Aging seems to progress in discrete steps - at 34, 60, 78 years

andrewlee224

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According to this study which analysed proteins in blood: Stanford scientists reliably predict people’s age by measuring proteins in blood

This would strongly point at programmed aging, rather than driven strictly by metabolism, no?
As much as I appreciate Ray's work and agree with his methods to increase metabolism and health, I can't see how aging is not programmed and therefore a different intervention is needed to really extend lifespan..
There are animals which do not seem to age, apparently lobsters are getting more virile with age and do not show signs of aging, but at some point they can't grow their shell to the needed size anymore. Does that mean that lobsters have perfect metabolism? I don't think so.

If it wasn't programmed surely we would see more variation than just a hard stop at 120 years.
 

baccheion

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According to this study which analysed proteins in blood: Stanford scientists reliably predict people’s age by measuring proteins in blood

This would strongly point at programmed aging, rather than driven strictly by metabolism, no?
As much as I appreciate Ray's work and agree with his methods to increase metabolism and health, I can't see how aging is not programmed and therefore a different intervention is needed to really extend lifespan..
There are animals which do not seem to age, apparently lobsters are getting more virile with age and do not show signs of aging, but at some point they can't grow their shell to the needed size anymore. Does that mean that lobsters have perfect metabolism? I don't think so.

If it wasn't programmed surely we would see more variation than just a hard stop at 120 years.
Maybe they did figure it out with the melatonin + DHEA theory. Melatonin's successor may be epitalon.
 

tankasnowgod

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This would strongly point at programmed aging, rather than driven strictly by metabolism, no?
As much as I appreciate Ray's work and agree with his methods to increase metabolism and health, I can't see how aging is not programmed and therefore a different intervention is needed to really extend lifespan..

I don't know how you came to this conclusion. What, from that article, could possibly make you think aging is "programmed?"

If anything, I think this line would suggest the exact opposite-

This happens because instead of simply increasing or decreasing steadily or staying the same throughout life, the levels of many proteins remain constant for a while and then at one point or another undergo sudden upward or downward shifts. These shifts tend to bunch up at three separate points in a person’s life: young adulthood, late middle age and old age.

That, to me, suggests outside interference, or poor maintenance.

If it wasn't programmed surely we would see more variation than just a hard stop at 120 years.

Um, but we don't see that. The "120 year myth" is just something that some random people made up, and has been surpassed plenty of times. It's not like most people live to 120 and then suddenly drop dead like Gordon Shumway. Truth is, most people don't even make it to 90 or 100, let alone 120.
 
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andrewlee224

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I don't know how you came to this conclusion. What, from that article, could possibly make you think aging is "programmed?"

If anything, I think this line would suggest the exact opposite-



That, to me, suggests outside interference, or poor maintenance.



Um, but we don't see that. The "120 year myth" is just something that some random people made up, and has been surpassed plenty of times. It's not like most people live to 120 and then suddenly drop dead like Gordon Shumway. Truth is, most people don't even make it to 90 or 100, let alone 120.
To me the sudden movement at a roughly similar age across a population implies programmed. If it was due to diet/lifestyle/environment it certainly wouldn't happen at the same time for everybody. And also I think would be more gradual.

I don't necessarily mean '120 years and not one day more/less'. Whether it's 120, 123 or 125 it seems nobody has exceeded this limit and I think no matter how much people adhere to Ray's recommendations they won't surpass it - but that's just my hypothesis. And of course I would love to be proven wrong.
 

tankasnowgod

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To me the sudden movement at a roughly similar age across a population implies programmed. If it was due to diet/lifestyle/environment it certainly wouldn't happen at the same time for everybody. And also I think would be more gradual.
Why? Could happen with "sudden" events such as the birth of a child, a divorce, or retirement. These are very "predictable" "sudden" events that happen "roughly" around your sudden "programmed" ages.

You could add in other "sudden" environmental stressors, like a car crash or bankruptcy. None of these things are really "gradual," or they certainly don't have to be.

It doesn't imply "programmed." It could imply similar "life scripts."
I don't necessarily mean '120 years and not one day more/less'. Whether it's 120, 123 or 125 it seems nobody has exceeded this limit and I think no matter how much people adhere to Ray's recommendations they won't surpass it - but that's just my hypothesis. And of course I would love to be proven wrong.
WRONG!


Also, Lol at the idea that "no one has exceeded this limit with Ray's recommendations." Ray himself is only 84. It pretty much wouldn't be possible to know, at this point. The hypothesis hasn't even begun to be tested at this point.

Of course, we are living in such a sub optimal world at the moment, ruled by stress and seemingly drowning in PUFA, with near plant starvation levels of CO2 in the atmosphere, we are pretty far away from doing any sort of viable "longevity" experiment with the current basic conditions.
 

Lollipop2

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I know this is totally unsupported evidence, but when I lived in India, I heard of many yogis having long lives. If it was completely untrue, I wonder why the stories are still being told. Remember in traditional Indian and Yogic texts their diet had a lot of milk, ghee, fruits - including coconuts, rice, etc. Overall pretty Peaty.
 

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