A Truly Fiber Free Diet, Sustainable?

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Jayfish

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A vegetarian diet would increase estrogen through bacterial fermentation, so it only makes sense that there's increased excretion of it.

The only fiber in my diet is from occasional raw carrots and fresh squeezed OJ. The rest of my diet is milk, cheese, sugar, coffee, and gelatin. My poop is more regular and awesome than it's ever been.

When I start eating leaves/lentils, I get strong symptoms of endotoxin/estrogen, including gas and anxiety, fatigue, and compensatory virilization of the masculine traits. **** fiber.

No meat or eggs? Do you worry about deficiency of any kind? Do you feel limited in food choices?
 
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A vegetarian diet would increase estrogen through bacterial fermentation, so it only makes sense that there's increased excretion of it.

The only fiber in my diet is from occasional raw carrots and fresh squeezed OJ. The rest of my diet is milk, cheese, sugar, coffee, and gelatin. My poop is more regular and awesome than it's ever been.

When I start eating leaves/lentils, I get strong symptoms of endotoxin/estrogen, including gas and anxiety, fatigue, and compensatory virilization of the masculine traits. **** fiber.

"Vegetarian" means different things. Peat's own daily diet of milk, oj, and cheese is by definition "vegetarian."

Dairy is also a source of estrogens. Some people do well with dairy, many don't.

This guy eats massive fiber daily and has for the last 5 years. He shows no symptoms of estrogen dominance. I've seen his T levels and they were high. No gyno, muscle/fat ratio shows optimal state, 43 years old:

Instagram photo by Plant-Based Athlete • Apr 14, 2016 at 6:28pm UTC
 
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lvysaur

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This guy eats massive fiber daily and has for the last 5 years. He shows no symptoms of estrogen dominance. I've seen his T levels and they were high. No gyno, muscle/fat ratio shows optimal state, 43 years old:

Does he? It looks more like he may eat massive quantities of fruit, along with some occasional well cooked fermentable fibers, at least if his instagram is any indication.

While fruit probably has some fiber, I've personally never had an estrogenic reaction from eating whole, ripe fruit. Bananas, mangoes, oranges, strawberries, and melons all digest perfectly for me. I'd expect that the official fiber measurements of fruit are made using extremely unripe, suboptimal products.

I get estrogenic reactions from eating any leafy green, no matter how well cooked. Large amounts of coconut oil partially mitigate it. Potatoes, rice, and wheat seem okay in moderate quantities if eaten with coconut oil/fat, but I do notice some strange problems with wheat, like mild lactose intolerance when consumed simultaneously with milk.

Another thing to consider is that the body can build up a tolerance to bacterial toxins when constantly exposed to them (Peat has mentioned this, and I personally observed beforehand as well). It's probably better to eat a diet full of fermentable fibers than to cycle between low fiber and high fiber on a regular basis. It's probably also why I notice such intense symptoms after eating anything with fermentable fiber.

No meat or eggs? Do you worry about deficiency of any kind? Do you feel limited in food choices?

I eat a couple of eggs or a few chunks of chicken/beef almost every day. I also eat shellfish when I remember to. Any healthy diet will be limiting in food choices.
 
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Peater Piper

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I think fermentables fibers and pectin are the things that feed endotoxins?
I'm not sure we have a really clear picture on fiber yet, and since everyone has their own personal glut flora, what works for one person might not work for another. Pectin is highly fermentable, yet apple pectin his been show to actually protect against metabolic endotoxemia through alterations in the gut flora. Yet there's plenty of examples of people that feel like their intestines are wrecked by pectin, so it's not a good choice for everyone.

Apple-Derived Pectin Modulates Gut Microbiota, Improves Gut Barrier Function, and Attenuates Metabolic Endotoxemia in Rats with Diet-Induced Obesity
 

lvysaur

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Some fiber? It's all fiber.

No it isn't. Fiber content decreases as fruits ripen. I don't know what the value is, but the mainstream fiber values are almost certainly taken from unripe fruit.

A carrot has 2g fiber, an orange 2.5g. I eat roughly 2 ripe oranges a day, juiced, and 1 carrot a day (alternating between multiple carrots one day and zero on others). Since I juice the oranges, and they're ripe, they contain far less than 2.5g fiber. I'm getting about 3g of fiber a day unless I decide to eat some other fruit. Very far off from the average American 15g of fiber, and a huge leap from the 25g+ that nearly all vegans eat. Yet, my bowel is more regular and calm than it's ever been, stools are not too thin or thick, have good length and color, I have zero diarrhea or constipation, nearly zero gas, and the stools don't smell very strong.

He eats big bowls of oatmeal with some frozen blueberries every morning. He eats more fruit in the summer seasonally.

How many of his healthful pictures are from the low fruit phases? Physique and appearance can change drastically within the span of a few days or weeks.

If his diet nevertheless works for him, that's great, but I don't really care, because I (and every other person on this forum) am not him.
 
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No it isn't. Fiber content decreases as fruits ripen. I don't know what the value is, but the mainstream fiber values are almost certainly taken from unripe fruit.

Any piece of material from the fruit that is not the juice and not the water, is fiber. Even the seeds are fiber. Even if the fiber decreases as it ripens, (which doesn't make any sense because the fiber increases as it grows bigger, that's how it grows) if you eat a whole fruit meal you're still eating a pure fiber meal. So even if the fiber goes down for an individual piece of fruit, if you eat a big bowl of fruit you just ate a huge amount of fiber.
 
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Any piece of material from the fruit that is not the juice and not the water, is fiber. Even the seeds are fiber. Even if the fiber decreases as it ripens, (which doesn't make any sense because the fiber increases as it grows bigger, that's how it grows) if you eat a whole fruit meal you're still eating a pure fiber meal. So even if the fiber goes down for an individual piece of fruit, if you eat a big bowl of fruit you just ate a huge amount of fiber.

No you are mostly eating water and sugar if it's ripe fruit.
 
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No you are mostly eating water and sugar if it's ripe fruit.

Evidence?

If that were true, fruitarians would not take big poops daily. Similar to potatoes and even white rice, the sugar componant is very small and they are all mostly fiber, its small compared to the fiber volume wise. Your gut extracts the sugar.
 
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Also, just juice some fruits in a juicer. Look at the juice, that's the sugar. Look at all the fiber, that's the fiber.
 
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Evidence?

If that were true, fruitarians would not take big poops daily. Similar to potatoes and even white rice, the sugar componant is very small and they are all mostly fiber, its small compared to the fiber volume wise. Your gut extracts the sugar.

My evidence is chronometer and nutritiondata. Are you saying that these sites are wrong?

Stool is made up of a lot of water and a lot of bacteria. High fiber eaters like fruitarians and high carb vegans will have a far greater amount of bacteria, making for bulkier stool.
 
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Also, just juice some fruits in a juicer. Look at the juice, that's the sugar. Look at all the fiber, that's the fiber.

I believe you are now referring to non Peat approved types of fruit which most of us wouldn't eat anyway. If you juiced a melon for instance, it's almost all water and sugar. Oranges as well have much more water and sugar than fiber. Most tropical fruits are high sugar ad water content.
 
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Jayfish

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Bacteria? Bacteria are microscopic.

Normally, feces are made up of 75 percent water and 25 percent solid matter. About 30 percent of the solid matter consists of dead bacteria; about 30 percent consists of indigestible food matter such as cellulose; 10 to 20 percent is cholesterol and other fats; 10 to 20 percent is inorganic substances such as calcium phosphate and iron phosphate; and 2 to 3 percent is protein
feces | biology
 

lvysaur

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Evidence?

If that were true, fruitarians would not take big poops daily. Similar to potatoes and even white rice, the sugar componant is very small and they are all mostly fiber, its small compared to the fiber volume wise. Your gut extracts the sugar.

And in turn, fiber content is small compared to water volume-wise. You can see this in cooking, you only need a bit of pectin to make a solid mass of jam.
 
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Normally, feces are made up of 75 percent water and 25 percent solid matter. About 30 percent of the solid matter consists of dead bacteria; about 30 percent consists of indigestible food matter such as cellulose; 10 to 20 percent is cholesterol and other fats; 10 to 20 percent is inorganic substances such as calcium phosphate and iron phosphate; and 2 to 3 percent is protein
feces | biology

When they say "About 100 to 250 grams (3 to 8 ounces) of feces are excreted by a human adult daily" I think they mean that is what is supposed to happen optimally because that certainly isn't the case for many people. There's a reason why so many people have to take Metamucil and stick suppositories up their butts.

And when they say "about 30 percent consists of indigestible food matter such as cellulose;" notice the "such as" part. There's more than just cellulose. There are other types of fibers. And all of this depends on what a person eats.

And that's just a definition. I'd like to see direct data from current research. I'm skeptical about that definition of "feces."
 

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