Energin - Liquid B-Complex Vitamin Mix

[bornamachine]

Haidut, hi, I've bought the energin along with some other supps from idealabs but so far have only tried the energin, here is my results and would like your input, I would apply about 1-2 drops in the morning to my wrist area and rub arms together, I noticed in the following days that I would crash less and would not be dying for food, 3 or 4 days into it I tried putting a couple drop on during day, I noticed it made me pretty agressive in that I would for example almost fly off the handle if my son wouldn't listen to me (as toddlers do often) anyway, I also obsereved more energy, doing things around the house instead of sitting around, but there were also negative side effects, I noticed wrist pain that increased more and more every day, the pain continued to increase, my legs, etc, a very deep and subtle pain but I did not necessarily attribute it to energin, also my stool was becoming more and more smelly every day, after about a week or energin I discontinued and the stool started to return to normal smell, also pain strated to leave but slower then it came, today, after about 3 or 4 weeks since stopping energized, I tried a big drop on my skin again after eating at work, and again the joint pain and deep muscle pain started to appear, tightness around neck and subtle deep pains, any idea what could be causing this reaction and have you had anyone else with like symptoms write on here? Thank you

 

[Arnold Grape]

That's a microcosmic amount you have applied, so I'm going to say you went straight psychosomatic on this one.

 

[haidut]

Haidut, hi, I've bought the energin along with some other supps from idealabs but so far have only tried the energin, here is my results and would like your input, I would apply about 1-2 drops in the morning to my wrist area and rub arms together, I noticed in the following days that I would crash less and would not be dying for food, 3 or 4 days into it I tried putting a couple drop on during day, I noticed it made me pretty agressive in that I would for example almost fly off the handle if my son wouldn't listen to me (as toddlers do often) anyway, I also obsereved more energy, doing things around the house instead of sitting around, but there were also negative side effects, I noticed wrist pain that increased more and more every day, the pain continued to increase, my legs, etc, a very deep and subtle pain but I did not necessarily attribute it to energin, also my stool was becoming more and more smelly every day, after about a week or energin I discontinued and the stool started to return to normal smell, also pain strated to leave but slower then it came, today, after about 3 or 4 weeks since stopping energized, I tried a big drop on my skin again after eating at work, and again the joint pain and deep muscle pain started to appear, tightness around neck and subtle deep pains, any idea what could be causing this reaction and have you had anyone else with like symptoms write on here? Thank you

Not sure what could be causing these symptoms in such low amounts, except possibly hypoglycemia (especially the irritability).

 

[bornamachine]

Gotcha, well I definitely have thryroid/liver issue in converting body fat to energy which started after many iron donations, I stopped the vitamin B since taking the drop yesterday which started causing issues, my tension in my hands is easing little by little now and I am not irretible at all today. Thanks for the input.

 

[KyleKingsly]

Thinking about buying some of this stuff very soon, but I'm very concerned about the staining issue. I work in a professional corporate environment and can't afford to mess up my nice clothes with big orange stains haha.

At the same time, it seems like it'd be a waste to use this stuff orally (and lose a great of absorption) when I just could just buy B vitamins in solutions for probably cheaper unit prices (even when buying multiple ones at once to stack).

Does anyone have any good suggestions for avoiding the terrible staining? I'm thinking about waking up 15 min earlier to put this stuff on, then trying to scrub it off with Draxe Witch Hazel before I go to work? I saw that someone was saying that topical magnesium helps with the staining too, can anyone comment on that?

All ideas are appreciated :)

 

[Marja]

I am from Finland and interested of this product. What are the estimated shipping costs and time?

I am currently on vitamin injection (0.33 mcg B12, 33mg B1 and 33 mg B6) twice a week. Has been a life changing treatment! I suffer from lactate build up type of symptoms. I get stiff tensed muscles so bad that my posture has been awful as well as my achilles tendons/heels hurt bad. Shot has relieved that symptom but the effect only lasts for three days atm. Fourth week on this treatment.

My homocysteine has been high and B12 low. Sublingual supplements has worked some but takes months and homocysteine increase /B12 decrease if I quit B12.

I am fine with the injection but because of B6 it's not ideal in long term. At first I had jittery feeling from the injection but soon realised I need to eat high carb before and after to skip that jittery feeling, then I feel nice and relaxed.

This injection has been awesome as I had no appetite for 2 decades, eating made me ill , have been struggling with my weight; losing weight fast. Now I have appetite, I wake up feeling rested , I feel calm, body temp higher, blood pressure slightly better. I just feel like human being.

Considering the symptoms and good effect of the injection I wonder if Energin would be suitable for me? At some point I will be switched to just B12 injection so that will be covered.

I am on essential amino acids , collagen ,iron and iodine (high thyroglobulin /low urine iodine) to fix all the deficiencies caused by malnutrition. Started from multiple courses of antibiotics and chronic yersinia.

Like I said I am fine with injections but the effect is a bit short term , I wonder if this supplement would be somewhat equal to injection but safer with lower B6 ?

Thanks!

 

[haidut]

I am from Finland and interested of this product. What are the estimated shipping costs and time?

I am currently on vitamin injection (0.33 mcg B12, 33mg B1 and 33 mg B6) twice a week. Has been a life changing treatment! I suffer from lactate build up type of symptoms. I get stiff tensed muscles so bad that my posture has been awful as well as my achilles tendons/heels hurt bad. Shot has relieved that symptom but the effect only lasts for three days atm. Fourth week on this treatment.

My homocysteine has been high and B12 low. Sublingual supplements has worked some but takes months and homocysteine increase /B12 decrease if I quit B12.

I am fine with the injection but because of B6 it's not ideal in long term. At first I had jittery feeling from the injection but soon realised I need to eat high carb before and after to skip that jittery feeling, then I feel nice and relaxed.

This injection has been awesome as I had no appetite for 2 decades, eating made me ill , have been struggling with my weight; losing weight fast. Now I have appetite, I wake up feeling rested , I feel calm, body temp higher, blood pressure slightly better. I just feel like human being.

Considering the symptoms and good effect of the injection I wonder if Energin would be suitable for me? At some point I will be switched to just B12 injection so that will be covered.

I am on essential amino acids , collagen ,iron and iodine (high thyroglobulin /low urine iodine) to fix all the deficiencies caused by malnutrition. Started from multiple courses of antibiotics and chronic yersinia.

Like I said I am fine with injections but the effect is a bit short term , I wonder if this supplement would be somewhat equal to injection but safer with lower B6 ?

Thanks!

I don't know if it would be suitable for you, a doctor would be a better person to ask. The shipping costs to Finland are $13 for 2 bottles of Energin, and $23 for up 3-10 bottles. It usually takes 7-10 days for delivery and the average is about 8 days.

 

[Marja]

Thanks haidut. Doesn't sound too expensive.

I asked my doctor does he think this I would benefit a product like this or more so use it as a backup to up my thiamine. Tho I understood it's possible to make topical B1 by yourself? Could try that but in the long term need other B's as well to balance the situation and that's why I hope my doctor support trying Energin. Will see.

 

[haidut]

Thanks haidut. Doesn't sound too expensive.

I asked my doctor does he think this I would benefit a product like this or more so use it as a backup to up my thiamine. Tho I understood it's possible to make topical B1 by yourself? Could try that but in the long term need other B's as well to balance the situation and that's why I hope my doctor support trying Energin. Will see.

Yes, you can make your own topical B1 if you find high purity B1 powder and dissolve it in vodka or other clear alcohol.

 

[inthedark]

Thinking about buying some of this stuff very soon, but I'm very concerned about the staining issue. I work in a professional corporate environment and can't afford to mess up my nice clothes with big orange stains haha.

At the same time, it seems like it'd be a waste to use this stuff orally (and lose a great of absorption) when I just could just buy B vitamins in solutions for probably cheaper unit prices (even when buying multiple ones at once to stack).

Does anyone have any good suggestions for avoiding the terrible staining? I'm thinking about waking up 15 min earlier to put this stuff on, then trying to scrub it off with Draxe Witch Hazel before I go to work? I saw that someone was saying that topical magnesium helps with the staining too, can anyone comment on that?

All ideas are appreciated :)

Maybe I've missed something but why would absorb less orally? I thought that for most substances oral administration results in higher absorption, but with topical you can better target certain areas.

 

[denise]

Thinking about buying some of this stuff very soon, but I'm very concerned about the staining issue. I work in a professional corporate environment and can't afford to mess up my nice clothes with big orange stains haha.

At the same time, it seems like it'd be a waste to use this stuff orally (and lose a great of absorption) when I just could just buy B vitamins in solutions for probably cheaper unit prices (even when buying multiple ones at once to stack).

Does anyone have any good suggestions for avoiding the terrible staining? I'm thinking about waking up 15 min earlier to put this stuff on, then trying to scrub it off with Draxe Witch Hazel before I go to work? I saw that someone was saying that topical magnesium helps with the staining too, can anyone comment on that?

All ideas are appreciated :)

I apply it to my scalp to avoid the staining issue. Here's a post about how I do that: Easy Scalp Application of Liquid Supplements . I don't use a lot at a time, though. It would certainly be trickier to try applying a full 40-drop dose at once.

 

[Wagner83]

The opaque bottle is much better, not only does it protect the light-sensitive vitamins but it's easier to dose as the drops ain't in a hurry.

 

[Wagner83]

@haidut do you know if the riboflavin could dramatically increase the (potential) damage done by red light in the eyes?

 

[haidut]

@haidut do you know if the riboflavin could dramatically increase the (potential) damage done by red light in the eyes?

Any quinone-like molecule can do it. The R5P in Energin gets converted into FAD, and when combined with bright light it has the same effects as the photodynamic therapy with MB+light. That is why Peat said a few times he think riboflavin doses above 20mg daily are too high and can lead to ROS overload for many people, especially ones sitting in the sun all day. That's one of the reasons we capped the B2 in the product at 20mg per dose.

 

[KyleKingsly]

Maybe I've missed something but why would absorb less orally? I thought that for most substances oral administration results in higher absorption, but with topical you can better target certain areas.

I think you're right in general but I believe a key selling point of Haidut's products is that they tend to be absorb better topically (along with being able to target certain areas). Specifically with Energin, the topical absorption is high enough that one can use a lower dosage of 5-10 drops as opposed to the equivalent oral dosage (which would be 40 drops I believe).

I'm guessing that these b vitamins may be broken down to a certain degree (and thus not absorbed as well as they could be) in the GI tract, and topical absorption allows one to bypass this. Other people can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong in this, just hypothesizing.

 

[Wagner83]

Any quinone-like molecule can do it. The R5P in Energin gets converted into FAD, and when combined with bright light it has the same effects as the photodynamic therapy with MB+light. That is why Peat said a few times he think riboflavin doses above 20mg daily are too high and can lead to ROS overload for many people, especially ones sitting in the sun all day. That's one of the reasons we capped the B2 in the product at 20mg per dose.

Ok thanks for the explanation here you had said 10mg:

1. Yes, they should. In fact, as I mentioned before there is a drug sold in Europe called Cytoflavin which contains inosine, B2, succinic acid, and B3 - ingredients found in Cardenosine and Energin. MB should improve electron transfer and synergize with Energin and Cardenosine. Red light is always good to get exposure to and should also synergize with the products but the only formal studies I am aware of used just MB and red light, not the rest of the ingredients in the products. But based on what we know about red light it should provide additional benefit.
2. Possibly, depending on dose of MB used and how long the red light exposure is. Peat said riboflavin doses should be capped at 10mg daily especially is exposure to bright light is expected, so I would recommend doing the same with MB but capping at 5mg since MB has even more potential to generate ROS compared to B2.

Not that I want to argue, but I'm curious about it since I had used the redlight in the eyes for a few days with nothing but benefits, and started getting issues around supplemental vit A and K2 (thrice 1 drop of retinyl palmitate and a bit more K2 which is a quinone after all) and energin. I guess I'll retry the redlight after some time off all the rest, it could simply be the redlight which isn't safe when aimed in the eyes after all, but the effects there are very particular, as @Daniel11 has pointed out many times. Given the sensitivity of the eyes and the relative intensity of the redlight, perhaps any dose is much worse than none.

 

[haidut]

Ok thanks for the explanation here you had said 10mg:

Not that I want to argue, but I'm curious about it since I had used the redlight in the eyes for a few days with nothing but benefits, and started getting issues around supplemental vit A and K2 (thrice 1 drop of retinyl palmitate and a bit more K2 which is a quinone after all) and energin. I guess I'll retry the redlight after some time off all the rest, it could simply be the redlight which isn't safe when aimed in the eyes after all, but the effects there are very particular, as @Daniel11 has pointed out many times. Given the sensitivity of the eyes and the relative intensity of the redlight, perhaps any dose is much worse than none.

I think he said 10mg was his preferred dose in one interview and then in another one said 20mg would be the upper limit.

 

[Trina]

Does Energin today contain the exact ingredients as listed at the beginning of the thread back in 2014? I tried scanning through the 27 pages on the thread, but didn't notice anything. Sorry for asking if there is a better place to look for current ingredients.

 

[haidut]

Does Energin today contain the exact ingredients as listed at the beginning of the thread back in 2014? I tried scanning through the 27 pages on the thread, but didn't notice anything. Sorry for asking if there is a better place to look for current ingredients.

Yes, it does. The formulation has not changed really.

 

[Kitridge30]

hey guys I might have missed this question if it was already asked but two things....How do I take the Energin? where and do rub it in? and also do I need to refrigerate it after opening? thanks in advance.