Copper Deficient - Please Help

[Milan555]

I went through a period of time a year ago where I supplemented around 50mg zinc per day. I got more and more lethargic and apathetic over time, but never realized it could have been the zinc.

I tested my copper and Ceruloplasmin (both are in range but at the very bottom/borderline low). I tested Ferritin which came out low at 35.

I'm just now starting to test out 1-2mg/day of copper to see if my symptoms improve. On the first day I tried copper, I felt noticeably more alert and "on" during the entire day. I definitely don't think it was placebo. It's a feeling I haven't had in a while (excited, stimulated, alert, mind working faster and more clearly).

Have you experienced similar symptoms from low copper? Did you end up fixing copper issues successfully?

 

[olive]

A lot of my male clients have this issue after they mistakenly megadose zinc for purported 'testosterone increasing' benefits. Common signs and symptoms are fat accumulation around the midsection, dry skin, gray hairs, malaise, brain fog, etc. I recommend avoiding supplements and instead opting for liver, 100g twice a week drunk with a coffee. Copper deficiency goes hand in hand with iron deficiency also so look out for that.
Upon cessation of zinc mega-dose and starting a high copper diet - 3mg/day minimum - symptoms reside fairly quickly. I've seen pictures from clients that clearly show a solid line transition from white hair to black as the hair grows, it's that quick.

 

[Curiousman]

excited, stimulated, alert, mind working faster and more clearly

I too.

 

[Curiousman]

Some interesting

 

[RWilly]

Cocoa powder can clear up a copper deficiency.

 

[Milan555]

A lot of my male clients have this issue after they mistakenly megadose zinc for purported 'testosterone increasing' benefits. Common signs and symptoms are fat accumulation around the midsection, dry skin, gray hairs, malaise, brain fog, etc. I recommend avoiding supplements and instead opting for liver, 100g twice a week drunk with a coffee. Copper deficiency goes hand in hand with iron deficiency also so look out for that.
Upon cessation of zinc mega-dose and starting a high copper diet - 3mg/day minimum - symptoms reside fairly quickly. I've seen pictures from clients that clearly show a solid line transition from white hair to black as the hair grows, it's that quick.

Yeah, I feel ALL those symptoms - during my excess zinc days, I noticed my appetite/weight was increasing more than usual, and noticed more hair loss in the shower. Also got a few random gray/white hairs that I just attributed to stress. All of that is combined with malaise, brain fog, lethargy, no motivation, not feeling sharp, etc.

How long do your clients stay on a 3mg/day minimum level of copper? Is it something that's done for a month and stopped? Or done over several months?

 

[Milan555]

I've already started a copper supplement at just 1 mg/day just to see how I tolerate it. So far, the effects mentally are very noticeable. I'm not fatigued and drained as much during the day. It's making me a bit anxious at times, but that's probably because the change in energy and alertness is so noticeable and new. Really feels like my stimulatory neurotransmitters are coming back and keeping me feeling good.

I always felt that I was low on blood sugar or dopamine or something. Something has been stopping me from performing at my best. And I'm really hoping it was low copper this whole time due to excess zinc use. Now I can finally have my life back. Crazy

 

[Fexxx]

10g cacao per Day is the safest way!

[Copper supplement with cocoa for copper deficiency in patients with long-term enteral nutrition]. - PubMed - NCBI

PS: I love my hot Cacaodrink with Milk and crunchy Cacao Nibs in Desserts :)

 

[olive]

Yeah, I feel ALL those symptoms - during my excess zinc days, I noticed my appetite/weight was increasing more than usual, and noticed more hair loss in the shower. Also got a few random gray/white hairs that I just attributed to stress. All of that is combined with malaise, brain fog, lethargy, no motivation, not feeling sharp, etc.

How long do your clients stay on a 3mg/day minimum level of copper? Is it something that's done for a month and stopped? Or done over several months?

3mg copper per day is a general guideline I subscribe to all my clients, specific cases omitted, for all of time. We generally aim for a 1:5 copper:zinc ratio so that’s 3mg copper:15mg zinc for most clients. If accruing muscle mass is the goal we might up that to 4mg copper:20mg zinc during mass accrual phases.

 

[sunraiser]

I've already started a copper supplement at just 1 mg/day just to see how I tolerate it. So far, the effects mentally are very noticeable. I'm not fatigued and drained as much during the day. It's making me a bit anxious at times, but that's probably because the change in energy and alertness is so noticeable and new. Really feels like my stimulatory neurotransmitters are coming back and keeping me feeling good.

I always felt that I was low on blood sugar or dopamine or something. Something has been stopping me from performing at my best. And I'm really hoping it was low copper this whole time due to excess zinc use. Now I can finally have my life back. Crazy

I think you're on a good path. Copper at 1mg or so for a few weeks to a month will give you a very clear indicator of whether it's what you need and whether it's wholesome at this moment in time.

There are so many rate limiting factors in copper metabolism and in my opinion it's bad news to have excessive copper intake during poor metabolic health - ceruloplasmin production is dependant on a number of cofactors alongside liver and adrenal function. It's also not the only mechanism for copper metabolism.

Liver can obviously be an excellent food in certain circumstances, but it has too many variables and can be imbalancing in larger quantities, imo.

 

[Vinero]

I went through a period of time a year ago where I supplemented around 50mg zinc per day. I got more and more lethargic and apathetic over time, but never realized it could have been the zinc.

I tested my copper and Ceruloplasmin (both are in range but at the very bottom/borderline low). I tested Ferritin which came out low at 35.

I'm just now starting to test out 1-2mg/day of copper to see if my symptoms improve. On the first day I tried copper, I felt noticeably more alert and "on" during the entire day. I definitely don't think it was placebo. It's a feeling I haven't had in a while (excited, stimulated, alert, mind working faster and more clearly).

Have you experienced similar symptoms from low copper? Did you end up fixing copper issues successfully?

I think I have been experiencing the same symptoms lately, after taking 30-60 mg zinc for months on end. I got seduced by the whole "zinc increases Testosterone" hype on the internet:
Zinc has made me a better man.
I am already including more mushrooms and beans into my diet for copper, and ofcourse stopping the zinc. I might want to try a copper supplement to see what it feels like. Which one do you use? One day I took 90 mg of zinc and experienced extreme lethargy and irritation, that was my wake-up call that I was overdoing the zinc and inducing a copper deficiency. Stopping the zinc made me feel a lot better already.

 

[ExCarniv]

10g cacao per Day is the safest way!

[Copper supplement with cocoa for copper deficiency in patients with long-term enteral nutrition]. - PubMed - NCBI

PS: I love my hot Cacaodrink with Milk and crunchy Cacao Nibs in Desserts :)

Same! Chocolate milk ftw

 

[Milan555]

I think I have been experiencing the same symptoms lately, after taking 30-60 mg zinc for months on end. I got seduced by the whole "zinc increases Testosterone" hype on the internet:
Zinc has made me a better man.
I am already including more mushrooms and beans into my diet for copper, and ofcourse stopping the zinc. I might want to try a copper supplement to see what it feels like. Which one do you use? One day I took 90 mg of zinc and experienced extreme lethargy and irritation, that was my wake-up call that I was overdoing the zinc and inducing a copper deficiency. Stopping the zinc made me feel a lot better already.

Yeah, 30-60mg zinc did the same thing to me. At FIRST though, taking a 50mg pill of zinc used to energize me and ramp up my libido like crazy. But over time, taking that same dose only led to brain fog and lethargy with no real libido increase.

Now I'm taking Solaray brand Copper 2mg capsules. I dump out half the capsule in order to get 1mg for me. Seems to be helping a lot at just the 1mg dose. I plan to stay on 1mg for another 3 weeks and slowly taper off. Let's see if the the improvements maintain after that.

 

[Milan555]

3mg copper per day is a general guideline I subscribe to all my clients, specific cases omitted, for all of time. We generally aim for a 1:5 copper:zinc ratio so that’s 3mg copper:15mg zinc for most clients. If accruing muscle mass is the goal we might up that to 4mg copper:20mg zinc during mass accrual phases.

Nice. What are some of the main changes your clients feel once they start copper and get their copper levels up? You mentioned hair color changes happening quickly. Any other mental and physical effects?

 

[Tristan Loscha]

what type of ligand/salt is to be used?coppersulphate?

 

[brix]

10g cacao per Day is the safest way!

[Copper supplement with cocoa for copper deficiency in patients with long-term enteral nutrition]. - PubMed - NCBI

PS: I love my hot Cacaodrink with Milk and crunchy Cacao Nibs in Desserts :)

Which hot cocoa product do you use?

 

[olive]

Nice. What are some of the main changes your clients feel once they start copper and get their copper levels up? You mentioned hair color changes happening quickly. Any other mental and physical effects?

Better mood, better libido, more energy, better memory, iron normalisation, hair thickness/colour, etc. I’ve also helped a few clients reverse peripheral neurothapy with copper, and a few other tricks. Most of my clients also tend to put on a fair bit of LBM but I don’t think I can attribute that directly to copper status. I will say it’s difficult to pinpoint exactly what normalisation of copper status impairs on the client because we usually make a few changes at once.

Edit: better skin quality

 

[brix]

Better mood, better libido, more energy, better memory, iron normalisation, hair thickness/colour, etc. I’ve also helped a few clients reverse peripheral neurothapy with copper, and a few other tricks. Most of my clients also tend to put on a fair bit of LBM but I don’t think I can attribute that directly to copper status. I will say it’s difficult to pinpoint exactly what normalisation of copper status impairs on the client because we usually make a few changes at once.

Edit: better skin quality

what’s your view on Hair test assessing copper status? I’ve had low copper every test along with slightly elevated zinc.

 

[Ihor]

what’s your view on Hair test assessing copper status? I’ve had low copper every test along with slightly elevated zinc.

A year ago, I had copper and ceruloplasmin tests, both were low, before this analysis I ate 300 grams of beef liver per week for a long time, a lot of chocolate. After some time i got a hair analysis, it absolutely everything was at a minimum, potassium, sodium, calcium, magnesium, selenium, manganese, iron and copper with other elements, too, those who are engaged in hair tests call it “FOUR LOWS PATTERN”, all At that time, I felt almost like a dead and i had symptoms of iron, copper, and vitamin A overload. With such quantities of dietary copper, my needs clearly had to be more than satisfied, so where did all this copper go from food and why the hair analysis, ceruloplasmin and serum didn't show a boost? I am definitely sure that I'm overloaded with it until now, including iron too. Moreover, it is generally accepted that when there is iron overload, dietary copper is not absorbed / absorbed but not used. All this gives me reason to be skeptical about testing hair as an accurate diagnostic system.

 

[ExCarniv]

Better mood, better libido, more energy, better memory, iron normalisation, hair thickness/colour, etc. I’ve also helped a few clients reverse peripheral neurothapy with copper, and a few other tricks. Most of my clients also tend to put on a fair bit of LBM but I don’t think I can attribute that directly to copper status. I will say it’s difficult to pinpoint exactly what normalisation of copper status impairs on the client because we usually make a few changes at once.

Edit: better skin quality

Do you think in your experience with clients that 250g of liver a week is enough for Copper?