What Can Help Recovering Dopamine Etc System From AP Drug Use?

[TreasureVibe]

Hi all. The heart among more has dopamine receptors. When using antipsychotic (AP) drugs dopamine receptors throughout the body get agonized, sometimes partially antagonized. It also affects other receptors like serotonin and histamine sometimes.

Friend has recurrent pain below the left chest, a little bit below the heart area ever since having quit AP drugs cold turkey. He didn't use it for long, just a month daily. He first was on Risperidone (Risperdal) and then switched to Aripiprazole (Abilify). Aripiprazole is a partial dopamine agonist with antagonizing dopamine effects too. He quit the aripiprazole cold turkey. Sometimes he suffers from mild imagery of things flashing in a rapid speed in his mind with his eyes closed (preliminary antipsychotic induced psychosis type symptom) due to quitting the drug. He didn't suffer this before having used AP drugs so he's certain it's the drugs that caused it. He had it a lot during withdrawal of the Aripiprazole.

He really wishes to heal his dopamine receptors in his heart so that things are normal again.

I hope anyone here can help out.

Thanks.

 

[Beefcake]

Hi all. The heart among more has dopamine receptors. When using antipsychotic (AP) drugs dopamine receptors throughout the body get agonized, sometimes partially antagonized. It also affects other receptors like serotonin and histamine sometimes.

Friend has recurrent pain below the left chest, a little bit below the heart area ever since having quit AP drugs cold turkey. He didn't use it for long, just a month daily. He first was on Risperidone (Risperdal) and then switched to Aripiprazole (Abilify). Aripiprazole is a partial dopamine agonist with antagonizing dopamine effects too. He quit the aripiprazole cold turkey. Sometimes he suffers from mild imagery of things flashing in a rapid speed in his mind with his eyes closed (preliminary antipsychotic induced psychosis type symptom) due to quitting the drug. He didn't suffer this before having used AP drugs so he's certain it's the drugs that caused it. He had it a lot during withdrawal of the Aripiprazole.

He really wishes to heal his dopamine receptors in his heart so that things are normal again.

I hope anyone here can help out.

Thanks.

Why are you taking AP in the first place?

 

[TreasureVibe]

Why are you taking AP in the first place?

Wrongly prescribed by doctors..

 

[Beefcake]

Wrongly prescribed by doctors..

And they realized this? How did they come to the conclusion that you need AP in the first place what was the reason?

 

[TreasureVibe]

And they realized this? How did they come to the conclusion that you need AP in the first place what was the reason?

Emotional breakdown mimicking a psychosis.

 

[lampofred]

I don't know about specifics, but probably just everything that goes in the direction of high metabolism driven by good thyroid/low stress. Low PUFA, high animal protein (including gelatin if eating meat), high fruit intake, meeting daily mineral requirements, keeping CO2 high and living a stimulating life will probably help a lot for regeneration/healing.

What Dr. Peat says about SSRI recovery should probably apply to antipsychotic recovery as well:

[Decreasing SSRI dose] It takes time to adapt to decreasing those drugs, keeping sugar up and inflammation down, including bag breathing, should help. Starting with a little, a sixth or fourth of a tablet, of cynoplus in the evening would be the best way to try it.

[Weaning off anti-depressants] Keeping the metabolic rate and cholesterol up is important, so that repair and adaptation will be quick. Progesterone reduces pain and anxiety, and pregnenolone would be the most convenient supplement for men, but it's hard to find products without allergens. Combining progesterone and DHEA or testosterone can produce the stabilizing effect without suppressing the libido. Benadryl and cyproheptadine are probably both helpful. Withdrawal from morphine and SSRIs and migraine involve some similar processes. (Reference)

[continued] It depends on how much pregnenolone you can assimilate. People would use progesterone in amounts needed to stop the withdrawal symptoms, but pregnenolone doesn't have the powerful effects of progesterone, even in multi-gram quantities, so it's just a matter of seeing what it can do. As I understand the mechanism (migraine, withdrawal, etc.), estrogen-histamine-serotonin rise on a background of hypothyroid liver malfunction, cytomel (and/or sugar, selenium, B vitamins) allows the liver and other detoxifying systems to lower them, and the lower they are, the less progesterone or pregnenolone it takes to block the symptoms.

 

[Beefcake]

Emotional breakdown mimicking a psychosis.

How can a emotional breakdown mimick psychosis? Anyway. Vitamin D plays a big role keeping dopamine neurons sensitive. B-vitamins all help aswell. If you have a lack of iron which seems rare in men that could affect your dopamine aswell. I would not rule it out though. Need to do blood tests. Aspirin upregulates tyrosine hydroxylase resulting in more dopamine.

 

[TreasureVibe]

I don't know about specifics, but probably just everything that goes in the direction of high metabolism driven by good thyroid/low stress. Low PUFA, high animal protein (including gelatin if eating meat), high fruit intake, meeting daily mineral requirements, keeping CO2 high and living a stimulating life will probably help a lot for regeneration/healing.

What Dr. Peat says about SSRI recovery should probably apply to antipsychotic recovery as well:

[Decreasing SSRI dose] It takes time to adapt to decreasing those drugs, keeping sugar up and inflammation down, including bag breathing, should help. Starting with a little, a sixth or fourth of a tablet, of cynoplus in the evening would be the best way to try it.

[Weaning off anti-depressants] Keeping the metabolic rate and cholesterol up is important, so that repair and adaptation will be quick. Progesterone reduces pain and anxiety, and pregnenolone would be the most convenient supplement for men, but it's hard to find products without allergens. Combining progesterone and DHEA or testosterone can produce the stabilizing effect without suppressing the libido. Benadryl and cyproheptadine are probably both helpful. Withdrawal from morphine and SSRIs and migraine involve some similar processes. (Reference)

[continued] It depends on how much pregnenolone you can assimilate. People would use progesterone in amounts needed to stop the withdrawal symptoms, but pregnenolone doesn't have the powerful effects of progesterone, even in multi-gram quantities, so it's just a matter of seeing what it can do. As I understand the mechanism (migraine, withdrawal, etc.), estrogen-histamine-serotonin rise on a background of hypothyroid liver malfunction, cytomel (and/or sugar, selenium, B vitamins) allows the liver and other detoxifying systems to lower them, and the lower they are, the less progesterone or pregnenolone it takes to block the symptoms.

How can a emotional breakdown mimick psychosis? Anyway. Vitamin D plays a big role keeping dopamine neurons sensitive. B-vitamins all help aswell. If you have a lack of iron which seems rare in men that could affect your dopamine aswell. I would not rule it out though. Need to do blood tests. Aspirin upregulates tyrosine hydroxylase resulting in more dopamine.

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I also found the following information, what are your opinions on this? To Beefcake, I think in my case it was on the border between an emotional breakdown and psychosis. Standard procedure in such cases is administration of AP drug.

This quote contains drugs and supplements suggested to restore the dopamine system from AP drug use:

Username: summertimex
Post date: 23 august 2012

um its much worse than that.

post-antipsychotic depression is a full out "traumatic brain injury" response.

yes, certain dopamine receptors are increased, but gray matter is decreased as well as white matter.

the antipsychotic creates its own plasticity and wraps the brain around in a closer neuron smaller dendrite fashion.

so basically, a certain kind of demetia is left where the visual neurons are less communicatory as well as executive functions (mid brain) and other factors.

once the AP starts leaving the system there is an increase in locomotor activity as well as adrenal activity.

it is very very important to pay attention to the fatalistic-looking physical effects instead of the psychcology.

the tramuatic event can make it seem like there is something wrong with your life and you will become impatient with the recovery process and maybe not notice that
it doesnt have to do much with the activity it is generating.

the brain starts to reformulate, but there are several barriers.

what you need to do is take NGF supplements as well as sensitisation supplements. basically traumatic brain injury type things.

so this would resensitise the blocked pathways without over-increasing dopamine.

you might benefit from for example a 2 week cerebrolysin injection

otherwise, ashwaganda, lions mane, PQQ, magnesium-l-threonate

ciltep might be fine, but it also slightly increases dopamine.

you might also need an antidepressant or increase serotonin with several supplements: D3, n-acetyl-cysteine etc.

basically the AP synaptic plasticity has to change, adrenals have to be stabalized, resensitation of the visual cortex has to happen, as well as dendritic extention which leads to re-remembering experiences of the past.

the positive part is that thinking is increased even though consciousness becomes fuzzy. there is a lack of linear concentration that is slowly, but surely regained.

Source: stopping anti psychotic drugs and increased sex drive/dopamine receptors - Mental Health - LONGECITY

(Part of answer by Quora user)

II - Healing

Everything you mentioned can be caused by using or discontinuing psychotropic medications. Recovering from heavy-duty medications like Risperdal can take years, not just weeks or months. You have to first get all the meds out of your system, which can take years because weight gain and the replacement of your leaner tissues with fatty tissues (two side effects of antipsychotics) might have stored partial doses, metabolites, or hormone-altering chemicals from the drugs you were on, and becoming physically healthier and more normal again can release these influencing factors back into your active body in a way that causes more side effects and withdrawal.

Secondly, your brain and body need time to regrow and achieve a normal regulatory state again after you quit these meds. Antipsychotics "crunch", rewire, and dysfunctionally build your brain, and many are pseudo-irreversible antagonists or otherwise binding to neurons for a very long time. Tight and sustained binding like that can mean that you have to regrow your receptorsites because the ones that were blocked up by the medication never became unblocked.

Do note that the regeneration and replacement of receptors or parts of receptors is a natural and usual thing, so that would recycling is something which would be happening either way. It is unclear whether the use of these drugs prevents the normal processes which would lead to neurons becoming properly functional again, however, so the ultimate outcomes of this kind of binding may still be problematic. The ability to study this sort of thing is limited, and the interest is even more limited, economically speaking.

Epigenetic changes, changes to your organ systems, and physical changes or damages result from using psychiatric drugs, and they can remain dysfunctionally altered indefinitely, though people often progressively heal over time if they are drug-free. Progressive healing sometimes means side effects getting worse before they get better, or cyclical experiences of severity with regards to particular symptoms or symptom sets.

Source: https://www.quora.com/Can-antipsychotics-permanently-alter-your-brain

This is a list of 46 substances with scientific evidence backing them as neuritogenic with broccoli (not listed) as the newest addition:
Neuritogenic
Broccoli can stimulate brain regeneration news article (dated may 12th 2019):
Broccoli Can Stimulate Brain Regeneration, New Research Suggests

Another symptom I have been suffering is lack of any sensation during orgasm.

Also hoping @haidut could chime in.

 

[Beefcake]

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I also found the following information, what are your opinions on this? To Beefcake, I think in my case it was on the border between an emotional breakdown and psychosis. Standard procedure in such cases is administration of AP drug.

This quote contains drugs and supplements suggested to restore the dopamine system from AP drug use:

Source: stopping anti psychotic drugs and increased sex drive/dopamine receptors - Mental Health - LONGECITY


Source: https://www.quora.com/Can-antipsychotics-permanently-alter-your-brain

This is a list of 46 substances with scientific evidence backing them as neuritogenic with broccoli (not listed) as the newest addition:
Neuritogenic
Broccoli can stimulate brain regeneration news article (dated may 12th 2019):
Broccoli Can Stimulate Brain Regeneration, New Research Suggests

Another symptom I have been suffering is lack of any sensation during orgasm.

Also hoping @haidut could chime in.

I doubt that you have done permanent damage. Sorry to dissappoint but luckily thats also good news. The brain is extremly flexible. Im curious your mental breakdown. Was it due to something emotional that happened or was it just a random outlash because of buildt up stress? What was the reason? Most people don’t get mental breakdowns and I would be more curious to figure that part out why you had it. Was it due to stress or due to your diet or is there genetic factors involved. Are you prone to emotional and mental problems? The so called loss of dopamine receptors/neurons or what ever you wanna call it could be many other things. Just because you display a set of symptoms that under the microscope seems like dopamine dysregulation does not mean that this is not hormonal, stres, emotional, nutrient deficiency or something else. Most ailments display similair symptoms. Also the one symptom you mentioned does not to me sound like a low dopamine symptom. The lack of sensation during orgasm is also a common thing some people experience sure its probably due to some sort of neurotransmitter dysregulation but treating that is probably not gonna fix the root cause of it all. Have you done any lab tests? I would if I was you spend some money to get a big review of blood values, hormones, minerals, vitamins and more just for once to see whats happening inside. I have tons of supplements I can recommend to you but just taking or trying supplements blindly will not give you any results at all unless you know what you’re trying to achieve with them. Hope you understand my thoughts here.

 

[TreasureVibe]

I doubt that you have done permanent damage. Sorry to dissappoint but luckily thats also good news. The brain is extremly flexible. Im curious your mental breakdown. Was it due to something emotional that happened or was it just a random outlash because of buildt up stress? What was the reason? Most people don’t get mental breakdowns and I would be more curious to figure that part out why you had it. Was it due to stress or due to your diet or is there genetic factors involved. Are you prone to emotional and mental problems? The so called loss of dopamine receptors/neurons or what ever you wanna call it could be many other things. Just because you display a set of symptoms that under the microscope seems like dopamine dysregulation does not mean that this is not hormonal, stres, emotional, nutrient deficiency or something else. Most ailments display similair symptoms. Also the one symptom you mentioned does not to me sound like a low dopamine symptom. The lack of sensation during orgasm is also a common thing some people experience sure its probably due to some sort of neurotransmitter dysregulation but treating that is probably not gonna fix the root cause of it all. Have you done any lab tests? I would if I was you spend some money to get a big review of blood values, hormones, minerals, vitamins and more just for once to see whats happening inside. I have tons of supplements I can recommend to you but just taking or trying supplements blindly will not give you any results at all unless you know what you’re trying to achieve with them. Hope you understand my thoughts here.

What would you recommend for the dopamine antagonizing effect of Risperidone when currently on it?