L-lysine - Serotonin Antagonist

milk_lover

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I've been on Cyproheptadine since Christmas, but tapered off that a week or two ago, and just started back on Lysine.
Thanks for the reply. Any reason behind the switch back to lysine? Are lysine and cypro comparable?
 

Peata

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Thanks for the reply. Any reason behind the switch back to lysine? Are lysine and cypro comparable?
There are some haidut threads around showing some overlap in what they two of them do (theanine has overlap as well, btw). I just felt I'd been on Cypro for a long enough stretch. That's probably the longest stretch I'd been on it over the last couple years I've been cycling on and off it. I believe RP doesn't recommend longterm use. With the lysine as well, I don't intend to use it daily, maybe a few times per week. There was some talk of negative symptoms that could occur with daily high doses.
 

Regina

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If metabolism is not working well for whatever reason, the body compensates with increasing the stress hormones. So, if you lower these without simultaneously restoring thyroid function then you may end up feeling exhausted / weak. I think the adrenal fatigue that so many people report is actually this - hypothyroid people relying on stress hormones somehow ending up lowering them while still being hypothyroid.
It is good to lower the stress hormones, but it has to go hand in hand with restoring thyroid.
:thumbsup: Yep.
 

TubZy

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Has anyone tried stacking lysine and glycine together (not gelatin)
 

Frankdee20

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Lysine is a competitive inhibitor of arginine absorption and transport, and as such has been proposed to inhibit the synthesis of NO. Here are several studies showing that it does in fact inhibit NO synthesis and as such has been tested for endotoxin protection and schizophrenia. Btw, It seems NO is implicated in virtually all human pathologies these days!
Animal studies used doses equivalent to about 4g-6g per day for a human, and the human studies used 6g daily, which suggests that this is the effective dose for NO inhibition.

1. Human studies
L-lysine as adjunctive treatment in patients with schizophrenia: a single-blinded, randomized, cross-over pilot study. - PubMed - NCBI
L-lysine as an adjunct to risperidone in patients with chronic schizophrenia: a double-blind, placebo-controlled, randomized trial. - PubMed - NCBI


2. Animal studies
L-lysine decreases nitric oxide production and increases vascular resistance in lungs isolated from lipopolysaccharide-treated neonatal pigs. - PubMed - NCBI
5-Fluorinated L-lysine analogues as selective induced nitric oxide synthase inhibitors. - PubMed - NCBI
Effect of chronic treatment with the inducible nitric oxide synthase inhibitor N-iminoethyl-L-lysine or with L-arginine on progression of coronary ... - PubMed - NCBI
The amino acid L-lysine blocks the disruptive effect of phencyclidine on prepulse inhibition in mice. - PubMed - NCBI
Effect of L-lysine on nitric oxide overproduction in endotoxic shock. - PubMed - NCBI

In addition, here are more studies showing lysine acts like a serotonin and opioid antagonist in the GI tract, and heart. In the heart study, lysine acted similar to thyroid hormone to increase contraction force and was proposed to be helpful for performance enhancement in exercise. Since lysine also antagonized opioid receptors in the GI tract, it may have some activity similar to naltrexone.
Effect of lysine supplementation on health and morbidity in subjects belonging to poor peri-urban households in Accra, Ghana
http://www.pnas.org/content/101/22/8285.full
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19662383
"...However, L-lysine (5 mM) shifted the concentration-response curve for a positive inotropic effect of 5-hydroxytryptamine (5-HT; serotonin) in atrium of transgenic mice (with cardiac specific overexpression of 5-HT(4) receptors) to higher concentrations. In summary, we describe a novel positive inotropic effect of an essential amino acid, L-lysine, in the mammalian heart. One might speculate that L-lysine treatment under certain conditions could sustain cardiac performance. Moreover, L-lysine is able to block, at least in part, cardiac 5-HT(4) receptors."

Moreover, and perhaps most importantly, lysine seems to be a much more general serotonin antagonist without any agonist effects. If this is true, and lysine does not have some unforeseen bad effect Peat has written about then I think lysine could be a viable option for people having gut issues like IBS, IBD, Chron's etc. All these conditions present with increased serotonin synthesis in the gut combined with high NO (and lysine inhibits that too).
Finally, a general serotonin antagonist would likely have an anti-depressant effect without the potentially dopamine-suppressing qualities of cyproheptadine (thorough its antagonism of the 5-HT2C receptor).
http://www.gastrojournal.org/article/S0 ... X/abstract

"...L-lysine (0.8 mmol/dL) inhibited serotonin binding to guinea pig corpus striatum 5-HT4 receptors by 9.7% but had no effect on other serotonin receptors. At 100-fold higher concentration (80 mmol/dL), which are non-physiologic, lysine blocked >40% of serotonin binding to 5-HT4 receptors but also inhibited binding to 5-HT1A, 5-HT2A, 5-HT2B. Binding results were compared to effects of L-lysine on serotonin-evoked ileal contractions. By itself, L-lysine had no contractile action on huinea pig ileal segments indicating a lack of serotonin receptor agonism. Conversely, L-lysine at a concentration (0.7 mmol/dL) similar to that which blocked 5-HT4 receptors reduced serotonin-evoked ileal contractions by 35% confirming its action as a serotonin receptor antagonist. A related amino acid, L-leucine did not modify serotonin-elicited contractions showing the specificity of L-lysine actions."

If Lysine directly opposed Arginine, and lowers NO, isn't it non ideal for erections ? You need some NO to engorge the penis
 

haidut

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If Lysine directly opposed Arginine, and lowers NO, isn't it non ideal for erections ? You need some NO to engorge the penis

In theory yes, but I have not heard anybody taking high dose lysine complain of such side effects.
 

Frankdee20

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Perhaps because dietary nitrates from other non Amino Acid sources more than fulfil that requirement. Beets, root vegetables, pomegranate, chocolate, all provide some NO.
 

Arnold Grape

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If Lysine directly opposed Arginine, and lowers NO, isn't it non ideal for erections ? You need some NO to engorge the penis
I will submit that Lysine @ 1-1.25 grams/ daily screwed me up sexually. It took a few weeks for me to realize this sad fact, but there are no other variables to add to my situation -- I am thinking about staggering the dose and seeing what happens.
 

peep

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I dont think so. 1gram is really low dose.
Im taking up to 6g daily with no change.
And its only 1grams of an amino acid. And 100g of whey protein already got 10g Lysine.

If I suppose you eat around 100-150g of protein daily, that 1g extra Lysine wont make any difference.
Sure Whey might have some different amino acid profile than what you eat, but youll definitely have some Lysine in your protein sources too
 

Quality

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Would be interesting to see the effect of L-lysine on things such as prolactin, lh, etc.
From what Ive seen there arent any studies like that yet, in fact I cannot seem to find many studies about lysine at all.
 

Antonello

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Would be interesting to see the effect of L-lysine on things such as prolactin, lh, etc.
From what Ive seen there arent any studies like that yet, in fact I cannot seem to find many studies about lysine at all.
After months of experiments with lysine I can share it’s not for me, make me easy depressed and irritable
 

Quality

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Antonello, you gotta take it with arginine to balance the NO loss out... also what dose were you taking.
 

Antonello

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Antonello, you gotta take it with arginine to balance the NO loss out... also what dose were you taking.
I took it capsules of 500mg three times a day, it works at lower cortisol and maybe also serotonin but as I said depression comes in and as soon as I stopped lysine it disappeared.
 

Quality

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L-lysine is a barbiturate-like anticonvulsant and modulator of the benzodiazepine receptor.
L-lysine is a barbiturate-like anticonvulsant and modulator of the benzodiazepine receptor. - PubMed - NCBI

Lysine metabolism in mammalian brain: an update on the importance of recent discoveries
Lysine metabolism in mammalian brain: an update on the importance of recent discoveries

Especially the last study seems quite complex, but long story short is that lysine seems to have more pronounced impact on the brain that previously thought, especially regarding kynurenine.

That being said, for me personally lysine seems to have a warming effect (pro-thyroid), which is odd since it lowers NO which would be vasoconstrictive = less blood flow? Im puzzled.
 

johnwester130

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I found this very interesting

"
Among 14 women who were zinc deficient, L-lysine at doses 1000-1500 mg daily led to an increase in zinc levels from 9.7 to 14.6 umol/L even without these women consuming zinc pills.

With respect to iron, Rushton showed that iron pills (100 mg per day) in 7 women with chronic telogen effluvium did not change ferritin levels at all. However, when combined with L-lysine (again at 1000-1500 mg per day), ferritin levels increased from 27.4 to 58.6 ug/L. "
 

ddjd

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Studies have shown lysine can inhibit serotonin in the brain and gut. It's providing great anxiety relief for me, 2 x 500mg a day. I'm very sensitive to anything that lowers my stress systems currently so this response is most welcome.

Anyone tried this
Any idea which Serotonin receptor it's working on?
 

Mauritio

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I started taking lysine (3g in divided doses) and feel super tired and groggy after sleeping and have deeper circles under my eyes . also i am more foregetfull and feel more brainfog . Will this pass ? And is this some kind of serotonin withdrawal ?
 

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