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There was a study with older males which used "only" 80mg DHT daily and it found no suppression of HPGA. If you have estrogen dominance the HPGA will be already suppressed. DHT, if used in physiological doses or up to maybe 25mg daily, should help with such a problem instead of making it worse. Applied directly on the testicles, DHT should stimulate T synthesis from pregnenolone and DHEA. There are plenty of animal studies showing recovery from radiation-induced testicular damage using local administration of DHT.

it's difficult applying it to testicles. They are very small, and the rats want to squirm away.
 
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haidut

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it's difficult applying it to testicles. They are very small, and the rats want to squirm away.

I am not saying it should be applied there, just giving it as an example that DHT can actually stimulate endogenous synthesis of androgens when used in reasonable doses. The only enzymes that I know it inhibits in physiological doses are aromatase and 11b-HSD1, so its primary effects in physiological doses are to inhibit estrogen and cortisol synthesis.
 
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And what would be physiological doses? up to 5 mg?

As I said, up to 25mg daily is probably OK when using regular DHT. Peat thinks even 3mg - 5mg daily is enough for pronounced benefits.
 

encerent

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I meant to ask, how much DHT does the body (say male normal, healthy, 30 yr old one) produce each day?
 
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I meant to ask, how much DHT does the body (say male normal, healthy, 30 yr old one) produce each day?

Nobody knows for sure as DHT is a paracrine steroid and gets synthesized in peripheral tissues as needed. The precursors are T, DHEA, and progesterone. I am listing these 3 as they all have their own independent pathways through which they can reach DHT. Some people will say that listing DHEA and T is redundant, but that is incorrect as DHEA can bypass the step going through testosterone and so can progesterone. About 1mg DHT daily is synthesized from T. However, a person can produce up to 15mg DHEA daily and studies show up to 70% of that can get converted into DHT into tissues that need it like the prostate, brain, gonads, etc. The conversion of progesterone into androgens is virtually unknown but it definitely happens as shown by that study in rats where giving HED 600mg progesterone increased DHT levels by a factor of 7-10. I suppose the only way to get a good idea is to do a long term study on excretion of DHT metabolites like ADG but even that has drawbacks as ADG is more indicative of DHT turnover than synthesis. Some people retain DHT a lot better while others metabolize and excrete it much more rapidly.
There are human populations with exceptionally high levels of DHT which can only come from endogenous synthesis of 5m - 8mg DHT daily. So, the known upper limit observed in humans is 8mg. But the theoretical upper limit is much higher - probably in the range of 20mg - 25mg daily. It is not a coincidence that DHT doses below 25mg do not (usually) suppress HPGA. The body likes its DHT and wants to get as much as possible within the physiological limits.
 

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That means almost immediate shrinkage of the midriff area

My shipment has arrived from idealabsdc. Is there any reason to drop a drop on one of my female rats? I notice one of them has a little bit of a tummy she might like to shrink.
 
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My shipment has arrived from idealabsdc. Is there any reason to drop a drop on one of my female rats? I notice one of them has a little bit of a tummy she might like to shrink.

Don't see a reason why not, but I would keep the female dose at about half the male one. So, 1-2 drops as a start should be OK.
 

NathanK

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It lowered my prolactin and estrone sulfate levels to almost undetectable levels
Whoa!

What does near undetectable ES1 levels look like? Im imagining very little adipose if it is true most estrone is stored in fat.

I bet your E2 tanked as well. Did you have any issues with "achy" joints?
 

mirc12354

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Yes, I find it actually being more potent than DHT and, as the study above said, much longer lasting. Most noticeable effects for me is strong anti-cortisol, anti-prolactin and anti-depressive. That means almost immediate shrinkage of the midriff area, strong libido boost and great mood enhancer. Muscles feel much harder but I don't think it makes them grow. So, it is very androgenic and anti-estrogenic, anti-cortisol as well, but I don't think it is anabolic in the sense that bodybuilders expect.
What was your dosage??
 
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What about the heat stability of the hormone?
Any concerns shipping to Europe during the summer months?

I want to be sure about that, especially considering the price.
 

Risingfire

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I don't think 11-keto DHT is suppressive. If anything, I posted a study showing DHT stimulates its own synthesis.

Thank you! Do you think adding combining a little DHEA with 11-keto DHT would make it more effective? Or that's affecting too many pathways?
 

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Thank you! Do you think adding combining a little DHEA with 11-keto DHT would make it more effective? Or that's affecting too many pathways?
Haidut stated it would be beneficial with low dose dhea. Somewhere above....I'm doing both, 2 drops Keto DHT today on inner arms and 5 drops Pansterone transdermal. Feeling good, nothing adverse at all but it's only day 2. Feel good overall. Gonna watch for any hairloss for sure. I will report back here.
 

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Haidut stated it would be beneficial with low dose dhea. Somewhere above....I'm doing both, 2 drops Keto DHT today on inner arms and 5 drops Pansterone transdermal. Feeling good, nothing adverse at all but it's only day 2. Feel good overall. Gonna watch for any hairloss for sure. I will report back here.

Thanks Sky! Why would you worry about hair loss?
 

skycop00

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Thanks Sky! Why would you worry about hair loss?
Based on ald reports of DHT and hair loss, but I believe there are certain pathways that must be triggered for that to happen. Just watching for signs. I'm on TRT and that is an issue I must consider in the big picture. I'm off my srimidex for estrogen thanks to aspirin and estroban, so that's one less thing to worry about
 

Risingfire

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Danny Roddy has gone deep into this. The guys with the highest DHT are men 17-22. This would make guys that age bald. Very few are
 
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Whoa!

What does near undetectable ES1 levels look like? Im imagining very little adipose if it is true most estrone is stored in fat.

I bet your E2 tanked as well. Did you have any issues with "achy" joints?

I never got achy joints from 11-keto DHT even though my E2 also tanked, as you said. Anastrozole did cause achy joints. I am starting to suspect that the AI drugs cause joint problems by another mechanism or it is a specific side effect to these drugs.
 
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What was your dosage??

I was using 5mg twice a day. After about a week I dropped to 5mg daily and did not experience diminishing effects.
 

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