Androsterone - Liquid Androsterone For Lab/R&D

[MyUsernameHere]

Rat has tight, painful & somewhat shrunken testicles after a few days of using this. First day he used 10 mg, then 5 mg, then 2 mg but the problem continues and if anything has gotten worse.

Is this suppression? Should he quit? Feels quite good otherwise, so he says.

 

[Dr. B]

Rat has tight, painful & somewhat shrunken testicles after a few days of using this. First day he used 10 mg, then 5 mg, then 2 mg but the problem continues and if anything has gotten worse.

Is this suppression? Should he quit? Feels quite good otherwise, so he says.

was anything else changed or used, any significant diet, environment changes etc

 

[Charger]

Rat has tight, painful & somewhat shrunken testicles after a few days of using this. First day he used 10 mg, then 5 mg, then 2 mg but the problem continues and if anything has gotten worse.

Is this suppression? Should he quit? Feels quite good otherwise, so he says.

Sounds like it, 10mg and 5mg are huge doses, imo. 1mg is effective enough for me.

 

[johnwester130]

Rat has tight, painful & somewhat shrunken testicles after a few days of using this. First day he used 10 mg, then 5 mg, then 2 mg but the problem continues and if anything has gotten worse.

Is this suppression? Should he quit? Feels quite good otherwise, so he says.

It also has potent pheromone qualities that can be dangerous

Bad reactions to high dose Androsterone

In my time experimenting with 'mones, there are only two products that have caused people to react negatively towards me: 1) was Alter Ego, which contains only three pheromones in an explicitly stated

pherotruth.com

 

[MyUsernameHere]

was anything else changed or used, any significant diet, environment changes etc

Not much else changed. Rat still has painful nuts 2nd day after quitting. Added some Vitamin E and pregnenolone in low dose, but if it doesn't get better he says he will jump on tamoxifen.

 

[Andyjw]

Great sleep aid,

Hi, I use 2-3 drops under my tongue, 2-3 hours before bed.

I get deeper, more restful sleep. Great sleep aid.

Cheers,

Andrew

 

[japanesedude]

Not much else changed. Rat still has painful nuts 2nd day after quitting. Added some Vitamin E and pregnenolone in low dose, but if it doesn't get better he says he will jump on tamoxifen.

you probably are having mild supression. your endogenous testosterone production will recover quickly after stop taking Androsterone.
I have used Androsterone(1mg~2mg) and Proviron(6.25mg up to 25mg) on and off and I always ended up having mild shutdown If I use them for atleast a week. However, my body always recoverd within 2 weeks after quit taking them. I did not take Pregnenolone or DHEA at the time.

 

[AnonE]

Hey I was looking to try this out, mainly as a light steroidal substance to help with weightlifting. Some questions I couldn't find on the first few pages, apologies if they've been covered.

1) is this 1-Andro or 4-Andro?

2) what's the recommended dosage protocol for an average sized male, and how? Is it e.g. 1 drop under tongue?

3) what are the most common side effects to look out for?

4) is some sort of "post cycle therapy" needed, i.e. is there HPTA suppression coming off this product? At what dosages?

Thx.

 

[AnonE]

I got a response from idealabsdc customer support on some questions, in case anyone is interested -

"The only thing we can say is that it is neither 1-andro nor 4-andro. Those are analogues of DHEA, which is also called 5-andro. Our product is fully saturated 3a-5a-androstane-3-ol-17-one. "

Well I don't really understand this tbh. When I did some web searches for androsterone, I saw vids of bodybuilder dudes talking about 1-andro and 4-andro versions and their trade-offs, and they described them as pretty intense and potentially dangerous, liver toxic, etc. So if this is different, that's... good? But I don't understand how it's different. I would be interested in someone more knowledgeable contrasting with the bodybuilding andros.

"When using generic androsterone, if no more than 8mg-10mg are used and some pregnenolone and/or DHEA are also taken with it, there is little risk of suppression or need for PCT."

Hmm, why would pregnenolone and/or DHEA be needed? Are they needed to prevent suppression? Do preg/DHEA cause any suppression themselves? (and btw, we're talking about daily doses here right?)

Many questions... would love to understand this stuff better.

 

[Judd Crane]

I would use only the androsterone on the gyno and the Pansterone on the scrotum. Can be used the same time, but I would only put the androsterone on the gyno.

Any opinion on progesterone on the gynp? If I may sidebar.

 

[Nokoni]

In addition to all the beneficial systemic effects covered in this thread, andro is also very good as a topical for joints. Ray tells the story of a friend who could barely get up his steps and he had the guy put progesterone on his knees and the next day he bounded up those same steps. So I use andro, pansterone, and progesterone on my neck, back, knees, and feet and it makes a huge difference. But for me the andro works best. Anybody with mobility issues might see significant improvement. I certainly have.

 

[Vajra]

I believe that progesterone apply on gyno would eliminates my gyno.
but the question is I don't know How much I would use.
It is not proper topic to talk about Progesterone. but I really wanna know.

Old post, but ik you've been working on this. What's your opinion on proesterone concerning gyno? Can it reverse it? Cause it?

 

[Blazko]

Is anyone familiar with how androsterone acetate is biosynthesized?

 

[tommyg130]

EDIT: Since I keep getting questions about androsterone, here is Ray's response when asked about it:
Ray Peat Email Advice Depository Discussion/Comment Thread
"...I think it would be safe enough to try in treating cancer or brain degenerative diseases."

Here is one reference that gives backing to his statement above:
Antitumor Steroids - ScienceDirect
"...Androsterone (11) effected a 63% inhbition of bronchiogenic carcinoma A-42, 42% inhibition of epidermoid carcinoma HEp3, 81% inhibition of sarcoma HS1, and 35% inhbition of intestinal adenocarcinoma HAd1, all tested in egg [9]."

Unlike other products that we have released over the years, this one is almost completely unknown outside bodybuilding circles. Even among die-hard bodybuilders it is mostly known as its ability to function as pro-hormone for more potent androgens like DHT and 5-androstanedione. See attached images for the pathways of androsterone conversion back into androgens like DHT.

Inactivation of androgens by UDP-glucuronosyltransferase enzymes in humans. - PubMed - NCBI
The backdoor pathway to dihydrotestosterone. - PubMed - NCBI
"...Because androsterone is an efficient precursor of DHT, a moderate production rate might produce a considerable physiological effect, even if androsterone is not the most abundant 19-carbon steroid produced in 21OHD."

Androsterone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"...Androsterone, or 3α-hydroxy-5α-androstan-17-one, is an endogenous steroid hormone, neurosteroid, and putative pheromone.[1] It is a weak androgen with a potency that is approximately 1/7th that of testosterone.[2]In addition, it can be converted to dihydrotestosterone (DHT) from 3α-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase and 17β-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase, bypassing conventional intermediates such as androstenedione and testosterone, and as such, can be considered to be a metabolic intermediate in its own right.[3][4] Androsterone is also known to be an inhibitory androstane neurosteroid,[5][6] acting as a positive allosteric modulator of theGABAA receptor,[7] and possesses anticonvulsant effects.[8] The unnatural enantiomer of androsterone is more potent as a positive allosteric modulator of GABAA receptors and as an anticonvulsant than the natural form.[9] Androsterone's 3β-isomer is epiandrosterone, and its 5β-epimer is etiocholanolone."

Dihydrotestosterone synthesis pathways from inactive androgen 5α-androstane-3β,17β-diol in prostate cancer cells: Inhibition of intratumoural 3β-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase activities by abiraterone : Scientific Reports
Androgen deprivation promotes intratumoral synthesis of dihydrotestosterone from androgen metabolites in prostate cancer
Dihydrotestosterone synthesis bypasses testosterone to drive castration-resistant prostate cancer
"...The four 5α-reduced 19-carbon steroids [5α-dione, DHT, androsterone, and Adiol] are interconvertible through reversible reactions (Fig. 1). Comparison of the accumulation of total 5α-reduced steroids with [3H]-AD and [3H]-T treatments further shows that AD→5α-dione is the dominant entryway to 5α-reduced steroids (Fig. 2E)."

However, androsterone is a very interesting steroid in its own right and for a lack of a better analogy I would call it the "mirror image of DHT" due to identical structure but with reversed functional groups. It also seems to share quite a few of progesterone's effects - i.e. anti-estrogenic, sedative, anti-convulsant, pro-thyroid, pro-metabolic, brain protective, promoting insulin sensitivity, anti-adrenaline, anti-cortisol, anti-cancer, anti-depressant, etc. Some studies have gone as far as to suggest that it is androsterone that is the actual steroid with real metabolic activity while all other steroids before it in the pathways (including T and DHT) are the actual pro-hormones.

Studies with Androsterone-3-3H,4-14C | The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism | Oxford Academic
"...These two studies demonstrate the surprising extent to which an important, biologically active, hormone metabolite is further utilized in vivo in man. They raise many further problems. Perhaps the most important of these is the fate of the large portion that was not detected in urine or feces. From the extent of the oxidation of the C-3 hydroxyl group, it might be concluded that a part of the androsterone could serve an important function in man as the coenzyme in a transhydrogenase system, as has indeed been demonstrated with bacterial (15) and rat liver (16) preparations."
"...In view of its biological activity and its participation in oxidation-reduction systems, it seems clear that androsterone may have metabolic functions equal to those of the hormones which generate it. Since, with the exception of testosterone, the physiological role of the other androgens is unclear, it is perhaps not too speculative to suggest that one function of these hormones may be the production of this important "metabolite."

Unlike progesterone androsterone does not have the potential for anti-androgenic effects of high doses progesterone in males. It is truly a pity that this amazing chemical saw so much research in the middle of the 20th century and even wild commercial success as the drug Atromid, only to be forgotten and replaced by much more toxic alternatives.

Disclaimer: The fact that this post and product description contain quotes from Ray Peat does not mean he endorses/approves of this product. His opinions on a chemical may change when new evidence becomes available in the future, so future inquiries about a chemical, solvent, ingredients, etc contained in this product may elicit a different response than his quotes included in this post. Please seek his opinion independently on any chemical, solvent, ingredient, etc that you may have concerns/questions about.

The units listed on the label are just for measurement purposes. They do not indicate or suggest optimal dose. Please note that similar to the products sold by companies like BlueSky, this product if for lab/research use only. The product can be ordered from the link below:
http://www.idealabsdc.com/lab

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Androsterone is an androgenic steroid derived via the activity of the enzyme 5-AR and is a donwstream metabolite of the more potent androgen DHT. Like all 5-AR derived androgens, androsterone displays anti-estrogenic and anti-glucocorticoid activity and in addition serves as a pro-hormone for DHT and other potent androgens. In addition, androsterone is a neurosteroid with potent GABA agonist activity, and is known to function as a pheromone in many animal species including humans. It has been shown to possess anti-depressant and anti-proliferative effects. Perhaps most importantly, it has been found to act like as a potent thyroid mimetic / surrogate and as such to increase basal temperature, oxygen consumption and lower lipid levels in humans.

Drops per container: about 240
Each drop contains the following ingredients:

Androsterone: 1 mg

Other ingredients: add product to shopping cart to see info
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References:

1. Androgenic / pro-sexual
Remarkable Synergistic Anabolic /androgenic Effect Of Androsterone And DHEA Combination
Androsterone - Androgenic Neurosteroid Required For Male Sexual Behavior
Androsterone - The Legal Pro-hormone For Potent 5-AR Derived Androgens

2. Anti-estrogenic
Androsterone - A Potent Steroidal Aromatase Inhibitor

3. Thyroid mimetic / surrogate
Androsterone - The Forgotten But Potent Thyroid Mimetic
Androsterone Is A Potent Agonist / Activator Of The Farnesoid X Receptor (FXR)

4. Anti-adrenaline
Androsterone Inhibits Catecholamine Release

5. Anti-cancer
Androsterone - A Neurosteroid With Anti-cancer Activity

6. Insulin resistance / sensitivity, diabetes
Androsterone - A Potential Treatment For Insulin Resistance And Diabetes

7. Neurosteroid / Mood
Androsterone - An Andidepressant Neurosteroid
The Antidepressant Mechanism Of Androsterone
Androsterone - A Potent Anxiolytic, Sedative, And Anti-convulsant Neurosteroid

Hey haidut, does androsterone need to be refrigerated ? I notice it is more similar to progest-e then thyroid in texture and protest e gets refrigerated

 

[Cameron]

Anyone have success with androsterone on the naval? Just curious about recent updates

 

[Infinite]

So there seems to be a sweet spot for using Andro to reap the most benefits, and overdoing it comes with some side effects.
It is a powerful substance, and I think younger guys need less.

1-3mg / week results all the androgenic benefits
5+mg / week results in reduction of erections and less interest in the opposite sex.

Are you still using it at the 1-3mg/week dose?

 

[I'm.No.One]

Anyone use this on their female rats with low T?

 

[undecided0]

I started 1 drop topical tocopherols yesterday in hopes of reducing mild gyno (mostly on left side) and the effects were great, strong anti-depressant effect and incredible stress resilience. My nipples weren’t puffy so I’ll take that as a sign. Felt strong weight behind every word I said and my body language must have changed because people kept giving me so much attention when I talked, like the room would go quiet. Very weird and I don’t think it’s pheromones maybe just much more confident and projecting.

But… the insomnia and muscle twitching were so extreme I just pulled an all nighter. I ate nearly 5000 calories yesterday of high quality foods, took extra magnesium, potassium was high, calcium was high, I don’t think I’m missing any electrolytes.

Is this related to cortisol? Any ideas on how to stop the wired feeling? It’s the next day now and I’m still really wired. It’s probably something nutrition related. I did try StressNon a few drops to calm my mind down but it didn’t do much. It’s not anxiety at all - quite the opposite. Almost like the absence of anxiety was keeping me up. I don’t usually have insomnia issues with even drinking coffee before bed.

 

[Matestube]

I started 1 drop topical tocopherols yesterday in hopes of reducing mild gyno (mostly on left side) and the effects were great, strong anti-depressant effect and incredible stress resilience. My nipples weren’t puffy so I’ll take that as a sign. Felt strong weight behind every word I said and my body language must have changed because people kept giving me so much attention when I talked, like the room would go quiet. Very weird and I don’t think it’s pheromones maybe just much more confident and projecting.

But… the insomnia and muscle twitching were so extreme I just pulled an all nighter. I ate nearly 5000 calories yesterday of high quality foods, took extra magnesium, potassium was high, calcium was high, I don’t think I’m missing any electrolytes.

Is this related to cortisol? Any ideas on how to stop the wired feeling? It’s the next day now and I’m still really wired. It’s probably something nutrition related. I did try StressNon a few drops to calm my mind down but it didn’t do much. It’s not anxiety at all - quite the opposite. Almost like the absence of anxiety was keeping me up. I don’t usually have insomnia issues with even drinking coffee before bed.

I'm amazed that with Haidut's products, people are so in tune with their body that they can feel the effects of only one drop (how many mg is that?).
I'm not being sarcastic, I mean it.

With massive testosterone doses, I feel euphoria and confidence, but I barely feel anything with a few mg of DHT.

 

[laleto12]

I'm amazed that with Haidut's products, people are so in tune with their body that they can feel the effects of only one drop (how many mg is that?).
I'm not being sarcastic, I mean it.

With massive testosterone doses, I feel euphoria and confidence, but I barely feel anything with a few mg of DHT.

are you the user theBeard? just asking no bad intentions