Is Supplemental Vitamin D Safe? "RENAL POTASSIUM-WASTING INDUCED BY VITAMIN D"

[Nicolas Noyola]

@tyw, what are your thoughts on vitamin d from supplements or from sun?
If you search for this on the forum, you'll notice how there's still a lot of confusion on this.
For reasons that I don't understand, it seems easier to overdose with much less when people take supplements, the effects are also very different. Why?

Eleven of 45 (24%) LG had proven N. This is approximately twenty times the incidence of N in the general population. The present study was undertaken to determine the factors that contribute to this high incidence of N in LG.

you can get hypercalciuria even from sunlight. albeit it takes extreme exposure and there could be factors involved other than sunlight itself. i dont quite know what the distinction between hypercalciuria vs. hypercalcemia is either. i guess increased urinary excretion of calcium vs. increased serum calcium?
Increased Incidence of Nephrolithiasis (N) in Lifeguards (LG) in Israel

On the job LG are exposed to heat and intense sunlight over almost their entire body surface, for at least 8 hr/d, 6 mo/yr. In an attempt to study the influence of these conditions on vitamin D and calcium metabolism the following were measured: mean serum 25-hydroxycholecalciferol (25-HCC) of the LG of 59±42 (SD) ng/ml (n=34) was greater than the mean of 26±10 in season and age matched controls (n=25, p< .01). Mean serum iPTH of 421±234 pg/ml in LG (n=33) was lower than mean of 566±175 in matched controls (n=50, p< .01). Mean urinary calcium of the LG of 308±45 mg/24 hr was greater than mean control of 168±87 mg/24 hr (n=20, p< 0.001). Mean urinary Mg/Ca ratio (mEq/24 hr) of those LG who had N was lower than control values (72.3±33.6 vs. 125±63, p<0.001). This was due to increase in calciuria rather than to reduced magnesuria in LG. Daily urine volumes of the 11 LG who worked in the warm and arid Gulf of Eilat had mean daily urinary volumes of 856±270 ml/24 hr, which was lower than in controls and lower than in LG and in controls from Northern Israel (p<0.01). Levels of total serum calcium, magnesium, and phosphate in LG were within normal limits. There was a slight but statistically significant hyperuricemia in the LG.

 

[Nicolas Noyola]

you can get hypercalciuria even from sunlight. albeit it takes extreme exposure and there could be factors involved other than sunlight itself. i dont quite know what the distinction between hypercalciuria vs. hypercalcemia is either. i guess increased urinary excretion of calcium vs. increased serum calcium?
Increased Incidence of Nephrolithiasis (N) in Lifeguards (LG) in Israel

Eleven of 45 (24%) LG had proven N. This is approximately twenty times the incidence of N in the general population. The present study was undertaken to determine the factors that contribute to this high incidence of N in LG.

On the job LG are exposed to heat and intense sunlight over almost their entire body surface, for at least 8 hr/d, 6 mo/yr. In an attempt to study the influence of these conditions on vitamin D and calcium metabolism the following were measured: mean serum 25-hydroxycholecalciferol (25-HCC) of the LG of 59±42 (SD) ng/ml (n=34) was greater than the mean of 26±10 in season and age matched controls (n=25, p< .01). Mean serum iPTH of 421±234 pg/ml in LG (n=33) was lower than mean of 566±175 in matched controls (n=50, p< .01). Mean urinary calcium of the LG of 308±45 mg/24 hr was greater than mean control of 168±87 mg/24 hr (n=20, p< 0.001). Mean urinary Mg/Ca ratio (mEq/24 hr) of those LG who had N was lower than control values (72.3±33.6 vs. 125±63, p<0.001). This was due to increase in calciuria rather than to reduced magnesuria in LG. Daily urine volumes of the 11 LG who worked in the warm and arid Gulf of Eilat had mean daily urinary volumes of 856±270 ml/24 hr, which was lower than in controls and lower than in LG and in controls from Northern Israel (p<0.01). Levels of total serum calcium, magnesium, and phosphate in LG were within normal limits. There was a slight but statistically significant hyperuricemia in the LG.

 

[somuch4food]

Cholecalciferol...

 

[Amazoniac]

"Male Sprague-Dawley rats weighing between 250 and 400 g were used in all the experiments. Animals were kept in individual metabolic cages which permitted the collection of urine without contamination by feces. Urine was collected under mineral oil, with thymol used as a preservative. The animals were rendered hypercalcemic by the intraperitoneal injection of 200,000 U of vitamin D2 (calciferol) dissolved in 0.5 ml of peanut oil daily for 4 consecutive days."

"[Exp. 1] Twenty-two rats were placed on a diet containing 133 mEq of Na+ per kg but no potassium (10) for 7 days. At the end of this time, when the urinary excretion of potassium had declined to very low levels, half of the animals were given vitamin D for 4 days."

That's insane, but they could still handle the first hit with class, just like Sheila would:

View attachment 10977​

I should've commented in a clearer way that using this experiment as a case against supplementation due to potassium loss doesn't make much sense.

- Check out ecstatichamster's size
- His friends weighting on average 300 g received 200,000 IU through injection every day for 4 days: 650,000 IU/kg/d
- That's about 120,000 IU/kg/d of D2 (used ferret, not only because I just posted something about iron, but also because of similar weight, they's slender however it's just for the idea)
- 120,000 IU * 70 kg = 8,400,000 IU of D2 per day

And it's impressive how the first punch still didn't affect them.


But there's more..

Animals were kept on a diet without potassium, which is why the urine content of controls started to drop with their bodies trying to retain it.

 

[charlie]

I should've commented in a clearer way that using this experiment as a case against supplementation due to potassium loss doesn't make much sense.

- Check out ecstatichamster's size
- His friends weighting on average 300 g received 200,000 IU through injection every day for 4 days: 650,000 IU/kg/d
- That's about 120,000 IU/kg/d of D2 (used ferret, not only because I just posted something about iron, but also because of similar weight, they's slender however it's just for the idea)
- 120,000 IU * 70 kg = 8,400,000 IU of D2 per day

And it's impressive how the first punch still didn't affected them.

"I can tell you that in my patients & clients who take Vitamin D supplements long enough, I often see that their blood tests eventually show high calcium and low potassium. This is reflected much earlier on their hair mineral analysis (so much so that I refer to it as a vitamin D pattern, high calcium and nearly non-existent potassium). - Dr. Garrett Smith

 

[Amazoniac]

"I can tell you that in my patients & clients who take Vitamin D supplements long enough, I often see that their blood tests eventually show high calcium and low potassium. This is reflected much earlier on their hair mineral analysis (so much so that I refer to it as a vitamin D pattern, high calcium and nearly non-existent potassium). - Dr. Garrett Smith

I edited the message to add more information. I knew that was from him for coming across some time ago.

It's possible that it increases the need for potassium just like it does for magnesium; especially when people take more than they need, for quite some time and keep ingesting calcium as usual. A decrease in magnesium alone will eventually lead to potassium deficiency.

But what bothers in this story is him starting this chain by sharing an unrealistic experiment to alarm people about the effects. I was reminded of it due to your post on the other thread.

 

[Whichway?]

Just another example of how vitamins alone may cause trouble rather than helping. Very interesting that the sulfated form of Vit D makes it water soluble. Given that Vit D is a seco steroid and heavily influences gene expression of multiple genes, it seems to make a case for NOT supplementing Vit D, especially since what is the point of altering gene expression in fat soluble tissues but not water soluble tissues, the latter being the majority of your tissues.

 

[cyclops]

Someone should ask Peat about this whole Fat Soluble Vs Water Soluble Vitamin D. He probably knows about it, yet still recommends people take D in the winter.

 

[Amazoniac]

- Name a rat poison crucial to health and safer than water | Venom D Wiki

Extremely toxic!!1