energetic. Since I stopped eating dairy products, she doesn't want it either most of the times, and I let her decide what's best for her body. Previously I kept telling her to drink more milk and eat more cheese because I was concerned about the health of her teeth. Some of the enamels are missing from her baby teeth, probably as a consequence of my poor health during pregnancy, and as a side effect of the antibiotics I received through my veins for a few hours on the day she was born.

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @cinderella,

I think the grass-fed butter may have been affecting my sinuses too! Butter is low in calcium and high in fat soluble vitamins. It may be excess vitamin A causing the issue... Have you read the threads on the possible dangers of too much vitamin A and beta carotene? Grant Genereux thinks that these accumulate in the liver over time until it is suddenly overwhelmed!

Anyway the highest sources of vitamin A (and its precursors) are liver, butter, carrot, sweet potato, pumpkin and leafy greens, so I might go lightly with these for a while!

Greens also contain oxalates which lock up nutrients like magnesium! Maybe their bitter flavours are a warning they are not "mother's milk"!

Are you sure your healthy hair requires greens? They do contain vitamin k which may be good.

Bran contains phytates which also lock up nutrients like zinc, but bran is a good source of vitamins as you say! Polished rice without any bran was found to cause a lot of sickness and death amongst early 20th century Asians.

Do you consume the greens and bran separately from other food? That may help you get the benefits without the negatives.

Of course if you are feeling better than ever then maybe the above theories are wrong!

(I might try some brown rice cakes from time to time!)

 

[Richiebogie]

I also reintroduced some green powders: moringa, kelp, barley grass, wheat grass, chlorella and spirulina which I add to water or homemade smoothies.

I just reread your post. Your green powders don't include the greens I was thinking of, like spinach, Swiss chard (silverbeet), arugula (rocket), lettuce, mixed herbs etc.

I haven't experimented with those foods you mention!

 

[RWilly]

From the Textbook of Natural Medicine:

"Hair calcium and magnesium values were found to be elevated in
patients with fibromyalgia. 49 High hair calcium content has been
associated with a reduced risk of coronary heart disease. 50 Low
hair calcium content has been found in the last trimester of preg-
nancy, 51 but hair calcium content increased in response to supple-
mentation during pregnancy. 52 Low hair magnesium levels have
been reported in autistic children, children with attention deficit
hyperactivity disorder, patients with various skin disorders, and
patients with several types of leukemia, whereas high levels have
been reported in conjunction with dyslexia and Prader-Willi syn-
drome. 12,17,18,53 " 55 The meaning of these associations remains
unknown for the most part.

A 2001 study concluded that analysis of hair calcium and phos-
phorus content was of value as a complementary detection tool in
abnormalities of bone metabolism. 56 Elevations in both calcium
and magnesium were correlated with a low dietary calcium/mag-
nesium ratio in one study, suggesting that this finding may be
indicative of an induced hyperparathyroidism, 57 but that hypoth-
esis remains unproven. Hair calcium and magnesium also vary in
response to the hardness and pH of the water in which the hair is
usually washed. 50 Supplementation of dietary magnesium has
been reported to increase hair magnesium levels in deficient chil-
dren. 58 Nonetheless, in one study of congenital hypomagnesemia,
researchers concluded that hair magnesium level was not a useful
tool in monitoring mineral status because the values were higher
in affected subjects than in subjects who were not deficient. 59

There is limited evidence to support the use of hair calcium and
magnesium measurements in clinical diagnosis at this time."

 

[RWilly]

Vitamin C eventually turns into oxalates ...