Dante

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Yes, very possible. This would also suggest that manganese supplementation may not be very good for people with cancer as it would increase anti-oxidant status. There is at least one study that found just that.
Cell Death and Disease - Manganese superoxide dismutase promotes anoikis resistance and tumor metastasis
"...Taken together with our previous finding that detached cells evade excessive ROS production by attenuating oxidative metabolism of glucose, we conclude that mammary epithelial cells coordinate their responses to detachment through increasing MnSOD and decreasing ROS generation from mitochondrial glucose oxidation, thereby mitigating anoikis. Anoikis is a barrier to tumor metastasis. Indeed, MnSOD expression is elevated in human breast cancer metastases compared with primary tumors. Expression of MnSOD correlates with histologic tumor grades in human cancer and contributes to cancer cell’s resistance to anoikis. Our study suggests that inhibition of ROS detoxification coupled with stimulation of glucose oxidative metabolism may be an efficient strategy to enhance anoikis and block metastasis."
I am seeing this pattern elsewhere also. General anti-oxidants actually impair anti-cancer agents which work by correcting "electron flow"(i don't know a better word).
In this study, Vitamin K2 Induces Mitochondria-Related Apoptosis in Human Bladder Cancer Cells via ROS and JNK/p38 MAPK Signal Pathways, Vitamin K2 induced apoptosis in bladder cancers but NAC actually saved the cancer cells meaning that selective ROS generation is required for killing cancer cells. However, the anti-oxidant defense recruitment in the cancer cells seem rather like a consequence than the cause. I think you once told about Carbonic anhydrase enzyme being raised in cancer ( i don't know where i read this info but the researchers proposed a diagram where hypoxia and other factors selectively raised CA IV in the cancer cells but nowhere else). I think this might be why you don't advise zinc supplementation as CA is a zinc driven enyzme , am i correct here ? :)
 
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haidut

haidut

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I am seeing this pattern elsewhere also. General anti-oxidants actually impair anti-cancer agents which work by correcting "electron flow"(i don't know a better word).
In this study, Vitamin K2 Induces Mitochondria-Related Apoptosis in Human Bladder Cancer Cells via ROS and JNK/p38 MAPK Signal Pathways, Vitamin K2 induced apoptosis in bladder cancers but NAC actually saved the cancer cells meaning that selective ROS generation is required for killing cancer cells. However, the anti-oxidant defense recruitment in the cancer cells seem rather like a consequence than the cause. I think you once told about Carbonic anhydrase enzyme being raised in cancer ( i don't know where i read this info but the researchers proposed a diagram where hypoxia and other factors selectively raised CA IV in the cancer cells but nowhere else). I think this might be why you don't advise zinc supplementation as CA is a zinc driven enyzme , am i correct here ? :)

Correct, one of the reasons I do not like direct zinc supplements is their promotion of CA. Btw, this recent study once again raises the suggestion of using niacinamide (precursor to NAD) and thiamine (activator of PDH, inhibitor of PDK and CA) as potential treatment for cancer and I think zinc inhibits PDH as well (in higher doses). So yet another reason to be careful with it.
Reductive glutamine metabolism is a function of the α-ketoglutarate to citrate ratio in cells : Nature Communications
 

Regina

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I am seeing this pattern elsewhere also. General anti-oxidants actually impair anti-cancer agents which work by correcting "electron flow"(i don't know a better word).
In this study, Vitamin K2 Induces Mitochondria-Related Apoptosis in Human Bladder Cancer Cells via ROS and JNK/p38 MAPK Signal Pathways, Vitamin K2 induced apoptosis in bladder cancers but NAC actually saved the cancer cells meaning that selective ROS generation is required for killing cancer cells. However, the anti-oxidant defense recruitment in the cancer cells seem rather like a consequence than the cause. I think you once told about Carbonic anhydrase enzyme being raised in cancer ( i don't know where i read this info but the researchers proposed a diagram where hypoxia and other factors selectively raised CA IV in the cancer cells but nowhere else). I think this might be why you don't advise zinc supplementation as CA is a zinc driven enyzme , am i correct here ? :)
Fantastic sleuthing!
 
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jb116

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I am seeing this pattern elsewhere also. General anti-oxidants actually impair anti-cancer agents which work by correcting "electron flow"(i don't know a better word).
In this study, Vitamin K2 Induces Mitochondria-Related Apoptosis in Human Bladder Cancer Cells via ROS and JNK/p38 MAPK Signal Pathways, Vitamin K2 induced apoptosis in bladder cancers but NAC actually saved the cancer cells meaning that selective ROS generation is required for killing cancer cells. However, the anti-oxidant defense recruitment in the cancer cells seem rather like a consequence than the cause. I think you once told about Carbonic anhydrase enzyme being raised in cancer ( i don't know where i read this info but the researchers proposed a diagram where hypoxia and other factors selectively raised CA IV in the cancer cells but nowhere else). I think this might be why you don't advise zinc supplementation as CA is a zinc driven enyzme , am i correct here ? :)
This is why Peat has said that so-called anti-oxidants that are sold will "act" like pro-oxidants. He is against willy nilly using these types of products. Also why he is skeptical of the "anti-oxidant power" of certain things touted as such, like green tea. He said most likely it is its caffeine content that people get benefits from.
 

jaakkima

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I'm wondering what potency of fatty acid synthase inhibition is found with emodin and at what doses. Anyone find it? Haidut?
 

Ella

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The reason why I don't like zinc supplementation along with many other reasons. I think I have some papers where tumours were dissected to examine their contents. Zinc was one metal that was found to be high in tumours. I remember the story of one practitioner who started taking high doses of zinc only to witness his prostate tumour grow.

I personally have seen terrible health disasters with zinc supplementation. Lay people can be forgiven but practitioners should know better. The patient gets worse but the practitioner never thinks that his protocol may be responsible for the symptoms.
 

Nighteyes

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I personally have seen terrible health disasters with zinc supplementation. Lay people can be forgiven but practitioners should know better. The patient gets worse but the practitioner never thinks that his protocol may be responsible for the symptoms.

Do you think the risks might be similar if the zinc intake is very high from diet and not from supplements? (around 5 oysters per day).. or is it because of lack of co-factors for the zinc and impurities etc.
 
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Braveheart

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The reason why I don't like zinc supplementation along with many other reasons. I think I have some papers where tumours were dissected to examine their contents. Zinc was one metal that was found to be high in tumours. I remember the story of one practitioner who started taking high doses of zinc only to witness his prostate tumour grow.

I personally have seen terrible health disasters with zinc supplementation. Lay people can be forgiven but practitioners should know better. The patient gets worse but the practitioner never thinks that his protocol may be responsible for the symptoms.

of all things, this arrives in my mail today.....

Why Your Cardiologist Should Have Prescribed Zinc During Your Last Office Visit
 

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