Lokzo

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Same here had a very bad experience with it made me feel weak with no motivation and kind of depressed I actually use to consume a lot of Reishi Everyday with an energy mushroom powder and I started gaining a lot of weight around that time with sexual dysfunction problems. That was before I knew about the negative effects.

So intense man!

I believe no man should ever go near Reishi, unless they're treating cancer or have some insane immune dysfunction.
 

pudd1ng

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Oct 6, 2019
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Haidut and forum, has anyone got any knowledge on B-Androstenetriol (b-aet) I’m assuming it’s similar to the list posted?
 

Experienced

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Feb 28, 2017
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The compound erinacine in lion's mane is a kappa receptor agonist. This isn't that terrible of a thing but it will produce an uncomfortable dysphoria in higher doses. I've tried lion's mane on many occasions but can't quite get past the dysphoria (its very intense for me). That being said I'm sure some extracts are stronger than others regarding this effect.
Do you still take Lion's Mane that guarantees Erinacines?
 

Dave Clark

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What is the consensus on some of the other mushrooms? Since Peat likes white button mushrooms, I am guessing they are not all bad. How about shitake, maitake, agaricus blazei, etc.?
 

Dave Clark

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I think that mushrooms are totally fine. Only if it does not contain any starch in it. Becausr that's useless.

White button mushroom is outstanding for dominating estrogen
Yeah, I agree, there are beneficial compounds in mushrooms that dwarf the negatives that this forum brings up, like the beta glucans, etc. Typical of Peat and a lot of his followers they see what they focus on, or they throw the baby out with the bathwater. According to the chart posted, it looks like maitake falls in the middle, so less issues, but still much benefit. Though I do think taking large volumes of mushroom supplements may have the negative effects, consuming the mushrooms in small volume and occasionally should be okay. I am going to go with that theory simply because I love mushrooms, and have no intention of putting them on the do not touch list along with all the other things the Peat world doesn't like.
 

Experienced

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Yeah, I agree, there are beneficial compounds in mushrooms that dwarf the negatives that this forum brings up, like the beta glucans, etc. Typical of Peat and a lot of his followers they see what they focus on, or they throw the baby out with the bathwater. According to the chart posted, it looks like maitake falls in the middle, so less issues, but still much benefit. Though I do think taking large volumes of mushroom supplements may have the negative effects, consuming the mushrooms in small volume and occasionally should be okay. I am going to go with that theory simply because I love mushrooms, and have no intention of putting them on the do not touch list along with all the other things the Peat world doesn't like.
Yeah I took a lot and bunch of medicinal mushrooms in a row for example Reishi , Chaga , cordyceps and turkey tail. They are really high in beta glucans it should be okay for Cancer patients but for a guy like me who is Healthy isn't necessary and not recommended I felt awfull lmao took it for a month long I guess so I researched a little bit more and found that beta glucans are the main stuff. So I took a 10 day break
 

Dave Clark

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Yeah I took a lot and bunch of medicinal mushrooms in a row for example Reishi , Chaga , cordyceps and turkey tail. They are really high in beta glucans it should be okay for Cancer patients but for a guy like me who is Healthy isn't necessary and not recommended I felt awfull lmao took it for a month long I guess so I researched a little bit more and found that beta glucans are the main stuff. So I took a 10 day break
I have learned, thanks a lot to this forum, to question everything. For a few years I was using Life Extension's Immune Protection formula that is based on reishi and cistanche, which they stressed works on the innate and adaptive immune system and should be taken everyday. Of course, I don't trust any source that promotes fish oils and other things that I now know should not be used. Hopefully, cistanche has no real negatives, but I keep my ear to the ground !
 

Experienced

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I have learned, thanks a lot to this forum, to question everything. For a few years I was using Life Extension's Immune Protection formula that is based on reishi and cistanche, which they stressed works on the innate and adaptive immune system and should be taken everyday. Of course, I don't trust any source that promotes fish oils and other things that I now know should not be used. Hopefully, cistanche has no real negatives, but I keep my ear to the ground !
I hope so man success!
 

Hitchens

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Jan 27, 2019
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I feel as though longevity botanicals, atleast for lions mane, is a far superior product than Paul stamets host defense brand. With Host Defense I was waking up constantly to urinate and with this longevity botanicals, the fluidity of thought is far more noticeable, the energy levels, its pretty amazing. could someone care to try it and let me know if my conclusions are similar to theirs?
 

CapitalCK

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5a-androstanediol & 5-ar type 1 activity:
A little confused. OP mentioned 5a-androstanediol increases 5ar activity. My guess is that OP meant 5ar type 1 activity which is in Progesterone to AlloP pathway (that utilizes 5ar type 1 enzyme). But then I went to IdeaLab site and there is no product called 5a-androstanediol!

I'm suffering from PFS and what I'm trying to do is increase 5ar-1 and 5ar-2 activity. I'm taking Proviron to stimulate 5ar-2 activity. But I'm not sure how to increase 5ar-1 activity.

When you say 'activity' - I hope it means increase the number of 5ar-1 and 5ar-2 enzymes. Finasteride/Accutane seem to have permanently reduced them. So, if I can increase those, then hormonal pathways should start working again is my hypothesis.

I got 5a-DHP from IdeaLabs. Used 5 drops yesterday and today but didn't feel anything. Perhaps it needs to build-up. Perhaps better to take less and let it build up over days. Prefer not to increase dosage, just to be safe.

Any advise on how to increase 5ar type 1 activity?

Ethanol vs Tocopherol Solvents:
Are both edible or is one for topical application and one for oral edible use?

Lion's Mane + Cordecyps combo:
I'm considering buying Lion's Mane from Nootropics Depot. But I read Lion's Mane is a 5ar inhibitor but a weak one (like tomatoes!) Then I read Cordecyps can counter the 5ar inhibitory effect of Lion's Mane.

Since PAS/PFS over last 5 years, my spatial IQ , my short-term/working memory, my thought-processing speed have all declined. If Lion's Mane+Cordecyps (combo) can help with that, then I'd take it. But I want to be sure it won't impact recovery from PFS / PAS! I mean, on one hand I'm trying to increase 5ar-1 and 5ar-2 enzymes, on the other hand, Lion's Mane might negate that! So, I just want to be sure.

Thoughts?

 
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TheBeard

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Thoughts?

OP's name is Georgi Dinkov aka haidut, a well respected member, researcher and producer of the Idealabs products.

You dessicated the PFS issue and made a lot of assumptions as to how it works, and came to the conclusion that the issue must be centered around 5ar1 or 5ar2.

The reality is the problem is much more complex than that, and the solutions much easier than that.

Check out the thread called "Finally cured from Post Finasteride Syndrome"
 

CapitalCK

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OP's name is Georgi Dinkov aka haidut, a well respected member, researcher and producer of the Idealabs products.

You dessicated the PFS issue and made a lot of assumptions as to how it works, and came to the conclusion that the issue must be centered around 5ar1 or 5ar2.

The reality is the problem is much more complex than that, and the solutions much easier than that.

Check out the thread called "Finally cured from Post Finasteride Syndrome"
Thanks for that. New to this forum. That was my first post actually! And how I got to this forum is while searching for how to increase 5ar enzymes!

I checked out that thread. So, I didn't know I had PAS/PFS 5 years ago. But my T was found low. So, endo put me on TRT for over a year. That included 300 iu of HCG 3x a week. Did not help at all. I think different people are affected differently.

In my case, it started with Accutane which inhibits 5ar1 but does not inhibit 5ar2. So, when I went to a urologist with ED issues, he gave me Viagra, Cialis and both worked fine. Few years later, had hair transplant and started taking propecia. Within a few weeks I noticed Viagara/Cialis were no longer working. That's when I learnt about PFS/PAS.

I quit TRT it last year tried several other treatments but nothing ever worked. But then I had just been listening to doctors. Earlier this year, started doing my own research and thought perhaps 5ar1 and 5ar2 are still inhibited or depressed and if I could increase them somehow, it should resolve PFS.

To increase 5ar 2, I read DHT has a positive feedback loop. So, I started taking Proviorn - as mentioned in some forums.
To increase 5ar 1, I'm still searching. But I've started taking 5a-DHP from IdeaLabs because it is a 5ar1 metabolite of Progesterone. From here, it just converts to AlloP. Which in theory should improve my mental symptoms - but been 3 days of 5 drops a day and it hasn't. So there are definitely other pieces of puzzle I'm missing.
 
T

TheBeard

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Thanks for that. New to this forum. That was my first post actually! And how I got to this forum is while searching for how to increase 5ar enzymes!

I checked out that thread. So, I didn't know I had PAS/PFS 5 years ago. But my T was found low. So, endo put me on TRT for over a year. That included 300 iu of HCG 3x a week. Did not help at all. I think different people are affected differently.

In my case, it started with Accutane which inhibits 5ar1 but does not inhibit 5ar2. So, when I went to a urologist with ED issues, he gave me Viagra, Cialis and both worked fine. Few years later, had hair transplant and started taking propecia. Within a few weeks I noticed Viagara/Cialis were no longer working. That's when I learnt about PFS/PAS.

I quit TRT it last year tried several other treatments but nothing ever worked. But then I had just been listening to doctors. Earlier this year, started doing my own research and thought perhaps 5ar1 and 5ar2 are still inhibited or depressed and if I could increase them somehow, it should resolve PFS.

To increase 5ar 2, I read DHT has a positive feedback loop. So, I started taking Proviorn - as mentioned in some forums.
To increase 5ar 1, I'm still searching. But I've started taking 5a-DHP from IdeaLabs because it is a 5ar1 metabolite of Progesterone. From here, it just converts to AlloP. Which in theory should improve my mental symptoms - but been 3 days of 5 drops a day and it hasn't. So there are definitely other pieces of puzzle I'm missing.

How is Proviron working for you?

If you believe in the DHT forward feedback loop, I'd rather stimulate my own DHT by applying testosterone cream to the scrotum rather than exogenous DHT.
 

CapitalCK

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How is Proviron working for you?

If you believe in the DHT forward feedback loop, I'd rather stimulate my own DHT by applying testosterone cream to the scrotum rather than exogenous DHT.
I've been on Proviron for about 3 weeks now and not feeling any different yet. I couldn't get hold of DHT cream but whether you apply DHT cream or take Proviron, it is essentially the same thing - you're taking exogenous DHT. It'd be different if you were applying Testosterone cream to scrotum. But Testosterone doesn't have positive feedback loop with 5ar. More T results in more e2 (in absence of ai). If you don't have enough 5ar enzymes, the rest of the T you fed your body will simply be flushed out in urine/***t. But studies show DHT has a positive feedback loop with 5ar enzymes. More DHT stimulates its own production by increasing 5ar enzymes. Atleast thats what my understanding is. I'm still figuring things out, so please, correct me if I'm wrong.

EDIT - I misunderstood,I thought you meant to apply DHT cream. For applying T cream, as I said:
1. T does not stimulate production of more 5ar enzymes.
2. Your body will reduce 5ar enzymes if you apply too much T. Why? Because body maintains homeostasis and with PFS, hypothesis is that body's new environment is low DHT environment. So, now it tries to maintain somewhat low DHT and if you give it more T, it'd either be aromatized or flushed-out. It would not stimulate more 5ar enzymes.
3. So, if you give your body DHT directly, skipping the 5ar conversion process, then you're forcing body to adapt to new high DHT environment and stimulate production of more 5ar enzymes for future.

Note 1: This is for 5ar type 2 enzymes. I don't know if 5ar-1 (progesterone pathway) has similar positive feedback loop. Where if I feed my body 5a-DHP, it'd stimulate production of 5ar-1 enzymes. I don't know.

Note 2: It is entirely possible that (above) hypothesis is completely wrong as I'm still learning and new to all this.
 
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TheBeard

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I've been on Proviron for about 3 weeks now and not feeling any different yet. I couldn't get hold of DHT cream but whether you apply DHT cream or take Proviron, it is essentially the same thing - you're taking exogenous DHT. It'd be different if you were applying Testosterone cream to scrotum. But Testosterone doesn't have positive feedback loop with 5ar. More T results in more e2 (in absence of ai). If you don't have enough 5ar enzymes, the rest of the T you fed your body will simply be flushed out in urine/***t. But studies show DHT has a positive feedback loop with 5ar enzymes. More DHT stimulates its own production by increasing 5ar enzymes. Atleast thats what my understanding is. I'm still figuring things out, so please, correct me if I'm wrong.

EDIT - I misunderstood,I thought you meant to apply DHT cream. For applying T cream, as I said:
1. T does not stimulate production of more 5ar enzymes.
2. Your body will reduce 5ar enzymes if you apply too much T. Why? Because body maintains homeostasis and with PFS, hypothesis is that body's new environment is low DHT environment. So, now it tries to maintain somewhat low DHT and if you give it more T, it'd either be aromatized or flushed-out. It would not stimulate more 5ar enzymes.
3. So, if you give your body DHT directly, skipping the 5ar conversion process, then you're forcing body to adapt to new high DHT environment and stimulate production of more 5ar enzymes for future.

Note 1: This is for 5ar type 2 enzymes. I don't know if 5ar-1 (progesterone pathway) has similar positive feedback loop. Where if I feed my body 5a-DHP, it'd stimulate production of 5ar-1 enzymes. I don't know.

Note 2: It is entirely possible that (above) hypothesis is completely wrong as I'm still learning and new to all this.

Hmmm...no...I applied T cream to my sack and while my T was twice the top of the range, my DHT was four times the top of the range. So my body didn't "reduce 5ar to maintain homeostasis".
 

Cameron

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Jul 14, 2018
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Has anyone tried low dose pansterone and androsterone to scrotum on this thread. 2-3mgs each 1:1 ratio to see 5-ar sensitivity? Seem to work very well even at small doses.
 

Cameron

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Tennessee
Does topical or oral androsterone stimulate 5-ar more? Mg per mg what route of administration stimulates more 5-ar activity?
 

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