What Happens On An All Meat Diet?

[Kratos]

Let's say a person eats nonstop bbq consisting of beef, lamb, pork and chicken including organs? and maybe once a week some milk, potatoes and some fruit?

 

[Elephanto]

Too much phosphorus, heme iron, carnitine (anti-thyroid), harmful amino acids. Lack of carbs leading to chronically elevated Cortisol levels. A gut microbiota that favors TMAO production (Nitric Oxide, heart disease). A greater assimilation of heavy metals/metalloestrogens like Lead and Cadmium.

A study has shown a decrease in Mercury (-25%), Lead (-47%) and Cadmium (-24%) when subjects were switched to a lactovegetarian diet from an omnivore one. This lasted one year after the subjects returned to an omnivore diet and it returned to baseline after 3 years.
Trace element status in healthy subjects switching from a mixed to a lactovegetarian diet for 12 mo. - PubMed - NCBI

Adding Kale to pork kidney for instance inhibits Cadmium absorption :
Cadmium bioavailability from vegetable and animal-based foods assessed with in vitro digestion/caco-2 cell model. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Runenight201]

What Happens On An All Meat Diet?

Diet apathy and an eventual aversion towards meat and desire for other types of food.

We're not lions a carnivore diet is unnatural.

 

[sebastian_r]

Doing great on all meat, literally all health problems vanish within days.

Clear mind, zero digestion problems, perfect skin, zero cravings, stable mood, no anxiety.

As soon as I add in back carbs / plants, problems start (fruits: digestion problems, brain fog, thyroid problems, less androgenic / starch: skin problems, less androgenic, depression, anger, anxiety).

Only problem I have with all meat, and why I still try other food groups is lack of energy. Starch gives me great energy.

Especially after eating red meat I get rather tired, it's better with chicken and pork, but for obvious reasons don't want to go down this route.

Many people doing fantastic on all meat and solving all kind of health problems that even keto couldn't solve (search carnivore diet on youtube), for me, I have the suspicion that I'm not suited for high fat or I would need more adaption time. Lot's of anecdotal positive results, research starting to look into it already.

 

[Braveheart]

Eat Meat. Drink Water.

 

[Runenight201]

Doing great on all meat, literally all health problems vanish within days.

Only problem I have with all meat, and why I still try other food groups is lack of energy.

.

Mate lack of energy is a health problem, so to say all your health problems are gone is incorrect. Perhaps many of your health markers have improved, but low energy is something I’m not surprised with at all on an all meat diet.

In my experience, zero carb can’t come any where near to producing the same levels of energy that sucrose and starch can.

Zero carb proponents will try to pull you further by saying give it time to be fat adapted and eat more fat... the former is cruel in my opinion (on the same level of justifying poor health due to “detoxing”) and the latter is just positively disgusting...

Some of these guys are eating butter/lard straight to meet caloric needs.

 

[sebastian_r]

Mate lack of energy is a health problem, so to say all your health problems are gone is incorrect. Perhaps many of your health markers have improved, but low energy is something I’m not surprised with at all on an all meat diet.

In my experience, zero carb can’t come any where near to producing the same levels of energy that sucrose and starch can.

Zero carb proponents will try to pull you further by saying give it time to be fat adapted and eat more fat... the former is cruel in my opinion (on the same level of justifying poor health due to “detoxing”) and the latter is just positively disgusting...

Some of these guys are eating butter/lard straight to meet caloric needs.

Don't agree that it's a health problem, it's the same for me as during fasting.

But not here to argue or defend zero carbs in terms of energy. It really sucks.

Carbs seem to be an insanely superior fuel for the body than fat or protein. At the same time carbs evokes insane health problems for many.

Carnivore is for me the ultimate elimination diet to figure out what is making problems or what not.

And for some basket cases with heavy auto immune problems or lots of allergies it could be a long-term solution.

 

[Vinero]

Even if eating an all-meat diet was healthy, I wouldn't follow it. I tried it 10 years ago when I was exploring the diet-scene and got into low-carbing.
Avoiding carbohydrates just made me miserable. You will get insane carb and sugar cravings all day, so you are at constant war with your cravings.
I rather indulge in sweet carbohydrates, thats what my body craves.

 

[TeaRex14]

It's not healthy. Eating all meat will shift your body's metabolism from oxidative metabolism to fatty acid metabolism. Thyroid, progesterone,testosterone, and CO2 will be replaced with elevated levels of cortisol, epinephrine, lactic acid, and estrogen. In the long run these metabolic changes will lay the ground work to increase your susceptibility to virtually all chronic illnesses.

 

[lvysaur]

Doing great on all meat

Only problem I have with all meat is lack of energy.

lol

Especially after eating red meat I get rather tired, it's better with chicken and pork, but for obvious reasons don't want to go down this route.

If I were delusional enough to try an all-meat diet, the least I would do is focus on chicken/pork/fish. Red meat is far less digestible to eat on a regular basis. Not to mention iron, and the unique iron-thrift polymorphisms that most Americans have.

 

[Wagner83]

Eat Meat. Drink Water.

Eating chicken may lead to a smaller penis | NutritionFacts.org
(He is vegan)

Spoiler: His list of references

• Colacino JA, Harris TR, Schecter A. Dietary Intake Is Associated with Phthalate Body Burden in a Nationally Representative Sample. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Jul;118(7):998-1003. Epub 2010 Apr 14.
• Swan SH, Main KM, Liu F, Stewart SL, Kruse RL, Calafat AM, Mao CS, Redmon JB, Ternand CL, Sullivan S, Teague JL; Study for Future Families Research Team. Decrease in Anogenital Distance among Male Infants with Prenatal Phthalate Exposure. Environ Health Perspect. 2005 Aug;113(8):1056-61.
• Harcourt AH, Gardiner J. Sexual selection and genital anatomy of male primates. Proc Biol Sci. 1994 Jan 22;255(1342):47-53.
• Stulhofer A. How (un)important is penis size for women with heterosexual experience? Arch Sex Behav. 2006 Feb;35(1):5-6.
• Swan SH, Liu F, Hines M, Kruse RL, Wang C, Redmon JB, Sparks A, Weiss B. Prenatal phthalate exposure and reduced masculine play in boys. Int J Androl. 2010 Apr;33(2):259-69.
• Swan SH. Environmental phthalate exposure in relation to reproductive outcomes and other health endpoints in humans. Environ Res. 2008 Oct;108(2):177-84.
• Meeker JD, Calafat AM, Hauser R. Urinary metabolites of di(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate are associated with decreased steroid hormone levels in adult men. J Androl. 2009 May-Jun;30(3):287-97.
• Cho SC, Bhang SY, Hong YC, Shin MS, Kim BN, Kim JW, Yoo HJ, Cho IH, Kim HW. Relationship between Environmental Phthalate Exposure and the Intelligence of School-Age Children. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Jul;118(7):1027-32.
• Meeker JD, Calafat AM, Hauser R. Di(2-ethylhexyl) Phthalate Metabolites May Alter Thyroid Hormone Levels in Men. Environ Health Perspect. 2007 Jul;115(7):1029-34.
• Stahlhut RW, van Wijngaarden E, Dye TD, Cook S, Swan SH. Concentrations of Urinary Phthalate Metabolites Are Associated with Increased Waist Circumference and Insulin Resistance in Adult U.S. Males. Environ Health Perspect. 2007 Jun;115(6):876-82.
• Wood DL, Bitman J. The effect of feeding Di-(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate (DEHP) on the lipid metabolism of laying hens. Lipids. 1980 Mar;15(3):151-6.
• MAFF. Phthalates in food. Food surveillance information sheet no. 82; 1996. London, UK: MAFF.
• Hauser R, Meeker JD, Singh NP, Silva MJ, Ryan L, Duty S, Calafat AM. DNA damage in human sperm is related to urinary levels of phthalate monoester and oxidative metabolites. Hum Reprod. 2007 Mar;22(3):688-95.
• Adibi JJ, Hauser R, Williams PL, Whyatt RM, Calafat AM, Nelson H, Herrick R, Swan SH. Maternal Urinary Metabolites of Di-(2-Ethylhexyl) Phthalate in Relation to the Timing of Labor in a US Multicenter Pregnancy Cohort Study. Am J Epidemiol. 2009 Apr 15;169(8):1015-24
• Durmaz E, Ozmert EN, Erkekoglu P, Giray B, Derman O, Hincal F, Yurdakök K. Plasma Phthalate Levels in Pubertal Gynecomastia. Pediatrics. 2010 Jan;125(1):e122-9.
• Mendiola J, Stahlhut RW, Jørgensen N, Liu F, Swan SH. Shorter anogenital distance predicts poorer semen quality in young men in Rochester, New York. Environ Health Perspect. 2011 Jul;119(7):958-63.
• Kim BN, Cho SC, Kim Y, Shin MS, Yoo HJ, Kim JW, Yang YH, Kim HW, Bhang SY, Hong YC. Phthalates exposure and attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder in school-age children. Biol Psychiatry. 2009 Nov 15;66(10):958-63.

 

[tankasnowgod]

If I were delusional enough to try an all-meat diet, the least I would do is focus on chicken/pork/fish. Red meat is far less digestible to eat on a regular basis. Not to mention iron, and the unique iron-thrift polymorphisms that most Americans have.

I don't think Americans have "Unique Iron-Thrift Polymorphisms." I think we have a Federal Agency that mandated that scrap metal in the form of iron be added into foods. I also think that being sedentary and lack of blood donation in the general public has led to very high body iron stores.

Heme iron is very safe, and probably the easiest for the body to regulate via absorption from meals. Much more so than the raw metal.

 

[lvysaur]

I don't think Americans have "Unique Iron-Thrift Polymorphisms."

Ethnic groups that evolve on a high calcium diet will necessarily evolve the need for higher baseline iron levels.

A lactase persistent ethnic group necessarily evolved on a high calcium diet.

 

[Dobbler]

The hype for carnivore diet is real right know. There are some seriously good "marketing" men hyping it up right now. I don't blame anyone who is at bad health and not doing good on Peat diet for trying it. The marketing speeches are so convincing i sometimes think about trying it myself. I think if you wanna do an experiment then try it for say 2 to 4 months.

 

[TeaRex14]

I don't think iron overload would be a problem. Milk, or dairy in general, can block iron absorption to a great extent, so can coffee (depending on how strict your carnivore diet is). Various antioxidants and polyphenols can block iron to a great extent. The main problem on this diet is the vast hormonal shifts.

 

[Bogdar]

It's only anecdotical but I'm on a carnivore diet. Eventhough there are some points in countersense with Ray Peat's advices, like high phosphorus-to-calcium, high methionine-to-glycine, low/near 0 carb, high heme-iron, there are also lots of other points that go with him.
It's the richest diet in term of B vitamins, B6, B3 is to the roof, there's only B1 which I think is used a lot for sugar metabolism. Also, lots of competitor with tryptophan, no fibers, no starch, good amount of protein, (very) high saturated-to-pufa ratio (I'm near 10 saturated for 1 pufa)...

It works really well for me, I'm 3 months in. I'm low carb which "should" raise my cortisol but I have never been more calm in my life. It really enhanced my tolerance to stress and I'm building muscle without doing anything (which should not be if high cortisol). Mental clarity and well-beingness is better than I have ever been when experimenting diets. I'm thinking about supplementing glycine tho.
I just wanted to say that there is theory and practise. There's a lot of reasons why this diet should not work in theory but it's different in practice. I'm not saying that it is the diet for everyone either of course, only saying that it is easy to show the supposed bad effects of this diet pointed by Elephanto when there are no practices/measures behind it.

 

[Elephanto]

When there are perceived benefits from such diet (at least initially), I think that this is mainly because it restricts an ongoing bacterial/pathogenic overgrowth (and so Endotoxins-related inflammation and stress) by restricting carbs. Plenty of studies show that they preferentially feed on glucose, sucrose and starch and as such each are also shown to promote biofilm formation. Honey doesn't have this effect. I think for instance that the effect of Endotoxins on stress levels is so important that the lack of carbs also promoting Cortisol doesn't offset this if the reduction in Endos is important and so produces a net reduction of average stress levels. Anyway this is what I experienced with IF which is also known to reduce Endotoxins, I had the idea based on Peat that IF would be stressing but for me, at a time when gut health wasn't great, it produced a significant decrease in chronic stress.

Another reason it can help is the implied avoidance of gut irritants. Say, when one's staple source of carbs is known to trigger symptoms of IBS in sufferers and has known gut-irritating properties (gluten, iron fortified cereals, potatoes, corn, cocoa, excess Fructose and Fructose malabsorption, Lactose malabsorption, etc) then the simple action of removing them can be very beneficial. Lastly, another reason would be the increased intake of Vitamin A in people who were previously deficient.

So with those considered and resolved in Peaty ways, I think you can have your cake and eat it too and that it would be much healthier than an all-meat/low carbs diet. Mainly by systematically using antiseptics with carbs sources (for instance 2 tsps of coconut oil with every meal), more focused antibacterial protocols if needed, avoiding the foods that don't agree with your gut and tackling other factors related to gut health (gastric acid secretion, temperature/metabolism, stress and serotonin, gut linings integrity).

 

[tankasnowgod]

It's only anecdotical but I'm on a carnivore diet. Eventhough there are some points in countersense with Ray Peat's advices, like high phosphorus-to-calcium, high methionine-to-glycine, low/near 0 carb, high heme-iron, there are also lots of other points that go with him.
It's the richest diet in term of B vitamins, B6, B3 is to the roof, there's only B1 which I think is used a lot for sugar metabolism. Also, lots of competitor with tryptophan, no fibers, no starch, good amount of protein, (very) high saturated-to-pufa ratio (I'm near 10 saturated for 1 pufa)...

It works really well for me, I'm 3 months in. I'm low carb which "should" raise my cortisol but I have never been more calm in my life. It really enhanced my tolerance to stress and I'm building muscle without doing anything (which should not be if high cortisol). Mental clarity and well-beingness is better than I have ever been when experimenting diets. I'm thinking about supplementing glycine tho.
I just wanted to say that there is theory and practise. There's a lot of reasons why this diet should not work in theory but it's different in practice. I'm not saying that it is the diet for everyone either of course, only saying that it is easy to show the supposed bad effects of this diet pointed by Elephanto when there are no practices/measures behind it.

I don't know what meats you are primarily eating, but every time I've looked up various cuts of beef on Nutrition Data, the Glycine to Methionine ratio has always been quite positive. I've mainly checked ground, chuck, New York, and Ribeye, and all have a lot more glycine than methionine. They have all had better ratios than dairy or eggs. Gelatious cuts like Oxtail or Shanks should be even better.

 

[tankasnowgod]

Ethnic groups that evolve on a high calcium diet will necessarily evolve the need for higher baseline iron levels.

What is this based on?

 

[lvysaur]

What is this based on?

On calcium inhibiting iron absorption. If one evolves on a high calcium diet, they will have higher iron.

This is empirically supported by western and particularly northwest Europeans having higher iron levels than eastern ones, with lactase persistence following the same pattern.