TyroMix - Liquid T3/T4 Mix For Lab/R&D

Lilly

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Noted on the bottles. You can actually see how much liquid is left by lifting up the bottle against the window so that more light passes through it and then gently tapping/shaking the bottle. You should be able to clearly see what the liquid level is.

Oh come on,of course I have tried that, I am a homo sapiens.
 
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haidut

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Oh come on,of course I have tried that, I am a homo sapiens.

Just saying, not meant to refer to intelligence at all. Most people that asked me about this over email had not tried it because they thought the bottle is opaque enough to prevent seeing anything.
 

Wayne J

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Tested the old rat thyroid. Was giving it the equivalent of 3 grains of Thyroid-S (NDT) for 4-5 weeks
Found
RT3 - 15 is up from RT3- 12 from end of May
Free T3 - 3.6 - up from 3.1 from April 30 (range 2.1-4.2) trying to get it into upper 1/4 - rat was taking 1.0 grains NDT
Free T4 - 1.1 No change from April 30 from taking 1.0 grain NDT

Thyroglobulin Antibodies <1 - no change
Thyroid Perodoxidase antibodies 23 - down from 26
TSH - .020 down from 2.54 - goal is to have near zero.

Rate exhibits signs of inflamed lymph glands in throat and swelling of thyroid around throat - indicative of hypothyroid and Hashimotos. Also shows increased morning blood sugar.
RT3 value indicates reducing the t4 slightly while increasing the T3. Since FT4 is showing low, liver should not be converting to RT3.
So backing the rat off the NDT with 4:1 T4-T3, and going with Tyromix to add a little more T3 to mix. Giving it 16 drops - equivalent of 2 grains NDT spread over day. If it goes well will add 2 drops late in day.

Inputs welcome! would like to make the rat better!
 
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haidut

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Tested the old rat thyroid. Was giving it the equivalent of 3 grains of Thyroid-S (NDT) for 4-5 weeks
Found
RT3 - 15 is up from RT3- 12 from end of May
Free T3 - 3.6 - up from 3.1 from April 30 (range 2.1-4.2) trying to get it into upper 1/4 - rat was taking 1.0 grains NDT
Free T4 - 1.1 No change from April 30 from taking 1.0 grain NDT

Thyroglobulin Antibodies <1 - no change
Thyroid Perodoxidase antibodies 23 - down from 26
TSH - .020 down from 2.54 - goal is to have near zero.

Rate exhibits signs of inflamed lymph glands in throat and swelling of thyroid around throat - indicative of hypothyroid and Hashimotos. Also shows increased morning blood sugar.
RT3 value indicates reducing the t4 slightly while increasing the T3. Since FT4 is showing low, liver should not be converting to RT3.
So backing the rat off the NDT with 4:1 T4-T3, and going with Tyromix to add a little more T3 to mix. Giving it 16 drops - equivalent of 2 grains NDT spread over day. If it goes well will add 2 drops late in day.

Inputs welcome! would like to make the rat better!

If NDT makes rT3 go up, I would either lower the NDT dose to maybe 2 grains daily, add pure T3 to the NDT regimen, use a mix of T4/T3 with ratio more in favor of T3 or try pure T3 for a week or two and then reintroduce the NDT at 2 grains and keep it at that level.
 

Wayne J

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Thanks ! Just got the Tyromix with a higher T3 value - will back off the NDT to 2 grains and add maybe 1.5 and add tyromix. thanks!
 

Zpol

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It's Ray's suggestion for hypothyroid organisms. For very severe cases he even says pure T3 is better with T4/T3 mix taken only at night.

Oh I see, my mistake. Well, actually any thyroid should probably not be taken in a single large dose as even in the presence of T3 excess T4 will still convert into rT3. So, I would use several times a day on the rats. Personally, I tried it 3 times a day in a dose of 4 drops and it worked well. Actually a bit better than Tyronene, which made me a bit sleepy (which is not a bad thing btw).

@haidut I am trying to determine how to dose with Tyromix for a specific animal. I have gotten instruction from Dr. Peat as follows "Using a little T4, especially at bedtime, besides the T3, to keep the TSH from rising above 0.4 would probably reduce the intestinal inflammation." My animal is currently taking prescription 50mcg oral levothyroxine every morning along with 5 mcg oral liothyronine and another 5 mgc liothyronine at night. Regular blood tests have revealed very unsteady values of TSH (from .2 to 4.58) and recently the animal's freeT3 has skyrocketed while using the above dosages in pill form (high cortisol?). Presumably food taken around the time the oral pills are taken is affecting absorption, hence Tyromix topically should be a perfect solution.

I've read through most of this thread and I'm a bit confused on how to determine a dosage. Some say use considerably less than what they need in pill form but some are coming from NDT, so I don't know how to factor that in. So I figure maybe it'd be good to hit the 50mcg target and then let the T3 dose be as it is in Tyromix. So... 3 drops in the AM, 2 drops in the afternoon, and 3 drops in the PM, the animal would be getting close to the 50mcg T4 but more than double the amount of T3.

I don't know if you or anyone can help me with this but any guidance or even anecdotal stories would be appreciated.
 
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@haidut I am trying to determine how to dose with Tyromix for a specific animal. I have gotten instruction from Dr. Peat as follows "Using a little T4, especially at bedtime, besides the T3, to keep the TSH from rising above 0.4 would probably reduce the intestinal inflammation." My animal is currently taking prescription 50mcg oral levothyroxine every morning along with 5 mcg oral liothyronine and another 5 mgc liothyronine at night. Regular blood tests have revealed very unsteady values of TSH (from .2 to 4.58) and recently the animal's freeT3 has skyrocketed while using the above dosages in pill form (high cortisol?). Presumably food taken around the time the oral pills are taken is affecting absorption, hence Tyromix topically should be a perfect solution.

I've read through most of this thread and I'm a bit confused on how to determine a dosage. Some say use considerably less than what they need in pill form but some are coming from NDT, so I don't know how to factor that in. So I figure maybe it'd be good to hit the 50mcg target and then let the T3 dose be as it is in Tyromix. So... 3 drops in the AM, 2 drops in the afternoon, and 3 drops in the PM, the animal would be getting close to the 50mcg T4 but more than double the amount of T3.

I don't know if you or anyone can help me with this but any guidance or even anecdotal stories would be appreciated.
Hi is tyromix still using DMSO?
 
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haidut

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Agnichaga

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@haidut I heard on a Ray Peat interview that vitamin A is best applied on the legs keeping well away from the lips. Do you concur with that? If so, what is the rationale for the legs? What about your Tyromix and b mixture? Is that absorbed equally anywhere on the body? I've been using that mostly on the wrists and neck and the B mixture on the belly.
 
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haidut

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@haidut I heard on a Ray Peat interview that vitamin A is best applied on the legs keeping well away from the lips. Do you concur with that? If so, what is the rationale for the legs? What about your Tyromix and b mixture? Is that absorbed equally anywhere on the body? I've been using that mostly on the wrists and neck and the B mixture on the belly.

I think the caution about vitamin A has to do with its unsaturated nature. For other chemicals, like thyroid, B vitamins or even vitamin D he has been recommending larger body parts and especially torso for a more systemic effect.
 

Fractality

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Why does this (or thyroid in general) seem to cause or aggravate a sore/scratchy throat?
 

Mauritio

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Heyho guys

Today was my second attempt taking thyroid .The first time, several months ago, I just couldn’t go low enough with the dosage .Still always felt kind of overstimulated.

I recently got the flue/endotoxemia and I felt good when stimulating my metabolism... that’s how I thought of taking Tyromix again. I let a drop drip on my wrists, took a tissue and soaked about 75 percent of the drop up with the tissue.
The result was I felt a lot better ,still got the infamous scalp itch followed by some hair loss , but was much less then when I last took a full drop (even 1 drop every two days was too much).

So today I diluted this stuff with good results!
I took 3/20 of one drop! I know it’s a tiny amount.
I feel relaxed calm and clear, stimulated but not overstimulated.Also no scalp itch or hair loss.
I am always on the lower side concerning supplement dosage, but I didn’t think I needed to go THAT low.
I took 1/20 in the morning, midday and evening. Even after the first dose I felt that something changed thats why I kept going.
So this should be a reminder to everyone to not give up to soon on thyroid. Especially if you're sensitive to stuff 1 drop might just be too much.


If I recall correctly there was another user who took very low doses of several substances ,can someone tell wo that was cause I'd like to know if he had long term success via this route…
 
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docall18

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If NDT makes rT3 go up, I would either lower the NDT dose to maybe 2 grains daily, add pure T3 to the NDT regimen, use a mix of T4/T3 with ratio more in favor of T3 or try pure T3 for a week or two and then reintroduce the NDT at 2 grains and keep it at that level.

His free T4 of 11.1 is at the bottom of the range, would some T4 not help?

I find i have a TT4 & FT4 at the very bottom of/under the range using 2 - 4 grains of NDT.

I tried using tyromix and my TT4 at 2.2 (range 5.2 - 14), tested well under range. My TSH was 0.065 and FT3 3.27 (range 2-4).

Does this indicate that Thyromix & ndt might not have enough T4 for some of us, or is there some other reason for low T4?
 

Mauritio

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Little Update:
Diluted the solution even further now taking 3/40 of a drop a day since I got adrenaline symptoms the first night. Been on it for a couple of days and its slowly getting better .I cant think and concentrate as good as before and am not nearly as motivated to leave the house, but my libido is way up and I find that I like different girls that I did not like that way before. Little confusing^^

Sth. else that Danny Roddy mentioned in one of his last podcasts is that he saw a study on ethanol deactivating T3 and said he would ask @haidut about it- Did he?
 

TeaRex14

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Heyho guys

Today was my second attempt taking thyroid .The first time, several months ago, I just couldn’t go low enough with the dosage .Still always felt kind of overstimulated.

I recently got the flue/endotoxemia and I felt good when stimulating my metabolism... that’s how I thought of taking Tyromix again. I let a drop drip on my wrists, took a tissue and soaked about 75 percent of the drop up with the tissue.
The result was I felt a lot better ,still got the infamous scalp itch followed by some hair loss , but was much less then when I last took a full drop (even 1 drop every two days was too much).

So today I diluted this stuff with good results!
I took 3/20 of one drop! I know it’s a tiny amount.
I feel relaxed calm and clear, stimulated but not overstimulated.Also no scalp itch or hair loss.
I am always on the lower side concerning supplement dosage, but I didn’t think I needed to go THAT low.
I took 1/20 in the morning, midday and evening. Even after the first dose I felt that something changed thats why I kept going.
So this should be a reminder to everyone to not give up to soon on thyroid. Especially if you're sensitive to stuff 1 drop might just be too much.


If I recall correctly there was another user who took very low doses of several substances ,can someone tell wo that was cause I'd like to know if he had long term success via this route…

Little Update:
Diluted the solution even further now taking 3/40 of a drop a day since I got adrenaline symptoms the first night. Been on it for a couple of days and its slowly getting better .I cant think and concentrate as good as before and am not nearly as motivated to leave the house, but my libido is way up and I find that I like different girls that I did not like that way before. Little confusing^^

Sth. else that Danny Roddy mentioned in one of his last podcasts is that he saw a study on ethanol deactivating T3 and said he would ask @haidut about it- Did he?
Are you getting enough good nutrition, particularly b vitamins? It's odd that you have to dilute the dosage to such a low level to not experience over stimulation. Might be worth your troubles to also use some cypro to lower your stress hormones before taking thyroid. Those dosages you're currently taking could hardly be considered therapeutic for most people. Also, there could be an off chance that you're not really hypothyroid, and therefore supplementation isn't necessary.
 

Mauritio

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Are you getting enough good nutrition, particularly b vitamins? It's odd that you have to dilute the dosage to such a low level to not experience over stimulation. Might be worth your troubles to also use some cypro to lower your stress hormones before taking thyroid. Those dosages you're currently taking could hardly be considered therapeutic for most people. Also, there could be an off chance that you're not really hypothyroid, and therefore supplementation isn't necessary.
It might be true what you said and I am really considering it.
But it might also be that this shows how much I need it if my adrenaline goes through the roof like that as hypothyroid people can have up to 40 times higher adrenaline levels in their body...
Going by temps I am mildly hypothyroid. Going by symptoms probably a lot more . One example is that I developed a varicose vein at the age of 21 which Ray linked to hypothyroidism. Also I thought I had the whole adrenal fatigue thing going on for a long time because I was so low energy. Is possible to feel low energy for years without being hypothyroid?
Also I am taking B vitamins and Magnesium daily.
I actually took cypro to go to sleep some nights ago and it made it even worse . I just feel like everything that stimulates metabolism makes the adrenaline thing even worse... I do feel better from day to day ,so we will see.
 

TeaRex14

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It might be true what you said and I am really considering it.
But it might also be that this shows how much I need it if my adrenaline goes through the roof like that as hypothyroid people can have up to 40 times higher adrenaline levels in their body...
Going by temps I am mildly hypothyroid.
High adrenaline and low temps are pretty good signs of hypothyroidism. Pulse rate should ideally be low as well, but if your adrenaline is really high it might actually make your pulse elevate instead of drop.

Also I thought I had the whole adrenal fatigue thing going on for a long time because I was so low energy. Is possible to feel low energy for years without being hypothyroid?
Possibly, but usually the adrenal fatigue and the hypothyroid go hand and hand. Correcting the thyroid will typically strengthen the adrenals as well. Salt, vitamin c, and pantothenic acid (b5) are crucial for adrenal function. The most important thing is to monitor how you feel after taking things like thyroid. Does supplementing thyroid make you feel good? If so, then I'd say you're on the right track. If you're still low energy after taking thyroid, then it's possible low cortisol could be a problem as well. Getting your cholesterol levels higher and possibly supplementing pregnenolone would help. Haidut's pansterone product is probably the best pregnenolone product on the market right now.

Also I am taking B vitamins and Magnesium daily.
That's good, whats your carbohydrate intake look like? Most people will need a good amount of carb to tolerate thyroid. 1,000 calories from carbs, or 250 grams, would probably be a minimum for most.

I actually took cypro to go to sleep some nights ago and it made it even worse.
What was your dosages? It can definitely have anti-dopamine effects in larger doses. A 1 milligram dose would be a therapeutic, but hefty, dose. Most people have good responses to a 0.5 milligram dose.
 

Mauritio

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Possibly, but usually the adrenal fatigue and the hypothyroid go hand and hand. Correcting the thyroid will typically strengthen the adrenals as well. Salt, vitamin c, and pantothenic acid (b5) are crucial for adrenal function. The most important thing is to monitor how you feel after taking things like thyroid. Does supplementing thyroid make you feel good? If so, then I'd say you're on the right track. If you're still low energy after taking thyroid, then it's possible low cortisol could be a problem as well. Getting your cholesterol levels higher and possibly supplementing pregnenolone would help. Haidut's pansterone product is probably the best pregnenolone product on the market right now.

Yes! That is why I thought I thought I have hypo as well. I am taking a few mg Pregnenolone every second day. Also I am eating 1-2 eggs a day for cholesterol.
The first doses made me feel great. Then came the adrenaline phase but even there I noticed an increased sharpness for an hour after taking it . Falling asleep was the main problem the last days. What helped was to eat A LOT before going to bed.


I am probably hovering around 250 grams per day. Trying to get more especially orange juice with salt .

Concerning the cypro: In that particular case it was probably more like .25 mg ...
Normally it made me sleepy , but this day it probably lowered blood sugar even more and increased my adrenaline --> no sleepiness :(
 

TeaRex14

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Yes! That is why I thought I thought I have hypo as well. I am taking a few mg Pregnenolone every second day. Also I am eating 1-2 eggs a day for cholesterol.
The first doses made me feel great. Then came the adrenaline phase but even there I noticed an increased sharpness for an hour after taking it . Falling asleep was the main problem the last days. What helped was to eat A LOT before going to bed.


I am probably hovering around 250 grams per day. Trying to get more especially orange juice with salt .

Concerning the cypro: In that particular case it was probably more like .25 mg ...
Normally it made me sleepy , but this day it probably lowered blood sugar even more and increased my adrenaline --> no sleepiness :(
Perhaps you aren't eating enough throughout the day, and therefore you're having to backload a bunch of calories before going to bed. Eating smaller, more frequent, meals will typically help to keep your blood sugar balanced.
 

Mauritio

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Perhaps you aren't eating enough throughout the day, and therefore you're having to backload a bunch of calories before going to bed. Eating smaller, more frequent, meals will typically help to keep your blood sugar balanced.
Yes I am going to try that.
Maybe also it is a liver problem :meaning the liver cannot hold enough sugar to keep blood sugar stable ?!
 

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