K2 Causing Pressure On Sides Of Head. Why

[mayweatherking]

I has ve ave weird reaction to k2. It causes my skull to feel like it is expanding. When I first started k2 I had very bad flu like symptoms and very bad preasure. My hair is falling out so I feel it is some mechanism related to mpb.

Is there some co factor to k2 to avoid this? K2 seems to increase my libido, but really makes my head feel like its expanding or something. Its def k2.

I have 3 or 4 tsh, lowrrish cholesterol, bad pth, high prolactin, low vit d. Im doing vit d and k2 to fix the d problem, but maybe im doing too much. Im taking 15mg of thorne in the morning then ill take more in the day. After I take k2 and drink milk.. I feel the expansion. So weird.

I have low dose westthroid on the way, but what else to do? Have u ever heard of this? I feel so screwed up my body is :-(

 

[tara]

I don't know if the K2 is contributing to your feeling of pressure in the head, but if you think it is, you could experiment with reducing your dose. There seem to be some benefits to be gained from 15mg or less, too. What happens if you take 10mg/day, or 5mg, or 2mg?

 

[Dan W]

Someone else noticed strange reactions to K2 and suspected he's one of an unlucky few who don't tolerate it well, similar to the adverse effects mentioned in this document. Though it's always hard to know whether those type of stats are due to the substance being tested. But his symptoms were negative enough that he discontinued it.

Might be worth keeping an eye on your blood pressure in case it's anything along those lines, along with lowering the dose as Tara mentioned.

 

[supercoolguy]

It's interesting how everybody has diff issues. Wish I knew about k2 and interactions but for what its worth....Anything else ever had same side effects? Brand? Excepients? I'd stop 4now

 

[mayweatherking]

post 98318 I don't know if the K2 is contributing to your feeling of pressure in the head, but if you think it is, you could experiment with reducing your dose. There seem to be some benefits to be gained from 15mg or less, too. What happens if you take 10mg/day, or 5mg, or 2mg?

i've tried a lower dose.. I guess it does do a bit better. Do you know the dose requirement for making it work to it's full effect by any chance? I'm trying to raise my D as much as possible.

post 98343 Someone else noticed strange reactions to K2 and suspected he's one of an unlucky few who don't tolerate it well, similar to the adverse effects mentioned in this document. Though it's always hard to know whether those type of stats are due to the substance being tested. But his symptoms were negative enough that he discontinued it.

Might be worth keeping an eye on your blood pressure in case it's anything along those lines, along with lowering the dose as Tara mentioned.

I honestly believe I'm tolerating it well, I really believe there is some pathology into what is contributing towards male pattern baldness happening. There is some effect it is having. The reason is because when I feel the head swelling.. all of a sudden my libido increases. It's somehow my sex hormones are causing my head to expand or something, I'm not sure.


Overall, I am going to go with I think it has to do with vitamin A lacking because I have crazy amount of skin fungus all over my chest and on my body in different places. I'm going to keep eating liver everyday until it goes away.

 

[tara]

Fungi don't like acid. You could try slopping a bit of dilute vinegar on chest in shower after washing (then rinse to remove smell).

 

[mayweatherking]

post 98541 Fungi don't like acid. You could try slopping a bit of dilute vinegar on chest in shower after washing (then rinse to remove smell).

I'm not worried about the fungus. Well I am.. but I'd rather get rid of it via internal mechanisms so I know what I'm doing is working..that's why I haven't done anything topical with it.

 

[montmorency]

post 98246 I has ve ave weird reaction to k2. It causes my skull to feel like it is expanding. When I first started k2 I had very bad flu like symptoms and very bad preasure. My hair is falling out so I feel it is some mechanism related to mpb.

Is there some co factor to k2 to avoid this? K2 seems to increase my libido, but really makes my head feel like its expanding or something. Its def k2.

I have 3 or 4 tsh, lowrrish cholesterol, bad pth, high prolactin, low vit d. Im doing vit d and k2 to fix the d problem, but maybe im doing too much. Im taking 15mg of thorne in the morning then ill take more in the day. After I take k2 and drink milk.. I feel the expansion. So weird.

I have low dose westthroid on the way, but what else to do? Have u ever heard of this? I feel so screwed up my body is :-(

15g of K2-MK4 sounds like a very high dose to me. I thought most people only took it in mcg amounts (say up to 1000 mcg).

Do you have a specific reason for taking that much?

I've heard (from what seemed like a reliable source) that you need vitamin D3 to make use of the K2, so make sure you are taking enough D3 (at least 10,000 IU say).
Hope you are getting enough animal fat (or at least coconut oil).
You might need some vitamin A to balance the D, but I'd try to get that from good butter, cheese, and maybe liver.
(Edit: OK, I see you are eating liver already).

As you seem to have definitely identified a correlation between your taking this much K2 and the head expanding feeling, then it would seem definitely prudent to cut down (but slowly, in case of rebound effects).

And it it were me, I'd be taking vitamin C as well.

 

[mayweatherking]

post 99280

post 98246 I has ve ave weird reaction to k2. It causes my skull to feel like it is expanding. When I first started k2 I had very bad flu like symptoms and very bad preasure. My hair is falling out so I feel it is some mechanism related to mpb.

Is there some co factor to k2 to avoid this? K2 seems to increase my libido, but really makes my head feel like its expanding or something. Its def k2.

I have 3 or 4 tsh, lowrrish cholesterol, bad pth, high prolactin, low vit d. Im doing vit d and k2 to fix the d problem, but maybe im doing too much. Im taking 15mg of thorne in the morning then ill take more in the day. After I take k2 and drink milk.. I feel the expansion. So weird.

I have low dose westthroid on the way, but what else to do? Have u ever heard of this? I feel so screwed up my body is :-(

15g of K2-MK4 sounds like a very high dose to me. I thought most people only took it in mcg amounts (say up to 1000 mcg).

Do you have a specific reason for taking that much?

I've heard (from what seemed like a reliable source) that you need vitamin D3 to make use of the K2, so make sure you are taking enough D3 (at least 10,000 IU say).
Hope you are getting enough animal fat (or at least coconut oil).
You might need some vitamin A to balance the D, but I'd try to get that from good butter, cheese, and maybe liver.
(Edit: OK, I see you are eating liver already).

As you seem to have definitely identified a correlation between your taking this much K2 and the head expanding feeling, then it would seem definitely prudent to cut down (but slowly, in case of rebound effects).

And it it were me, I'd be taking vitamin C as well.

Yeah I cut down on it and it seems to have helped. What do you think is good to take for animal fat? I'm not eating animal fat right now I don't think. I am allergic to coconut oil. Yes, I got the refined and unrefined and both did not agree with me. I only do raw goat milk for food. I'll ask the lady I buy milk from.. maybe she can make me some goat milk fat or something.

 

[welshwing]

I know the answer for sure, K2 is calcifying your skull. It hurts because minerals are being packed onto your skull, it thickens bones. I'm not sure if it does it in random places, or in places where stress is placed. K2 + calcium + D3 can be good for preventing osteoporosis or thickening bones, but take it to extremes and your bones will become brittle (osteopetrosis). I know all this because I'm experimenting with hormones effects on bones and K2 is ideal for killing the cells that cause bone resorption and it promotes bone growth.

 

[lexis]

I know the answer for sure, K2 is calcifying your skull. It hurts because minerals are being packed onto your skull, it thickens bones. I'm not sure if it does it in random places, or in places where stress is placed. K2 + calcium + D3 can be good for preventing osteoporosis or thickening bones, but take it to extremes and your bones will become brittle (osteopetrosis). I know all this because I'm experimenting with hormones effects on bones and K2 is ideal for killing the cells that cause bone resorption and it promotes bone growth.

Fluoride is said calcify the pineal gland. K2 maybe displacing calcium and other metals

 

[mayweatherking]

post 99394 I know the answer for sure, K2 is calcifying your skull. It hurts because minerals are being packed onto your skull, it thickens bones. I'm not sure if it does it in random places, or in places where stress is placed. K2 + calcium + D3 can be good for preventing osteoporosis or thickening bones, but take it to extremes and your bones will become brittle (osteopetrosis). I know all this because I'm experimenting with hormones effects on bones and K2 is ideal for killing the cells that cause bone resorption and it promotes bone growth.

Am I just usijg too much d and k2? How do I know my limit?

 

[mayweatherking]

How can I avoid it? Im pretty sure this is the root cause of mpb. I feel like too much phosphorus and too little calcium is also contributing to this.. is it possible? I dont drink flouride fwiw.. but I agree it is bad. The coffee I drink may have fluoride. . Actually it def does bc I buy it at coffee shop.. ill have to start making my own

 

[welshwing]

Sorry for the wait. Truth is I don't know much, sorry I can't entirely help fix your problem. All I know is that K2 removes calcium from soft tissues and moves it to harder tissue. I don't know how you can prevent further calcification, but if Peat says K2 is good then perhaps try supplementing it at a much lower dose. Not everyone can use K2, I think the admin reported K2 causing excessive tartar build-up.

I've also heard calcification causes baldness but I don't know. Women with high testosterone and low estrogen will increase their skull volume but don't bald. I think hormones has more to do with it, ectomorphs don't bald as much as meso's or endo's.

I don't know much about fluoride, It's really bad but I'm not sure how K2 effects it.

Lastly, you're correct, taking too much calcium or any mineral is giving K2 more to use. K2, calcium and boron can be used to thicken and enlarge bones.

 

[Kyle Bigman]

I has ve ave weird reaction to k2. It causes my skull to feel like it is expanding. When I first started k2 I had very bad flu like symptoms and very bad preasure. My hair is falling out so I feel it is some mechanism related to mpb.

Is there some co factor to k2 to avoid this? K2 seems to increase my libido, but really makes my head feel like its expanding or something. Its def k2.

I have 3 or 4 tsh, lowrrish cholesterol, bad pth, high prolactin, low vit d. Im doing vit d and k2 to fix the d problem, but maybe im doing too much. Im taking 15mg of thorne in the morning then ill take more in the day. After I take k2 and drink milk.. I feel the expansion. So weird.

I have low dose westthroid on the way, but what else to do? Have u ever heard of this? I feel so screwed up my body is :-(

Hey Mayweather, have you discovered anything more about that reaction you had? I have just started supplementing K2 as well and have had headaches that went away as soon as I stopped supplementing – like you have taken finasteride and have mpb.

 

[Sulcuscentralis]

I’m in a sikilar situation skull wise. Mpb is worse on it too. My vitamin D is low too, even after getting lots of sun exposure. I think K2 might have a role in it. My hypothesis is that it’s driving vitamin D methabolism pathways more, so it’s “using it up” so to speak, although it’s pretty much broscience. My suggestion is reducing the dose and use it sporadically. If I remember correctly Haidut menioned in one of Danny Roddy’s podcasts that even though K2 mk4 has a short half life the effect it produces is long lasting, so there might not be a need to supplement daily. You can also try topical application.

 

[LLight]

@Sulcuscentralis

K2 might increase the enzyme CYP11A1 which makes vitamin D pass through another pathway (which is a good thing because this form is also active but does not have the same effect on calcium), different than the classic one:

But it might also increase CYP3A4 in the liver (because it is an agonist of the SXR nuclear receptor) which may catabolize vitamin D (the 25(OH) D3 form, a transformation that is not represented on this illustration).

Water restriction might interestingly (I've just realized that it was true for both enzymes which reinforce my view that vitamin K could be linked to water restriction/osmotic stress) do the same thing : it might also induce CYP11A1 and CYP3A4:

Spoiler: Potential link between K2 and osmotic stress

A homologue of vitamin K epoxide reductase in Solanum lycopersicum is involved in resistance to osmotic stress - PubMed

Vitamin K epoxide reductase (VKOR) exists widely in the chloroplasts of higher plants and plays important roles in redox regulation. However, investigations of plant VKOR function have primarily focused on VKOR from Arabidopsis, and knowledge concerning this function is therefore quite limited...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Vitamin K deficiency reduces testosterone production in the testis through down-regulation of the Cyp11a a cholesterol side chain cleavage enzyme in rats - PubMed

Vitamin K (K) is an essential factor for the posttranslational modification of blood coagulation factors as well as proteins in the bone matrix (Gla proteins). It is known that K is not only distributed in the liver and bones but also abundantly distributed in the brain, kidney, and gonadal...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I'm wondering if the effect seen in these rats, with a doubling of the testosterone level, could correspond to (at least in part) to the in vivo effect of the in vitro results presented here:



Could vitamin K be necessary during osmotic stress, especially in the testes where it would be necessary for steroidogenesis which could be increased by high salt/NFAT5 activation?

As already posted previously, an enzyme "looking like" CYP11A1 could be upregulated during dehydrating conditions in insects:



The 20-hydroxyecdysone insect hormone seems to be increased during dehydration while its metabolism relies on an enzyme that "was reportedly inhibited by antibodies to vertebrate P450scc (CYP11A)".

It seems like CYP11A1 enzyme (GMO) is protective against salinity-stress in plants as found in this study:

(PDF) Targeted Protection of Mitochondria of Mesophyll Cells in Transgenic CYP11A1 CDNA Expressing Tobacco Plant Leaves after NaCl-Induced Stress Damage

PDF | Recently we have showed that the expression of the mammalian CYP11A1 cDNA in plants confers their resistance to abiotic and biotic stresses. To... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

In this one, CYP11A1 was protective regarding heat stress (in GMO plants again):​

cyp11A1 Canola plants under short time heat stress conditions​

Would hormesis be a real thing regarding steroid hormones production and heat stress / dehydration? If this is the case, what would be the best strategy to trigger CYP11A1 upregulation? Is this enzyme giving mammals a greater protection against dehydration (as seen in the modification of mitochondria appearance with salitinity stress that does not occur when there is CYP11A1)? Does vitamin K deficiency renders one more susceptible to dehydration stress?
​

---

Also, betaine is protective against osmotic / high glucose stress in ovarian cells:

Betaine ameliorates impaired steroidogenesis and apoptosis in mice granulosa cells induced by high glucose concentration - PubMed

Betaine is a bioactive peptide whose beneficial effects on diabetes complications have been considered, previously. The present study aimed to investigate the possible protective effects of betaine against hyperglycemia-induced steroidogenesis impairment and apoptosis in mice granulosa cells...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Also interestingly, there was a user on this forum (Scenes) who tried to drink way less water than normally and that it helped his hair. Here is his comment:

I agree it’s not all about dehydration through eliminating fluids. I think the bigger thing is balancing minerals and increasing resting metabolic rate. I think it’s possibly a simple method to help balance minerals. Salting water is fine, I’ve been doing it occasionally.


Day 1 - drink water consistently throughout the day, 2-3L total.
Day 2,3,4 - drink a small glass of water with meals only, 2-4x a day.


In terms of ‘proper hydration’ and whether water helps or hurts in that regard, I think the water with meals is the key. In the presence of stomach acids, food is digested through the small intestine and filtered properly. A bit of water/juice with meals helps increase blood volume and get those balanced nutrients to cells. Fluids outside of meals (no/little stomach acid) doesn’t get filtered the same way and ends up in interstitial fluids between cells, or flooding cells which lowers their metabolic rate. Somehow, despite consuming heaps of fluids, this seemed to make me thirstier, and the cycle perpetuates.


I’m only advocating because it worked so quick for me on a number of levels, and it is so simple. Do that for 2-3 weeks and see if you don’t feel and look much better.


Just to recap, my hair looks thicker/healthier, my skin is brighter, my energy levels are still solid (they were usually solid on peat diet anyway), and my stomach is flat. People have commented that ‘I’m back’ as I’ve always had quite an athletic build, but peating made me the fattest I have ever been in my life, whilst not fixing the hair/skin/pfs issues I had coming in.


Having said that, this forum has taught me heaps. I agree sugar is amazing, salt is critical, and all the stress hormones and lowered metabolic rate are the cause of all/most disease. I just think I may have found a much simpler way to tackle the issue.

Sorry for the quotes in the spoiler that are badly transcripted.

 

[facesavant]

i've tried a lower dose.. I guess it does do a bit better. Do you know the dose requirement for making it work to it's full effect by any chance? I'm trying to raise my D as much as possible.



I honestly believe I'm tolerating it well, I really believe there is some pathology into what is contributing towards male pattern baldness happening. There is some effect it is having. The reason is because when I feel the head swelling.. all of a sudden my libido increases. It's somehow my sex hormones are causing my head to expand or something, I'm not sure.


Overall, I am going to go with I think it has to do with vitamin A lacking because I have crazy amount of skin fungus all over my chest and on my body in different places. I'm going to keep eating liver everyday until it goes away.

I know this is a super old post, I hope it's not too late. I was wondering if the vitamin A helped with skin fungus? And, do you still get head pressure? Also, have you considered low blood pressure for the head pressure? Thank you