99% Of Those Who Died From Virus Had Other Illness, Italy Says

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Fred

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I searched for it on the forum, but didn't see it, so I posted it.
The age demographic data is constantly being updated, and hasn't changed -- that is, still very few deaths under 50. So it's probably safe to assume that the Italian study's findings are still accurate as well. Age is a proxy for health (usually).
 

Kunstruct

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You may also notice that the study shows way more men are dead than women. For the 70-79yr or 80-89yr, looking at "Figura 2" on page 2.
 
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... and this Lancet paper from today (March 31) shows an IFR of 0.67% overall:
https://www.thelancet.com/action/showPdf?pii=S1473-3099(20)30243-7
Note the IFR was "Obtained by combining estimates of case fatality ratios with information on infection prevalence obtained from those returning home on repatriation flights."
But the IFR is the number we're really interested in, since it includes (by estimate, necessarily) people who are infected but are not tested/hospitalized.
This whole thing seems like total BS.
 
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Underlying illnesses that are involved often aren't some super rare disease but are problems that are extremely common in the US, like asthma or hypertension. So I wouldn't use this as a reason to dismiss severity of covid.
 

Arnold Grape

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Zzz. We get it: it’s all a gigantic hoax. At this point, whether or not you believe this should also factor in the number of existing cases and if you will have access to medical care if you do come up with COVID-19. USA will prob surpass 200,000 diagnosed cases by COB today. Keep your hands clean between the vapid posts.
 
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Underlying illnesses that are involved often aren't some super rare disease but are problems that are extremely common in the US, like asthma or hypertension. So I wouldn't use this as a reason to dismiss severity of covid.

Yes, but the narrative is "anyone can get it" ... and then they put a 16-year old victim on the front page of every "news" site.
 
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Yes, but the narrative is "anyone can get it" ... and then they put a 16-year old victim on the front page of every "news" site.
I mean anyone CAN get it.

It definitely kills people with underlying disease more than perfectly healthy people, but it possibly has very unpleasant long term sequelae, similar to post-sars syndrome, in "recovered" patients, so its not just about dying.

about 1/3 of the adult US population is hypertensive, without even counting other diseases, that's already a huge percentage of people.
 

Kunstruct

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I doubt people will bother to click the PDF so I am posting the image here.
Notice how much more men are dead than women in their 60s, 70s and 80s.

Blue - Females
Orange - Males

zbVgNwz.png
 
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"
Toronto, 2003: a case in point?
Because so little is known about coronavirus, it’s difficult to project the long terms effects on people. But a possible comparison would be the SARS virus. This is because it’s from the same Coronaviridae family as coronavirus. As the WHO pointed out, the actual coronavirus virus is SARS-CoV-2; genetically-related to SARS.

But it should be noted SARS was more deadly, with a mortality rate of 9.6%. So, this comparison should be viewed with caution; although equally coronavirus is already more prevalent than SARS was in 2002/03.

In 2003, in Toronto, Canada, a SARS epidemic infected at least 273 people. A study looked at 107 patients from this epidemic who had been in intensive care. The symptoms the study looked at are very similar to ME.

It found that one year after being infected, 17% had not returned to work due to severe post-viral symptoms persisting. Many also had ongoing health problems, even when they went back to work. In total, 87% reported still having symptoms a year later. The study did not review the patients again.

So, what could the implications from the SARS study be for coronavirus?

The US situation
Currently, the Centre for Disease Control (CDC) in the US is estimating that for coronavirus:

  • 160-214 million people in the US could end up being infected.
  • 2.4-21 million people could have to go into hospital.
  • 200,000-1.7 million people could die.
This is an infection rate of between 48% and 65% of the population. The hospitalisation rate is between 0.7% and 6%.

The Canary crunched the numbers using the SARS research. We found that for coronavirus, between 408,000 and 3,570,000 people in the US could experience severe ME-like symptoms a year after getting infected.

Ongoing chronic illness
But what would the figures look like past the year mark?

Again, the research is limited. But a study into the glandular fever virus found that there was a 43% fall in the number of people with ME-symptoms after two years post-infection. So, if this was coronavirus, it could potentially still leave between 175,000 and 1,500,000 people in the US chronically ill; possibly permanently living with ME.

It’s important to note that this is just speculative, because of the lack of data on both coronavirus and ME. But as a comparison, 17% of SARS patients left with severe symptoms after a year is far higher than ME incidence rates in other viral illnesses (9%). And even if you applied the 9% ME rate from other viruses to coronavirus, this could still leave between 216,000 and 1,890,000 million people in the US with ME.

And none of this includes milder forms of ME. For example, in the SARS study 9% had to have modifications to go back to work. And as has already been found with coronavirus in Hong Kong:"
 

S.Seneff

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It found that one year after being infected, 17% had not returned to work due to severe post-viral symptoms persisting. Many also had ongoing health problems, even when they went back to work. In total, 87% reported still having symptoms a year later. The study did not review the patients again

How was their health before get infected by the SARS ?

I doubt people will bother to click the PDF so I am posting the image here.
Notice how much more men are dead than women in their 60s, 70s and 80s.

Blue - Females
Orange - Males

zbVgNwz.png

Is it the consequences of Feminism ?
 

S.Seneff

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I think Feminism put more stress on the male, a chronic stress.
 

Giraffe

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In 2003, in Toronto, Canada, a SARS epidemic infected at least 273 people. A study looked at 107 patients from this epidemic who had been in intensive care. The symptoms the study looked at are very similar to ME.

It found that one year after being infected, 17% had not returned to work due to severe post-viral symptoms persisting. Many also had ongoing health problems, even when they went back to work. In total, 87% reported still having symptoms a year later. The study did not review the patients again.
The fatality rate in Canada was very high back then, but there were no fatalities in Europe and in the US. Diagnosis was mostly based on symptoms. Toxic drugs were used that harmed the patient, but had no effect on the virus. (also see post here)

debored13 said said:
17% had not returned to work due to severe post-viral symptoms persisting
This happens when patients end up in ICU with acute respiratory distress syndrome. It is not specific to SARS.


Return to work and lost earnings after acute respiratory distress syndrome: a 5-year prospective, longitudinal study of long-term survivors. - PubMed - NCBI
Across 5-year follow-up, nearly one-third of previously employed ARDS survivors never returned to work. Delayed return to work was associated with patient-related and intensive care unit/hospital-related factors,
 
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Kunstruct

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I think Feminism put more stress on the male, a chronic stress.

That is possible. Yet I am not quite sure, might be men care to show much more bravado than women, shakes the hand of 100 other men. But in Italy surely that might not matter considering massive cheek kissing customs between all ages.

But there have been claims before that men could have a higher density of ACE2 receptors, this was some old question from early February, in the mean time it seems this topic has been dropped.


According to that study at the time it was done

People in their 50s dead
14 females
42 males
25% females - 75% males

People in their 60s dead
31 females
142 males
17.91% females - 82.08% males

People in the 70s dead
158 females
549 males
22.34% females - 77.65% males

People in their 80s dead
285 females
567 males
33.45% females - 66.54% males
 
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