Antihistamines - Block Choline, Stop Working, SSRI-like, Anhedonia?

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I'm now taking diphenhydramine, was taking cypro.

Some studies seem to suggest these drugs are SSRI-like.

Also, they block choline metabolism somehow, which can be very bad.

And I've noticed they blunt my sex drive and make me feel less in my body when I take them.

http://www.medical-hypotheses.com/article/S0306-9877(05)00647-X/fulltext
Some old antihistamines were selective serotonin-reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) and the SSRI effect was discovered by Nobel Laureate Professor Arvid Carlsson as early as 1969. Chlorpheniramine was the most active of the tested drugs, and it compares favourably with amitriptyline and imipramine with respect to actions on both serotonergic and noradrenergic neurons. Chlorpheniramine can be called a SSRI, since the blocking of 5HT is stronger than the effect on noradrenaline neurons; however it might also be called a selective serotonin and noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor (SSNRI) and be compared with new drugs, such as venlafaxine. Carlsson suggested the potential value of clinical studies of the antidepressant properties of this and related antihistamine drugs. But, in the event, no such trials were ever performed at the time. However, later clinical observations of the benefits of dex-chlorpheniramine treatment in panic disorder have been published. Clinical experience suggests that patients using chlorpheniramine, and having also a concomitant depression or panic disorder, may experience a return of symptoms when their old drug is changed to a new antihistamine lacking SSRI effects. Yet this phenomenon is not known to many doctors, and even less known to the large number of patients buying chlorpheniramine under various trade names over-the-counter (OTC) at a low price for self-treatment of hay fewer or as a cold remedy. Chlorpheniramine was introduced in USA under the name Chlor-Trimeton as long ago as July 1950, and is still on the market. Therefore, this SSRI is now over 50 years old. If chlorpheniramine had been tested in depression in the nineteen seventies, it is probable that a safe, inexpensive SSRI drug could have been used some 15 years earlier than fluoxetine – which became available in 1987. Chlorpheniramine might have been the first safe, non-cardiotoxic and well-tolerated antidepressant. Billions of dollars in the development and marketing costs would have been saved, and the suffering of millions of patients alleviated.
 

InChristAlone

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Yes Cypro may be similar to chlorpheniramine. I know someone who said she didn't like the side effects of cypro and took chlor instead and it really helped her anxiety attacks. She thought it was because of histamine intolerance that antihistamines work for her. She was able to go off unless she drank red wine by taking methionine everyday. These drugs can be pretty complex! I've been on cypro at .5 mg a day for almost 6 months, I now have some buzzing in my head at times, kinda similar to when I went cold turkey off an SSRI. :cyclops: But it works for me so I don't want to go off.
 
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People take high dose diphenhydramine to trip and they all say they see and feel spiders and bugs. Pretty odd that almost all of them say that.
 
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ecstatichamster
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that is weird, @Westside PUFAs and that wouldn't attract me to it, LOL.

The anhedonic sexual effects are very evident for me with both Cypro and diphenhydramine.

SSRIs are prescribed for premature ejaculation and I wonder if these wouldn't do the same thing.
 

InChristAlone

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Maybe it has to do with histamine. Apparently high histamine causes fast orgasms. My pleasure is fine on cypro and nothing like when I took an SSRI which for sure causes difficulty with orgasms.
 
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I always dream of bugs or snakes when I overdose on starch+fat
 

mujuro

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I have been taking chlorpheniramine for the last 2 days for this damn cold. I notice an immediate but profound elevation of mood. It almost feels like alcohol but without the intoxicating heaviness and cognitive impairment.

This is interesting: Chlorpheniramine and escitalopram: Similar antidepressant and nitric oxide lowering roles in a mouse model of anxiety

"To the best of our knowledge, this is the first study demonstrating the antioxidant effects of CPA. A novel finding in the current study was the ability of CPA treatment to normalise the stress‑induced increase in serum NOx."
 

Mr.Tayto

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Cyproheptadine caused a few weird problems for me; no pump in the gym, no zest for life, i think it may have lowered my testosterone but i cant prove it but it feels like it, found it hard to sleep on it too got some mild brain zaps everytime i was drifting off to sleep.

Definitely felt like it messed with my cognitive aswell. I was day dreaming alot and finding it hard to process information at work almost to where is was thinking "Holy ****, am i getting Alzhiemers disease or something".

This went on for months after only taking it 6 times.

Only good thing i noticed was i was taking really good poo's.

Anyways thats my 2 cents on cypro, but careful with it and just becuase it works for others doesnt mean it will for you.
 

Grapelander

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I get a bloody mouth from taking antihistamines for more than a day or so. Too bad because the sleep is great.
 

TucsonJJ

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I have been taking chlorpheniramine for the last 2 days for this damn cold. I notice an immediate but profound elevation of mood. It almost feels like alcohol but without the intoxicating heaviness and cognitive impairment.

This is interesting: Chlorpheniramine and escitalopram: Similar antidepressant and nitric oxide lowering roles in a mouse model of anxiety

"To the best of our knowledge, this is the first study demonstrating the antioxidant effects of CPA. A novel finding in the current study was the ability of CPA treatment to normalise the stress‑induced increase in serum NOx."
Still here?? I wonder why serotonin is considered to be so bad, when chlorpheniramine makes me feel good, even at doses of 2-4mg. Perhaps the SSRI/serotonin effects only come with high doses, sort of like with methylene blue? I read that chlorpheniramine is actually more like a SNRI? Does that mean less serotonigenic?
Plus, so many millions have taken various SSRI drugs with tremendous success, for 20 years+... ??
(Yes, many have also had some bad problems with them)
 

TucsonJJ

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there are a bunch of studies on these being harmful as anticholinergics.

Anticholinergic Use, Cognition, Brain Metabolism, and Brain Atrophy
Conclusions and Relevance The use of AC medication was associated with increased brain atrophy and dysfunction and clinical decline. Thus, use of AC medication among older adults should likely be discouraged if alternative therapies are available.
Sounds too simple... but would supplementing choline reduce risk/effects?
 

TucsonJJ

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I'm now taking diphenhydramine, was taking cypro.

Some studies seem to suggest these drugs are SSRI-like.

Also, they block choline metabolism somehow, which can be very bad.

And I've noticed they blunt my sex drive and make me feel less in my body when I take them.

http://www.medical-hypotheses.com/article/S0306-9877(05)00647-X/fulltext
Some old antihistamines were selective serotonin-reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) and the SSRI effect was discovered by Nobel Laureate Professor Arvid Carlsson as early as 1969. Chlorpheniramine was the most active of the tested drugs, and it compares favourably with amitriptyline and imipramine with respect to actions on both serotonergic and noradrenergic neurons. Chlorpheniramine can be called a SSRI, since the blocking of 5HT is stronger than the effect on noradrenaline neurons; however it might also be called a selective serotonin and noradrenaline reuptake inhibitor (SSNRI) and be compared with new drugs, such as venlafaxine. Carlsson suggested the potential value of clinical studies of the antidepressant properties of this and related antihistamine drugs. But, in the event, no such trials were ever performed at the time. However, later clinical observations of the benefits of dex-chlorpheniramine treatment in panic disorder have been published. Clinical experience suggests that patients using chlorpheniramine, and having also a concomitant depression or panic disorder, may experience a return of symptoms when their old drug is changed to a new antihistamine lacking SSRI effects. Yet this phenomenon is not known to many doctors, and even less known to the large number of patients buying chlorpheniramine under various trade names over-the-counter (OTC) at a low price for self-treatment of hay fewer or as a cold remedy. Chlorpheniramine was introduced in USA under the name Chlor-Trimeton as long ago as July 1950, and is still on the market. Therefore, this SSRI is now over 50 years old. If chlorpheniramine had been tested in depression in the nineteen seventies, it is probable that a safe, inexpensive SSRI drug could have been used some 15 years earlier than fluoxetine – which became available in 1987. Chlorpheniramine might have been the first safe, non-cardiotoxic and well-tolerated antidepressant. Billions of dollars in the development and marketing costs would have been saved, and the suffering of millions of patients alleviated.
So... chlorpheniramine is a serotonin agonist? Which Peaters like Dinkov really hate? Even though as you said, the suffering of millions of patients might have been alleviated? It also reduces nitric Oxide, which is good... and some here think anticholine drugs are fine... Jeeze!!
Your above quote is from one who likes SSRI drugs... most here hate them, yes?
but what's the bottom line on it... avoid? the latest antihistamines do little to nothing for me, even cause side effects... benadryl works OK, but also can cause sides... I have some Clemastine... but not tried it yet...
I find it to be very relaxing and helps me sleep, but I also have gut issues and don't want serotonin making them even worse.
 

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