Is There Any Reliable Food Source Of Iodine?

Pet Peeve

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Do you feel more capable for your flights?

It seems to warm me up a little when I haven't taken any for a while. Mostly I take one drop per day just to be safe as I don't eat seafood or use iodinized salt anymore.
 

Amazoniac

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RP: In the 1980s, I was looking into the iodine nutrition question because I saw some women with breast disease who recovered quickly when they took supplements of kelp or thyroid hormone and the safest thing, I think, is to correct the thyroid problem directly rather than counting on big doses of iodine because the large doses over many years, for example, there are about 70 or more publications looking at iodine intake around the world, over a period of decades, and they see that over half a mg or even especially over 1mg of iodine per day over a population is closely connected with increased risk of thyroiditis and thyroid cancer. One of the theories of why that happens is that iodine spontaneously reacts, or in the presence of white blood cells their enzymes can cause iodine to react with fatty acids that are unsaturated. And if you’ve heard about the iodine number to describe the degree of unsaturation of the fats - for example, the food oils that are highly unsaturated have a high iodine number. That means the number of molecules of iodine that will be spontaneously absorbed by a certain quantity of the oil, because the iodine attacks the double bonds in the fats and where they lack hydrogen saturation, the iodine fills in like an analogue to the saturated hydrogen content. So there is this tendency of unsaturated fats to react with iodine and when that happens the body can then interpret that as a signal to the thyroid gland, possibly imitating the thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH).

HD 1: Really?

HD2: So it doesn’t cause an increase of thyroid hormone?

RP: It can fill the site where TSH should be acting and it can interfere with that, so it can probably go either way, forcing too much activity, or more likely blocking the effect of TSH. The polyunsaturated fats (PUFAs) by themselves interfere with the enzyme which releases thyroid hormone from the glands, so too much of the unsaturated fats with or without iodine will have an anti-thyroid effect. But potentially the iodine reaction could cause overstimulation by TSH or in its place could imitate the action.

HD1: Dr Peat, you mentioned the iodine binding to the double bonds producing this product and in it’s own right that could stimulate an inflammatory thyroiditis and/or a cancer?

RP: Yeah. I think that’s why the high iodine intake around the world statistically associated with greater risk of thyroid cancer and if there really were a product that contained a more reactive form of iodine, that would just mean that it would attack more molecules, but I looked up the sources of that product and one of the products started about 10 years ago. A man in Texas filed a patent that is just completely goofy. If you look at the diagram, it shows things that just can’t happen and so it was filed 10 years ago and I think it still hasn’t been and probably never will be actually approved as a patent. But you can apply for a patent on any goofy idea and then publish the application and impress a lot of people!

HD1: But maybe not bring the product to the market.

HD2: So iodine supplementation is very risky and basically you should get your trace minerals from seafood sources, rather than from isolated iodine supplements and especially not in combination with any kind of vegetable polyunsaturated oils.

RP: Yeah I think that’s true.

HD 1: So, just to quickly wrap up this nascent iodine, I think the reason that it caught my attention was that the media spin on was that it because it didn’t have, any chemistry people hearing this will understand what I’m saying and can go and elaborate it more simply perhaps, but it doesn’t have a stable octet so its outer electron shell isn’t filled. And they were saying that because of this, it was much more suitable in some way to occupying these sites in the thyroid to produce thyroid hormone, but its very reactivity is counterproductive, because surely, if you keep it as unreactive as that in a bottle waiting for to be ingested, wouldn’t it surely react with one of the first things it came into contact with when you ingested it - just to fill its octet and become stable again?

RP: Oh yeah. The whole idea of a “newly born” nascent molecule, when I was in junior high, in high school, the chemistry people talked about nascent oxygen which for a few seconds after it’s formed in a certain way is highly reactive but that’s because the electrons are simply in an excited state, like it had been sitting in the sunlight too long. That’s an electronic excitation which quickly passes as it gives off a little bit of energy but in certain short term situations a few seconds, that kind of excited electron state can make a molecule useful for certain reactions but isn’t something you’d want to put your body through.

HD 1: So, not for in vivo use, but maybe in vitro experimentations, it might have some kind of a use?

HD2: So it’s basically a more dangerous form of iodine that can cause a free radical reaction?

RP: Yeah, that’s what they are talking about but I don’t think it even exists in the product?
 

Amazoniac

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HD: Many people have recently contacted us about Hashimoto’s thyroiditis, and as your specialty is hormones, reproduction and thyroid, you have spent many years researching this subject. In your mind, what constitutes it, and what are it’s characteristic labs findings, his symptoms, and treatment ?

RP: A hundred years ago, Hashimoto described it as an enlargement of the thyroid gland, caused by infiltration of white blood cells. And, some people actually stick a needle into the gland, and diagnose on the basis of how he described it that long ago. But the general principle is that it’s an enlarged gland that doesn’t produce enough hormones. So, you can make a guess as to it’s cause by looking at the blood: if you see that there seems to be a deficiency of the hormones in the blood, and maybe some evidence of inflammation, such as proteins and antibodies to the proteins from the thyroid gland, then they don’t bother doing the needle biopsy.

HD: So, these two particular tests are the only real things that medical doctors will want to see for confirmation ?

RP: Yeah. Simultaneously, a little before Hashimoto’s studies, people were seeing various reasons for the enlargement of the thyroid gland. Various poisonings, or iodine deficiency was recognized as the main cause of enlargement. And, being in Japan, I suppose was why Hashimoto saw the peculiar inflammation of the thyroid, rather than blaming it on an iodine deficiency (because many people in Japan eat so much iodine, that they get thyroiditis from blocking the functions of the gland). And that classically results in increasing the TSH to overcome the blockage by excess iodine. But exactly the same TSH excess is produced by a deficiency of iodine. So what you see, typically, is a rising TSH driving the gland to work harder, as the organism shows signs of decreasing thyroid function.
 
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Dante

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If i understand correctly, it's the balance between iodine and selenium that determines whether iodine intake will cause problems to the thyroid , isn't it?
 

Waynish

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When I took a low dose of lugol's it felt like my thyroid was temporarily enlarged. Ideas?
 

Amazoniac

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Members that apply your supplements on your feet, making your body believe that it's walking on heaven;
But also for those that don't do that, and so don't promote such an intense vascularization of that region that makes your lower body appear as a tree that's grounding its roots in search for nutrients;

https://www.gwern.net/docs/iodine/2011-redman.pdf
This study examined whether iodine supplementation in mildly iodine-deficient young adults would improve cognitive scores compared to a placebo group. It was hypothesised that the treatment group, who had received a daily dose of 150 μg/L of iodine over 32 weeks, would show an improvement in cognitive scores above that of the placebo group. While the iodine status in the intervention group did increase over time, the results did not support the hypothesis, as the consistent finding was of no association between cognitive scores and intervention group, indicating that there were no differences in cognitive scores between participants who took iodine and those who took a placebo.

Participants received a movie voucher and $10 at the first testing session, and a further $40 as compensation for completing the final session.
By the way, if you do that to your dog, you should seek help as soon as possible; no time to lose.
Some animal studies show that animals abused in youth become aggressors toward smaller animals, but are passively submissive toward animals of their own size or bigger (Ferris, 2000).
In the intervention group, approximately 1/4 showed a reduction or no improvement in urinary iodine levels, and approximately 1/3 of the participants in the iodine group showed no decrease in Tg, indicating that their iodine status had not improved.
This indicates either that the participants were not compliant over this period, or that potential goitrogens (chemical compounds that may compete for iodine uptake) may have resulted in decreased iodine levels (Meletis, 2011).

The present sample was recruited from the University of Otago, consisting mainly of undergraduate students.

"Down to a free movie and 50 bucks with no effort?"​
Previous research indicates that severe and moderate iodine deficiencies are implicated in impaired cognitive function, and mild iodine deficiency has at least some bearing on cognitive ability. The present study found no association between cognitive scores and improvement in iodine status in mildly iodine-deficient young adults, although future research is needed to examine this relation further.
 
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Amazoniac

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Do you supplement iodine?
Will try soon for the reasons discussed on the previous posts.

Since I happen to be skimming through Nutrition for Women, the recommendations are close to what I had in mind: the minimum possible to get most of the benefits, which is why I chose a supplement that I can increment only 50mcg of potassium iodide at a time:
[For mere curiosity, Ray's suggested requirements to deal with stress back then:]
Ninety grams a day of protein, preferably including liver, eggs, milk and seafoods. Fruits and starchy vegetables can make up the rest of the calories. Calcium and magnesium, 1200 mg. each; potassium chloride 2 to 4 grams; zinc 20 to 30 mg.; iodine about a fifth of a milligram; and manganese and other trace minerals from seafoods, such as kelp. Vitamin B1, 5 to 20 mg.; Vitamin B2, 20 to 30mg.; Niacin, 100 to 500 mg., with the requirement somtimes increasing just before menstruation; Vitamin B6, 10 to 50 mg.; Pantothenic acid, 100 to 500 mg.; Folic acid, from 1 to 5 mg.; Biotin, 1 mg.; Vitamin B12, 25 to 100 micrograms (100 micrograms is the same as one tenth milligram).; Inositol and choline, about 500 mg. each.; Vitamin A, 50,000 to 100,000 units, always taken with vitamin E (200 to 400 units of d-alpha tocopherol). Rutin and the bioflavonoids are sometimes used when capillaries are abnormally fragile (some types of purpura, petechial hemorrhages, and spontaneous bruising have this cause).; Vitamin D from fish liver oil. up to 2000 units a day in winter unless pregnant. The evidence for vitamin D toxicity is based on the synthetic form of the vitamin, but remember that vitamins A and D (and other oils) can be toxic in large amounts.; [..] vitamin K is available only by prescription, but is contained in leaves.
His recommendations probably have changed, but it's likely that the amount of iodine suggested remained the same.

I've been discussing the issue with some angels in a private conversation, but the main point was that salt fortification is largely based on the average salt consumption, which happens to be 10g/d where I live. Few people consuming a natural diet get that amount.
There's an effort to reduce the fortification to prevent excess iodine, which is not uncommon. However those that already don't consume much salt are most likely to be affected negatively.

If you go back a few posts, there's a link discussing that even organic milk has less iodine than conventional, adding up to the concern.

Como quisiera poder vivir sin EIRE!
 
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Ella

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Potatoes are a good source of iodine. Once pufas are depleted there is less need for iodine. I have found and it blows my mind when I think about all the promotion for iodine supplementation. Those individuals that derive their food from their gardens have adequate iodine levels even though they consume little seafood. These people are consuming lots of potatoes and very little pufas as they are eating only what their gardens provides them. Very little is sourced from packaged foods. Their selenium levels are also good but this has to do with the amount in soil already. Good gardening practices ensures adequate minerals for plants.

I am sensitive to potassium iodide and even certain sea vegetables but have no issues with oysters or shellfish. Bread is a big issue for me. Peat says we get too much iodine and I agree. If you have been eating a good diet, then there is less need for it and the problem becomes getting too much. I pointed out to the labs that were doing the iodine loading test that they would harm people like me. I was told that I was one of those rare individuals that was sensitive to iodine. However, it seems many of the labs have dropped the test, preferring the standard urinary iodine test rather than iodine loading.

If you have high pufas stored in the body, then the iodine will form deleterious molecules. I think Ray has spoken about this in one of the KMUD interviews.
 

Jennifer

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@Jennifer - you too. I don't know if you still pay attention to isolated nutrients, but would like to know your sources as well.

Yeah, I don't worry about isolated nutrients but if I was consciously trying to get iodine, I'd opt for whole food sources like cranberries, strawberries, prunes and California carrots specifically since Reams' tests show Cali carrots are higher in iodine. Cranberries in particular are quite high in the nutrient and I definitely prefer cranberry sauce to sea vegetables. I have a very refined palate. Only the jellied cranberry sauce that comes in a can will do. :p
 

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