Sicker Than Ever, Finding It Hard To Research Effectively

[Texon]

This might seem like an odd suggestion and probably will only be marginally helpful but have you ever had a deep tissue massage on your upper back and neck?

Muscle tension can be so tight that it causes headaches and light headnesess.

This makes a lot of sense.

 

[Zpol]

Have you tested your iron parameters? Serum iron? Ferritin? Hemoglobin? If so what was your Numbers and when was this last checked?

Hemoglobin 12.5 g/dL (11.5 - 16.0 g/dL)
IRON 114 ug/dL (37 - 170 ug/dL)
TOTAL IRON BINDING 318 ug/dL( 250 - 450 ug/dL)
TRANSFERRIN SAT 36 % (15 - 50 %)
FERRITIN SERUM 29 ng/mL (20 - 200 ng/mL)
Ceruloplasmin, S 30.2 mg/dL (20.0 - 51.0 mg/dL)
Zinc 89 mcg/DL (range 80 to 120 mcg/Dl)

My Iron/Ferritin is in good range. My doctor has diagnosed me with 'High oxidative stress due to to high ratio copper to zinc'. She has me on a zinc supp.

This might seem like an odd suggestion and probably will only be marginally helpful but have you ever had a deep tissue massage on your upper back and neck?

Muscle tension can be so tight that it causes headaches and light headnesess.

+1 said the massage therapist who applies aromatic botanicals to the spine and believes relief is All About The Fascia, human touch, and intent.

You two are spot on. My doctor prescribed massage therapy and it helped BIG TIME! I even got myself a massage table to keep at home so I could have therapists come to my house. I used coconut oil and Frankincense Trinity as massage oil. I had been doing it every other week rotating with chiropractic but it all got a bit pricey so I've had to cut back unfortunately.

 

[Douglas Ek]

Hemoglobin 12.5 g/dL (11.5 - 16.0 g/dL)
IRON 114 ug/dL (37 - 170 ug/dL)
TOTAL IRON BINDING 318 ug/dL( 250 - 450 ug/dL)
TRANSFERRIN SAT 36 % (15 - 50 %)
FERRITIN SERUM 29 ng/mL (20 - 200 ng/mL)
Ceruloplasmin, S 30.2 mg/dL (20.0 - 51.0 mg/dL)
Zinc 89 mcg/DL (range 80 to 120 mcg/Dl)

My Iron/Ferritin is in good range. My doctor has diagnosed me with 'High oxidative stress due to to high ratio copper to zinc'. She has me on a zinc supp.




You two are spot on. My doctor prescribed massage therapy and it helped BIG TIME! I even got myself a massage table to keep at home so I could have therapists come to my house. I used coconut oil and Frankincense Trinity as massage oil. I had been doing it every other week rotating with chiropractic but it all got a bit pricey so I've had to cut back unfortunately.

Anyway just my opinion but your ferritin is way to low. I bet you’re not gonna trust me because youve heard iron is dangerous so probably speaking to deaf ears but I had exact same symptoms as you and my ferritin hemoglobin was even slightly higher than yours. Taking iron was the best thing that I ever done. And I can with 99% certainty tell you that its going to help you. But the only way for you to find out is to actually try it out and take iron for a month or two. Good luck with your recovery.
The symptoms i had was head aches/ migraines around forhead and the eye. Very fatigued all the time. The verigo was real like walking outdoors sometimes it almost felt like i was gonna fall through the ground. Stiff joint specially neck area and upper back where its to the point of cracks and pop sounds. Also lowered libido and severly lowered motivation. Dont want to do anything really. I had tinniturs specially when everthing was silent and also Ive had like overexcited gag reflex so feels like you gag randomly. It took 1-2 months on iron and all my symptoms was gone.
Besides the zinc is just gonna make it worse trust me on this. When did all the symptoms start? Probably after you introduced the zinc supplement.
Another thing. Taking zinc will not raise your zinc either. I took zinc for long time got same symptoms as you and my zinc was low. Only when i stopped zinc my zinc went up.

 

[Zpol]

Anyway just my opinion but your ferritin is way to low. I bet you’re not gonna trust me because youve heard iron is dangerous so probably speaking to deaf ears but I had exact same symptoms as you and my ferritin hemoglobin was even slightly higher than yours. Taking iron was the best thing that I ever done. And I can with 99% certainty tell you that its going to help you. But the only way for you to find out is to actually try it out and take iron for a month or two. Good luck with your recovery.
The symptoms i had was head aches/ migraines around forhead and the eye. Very fatigued all the time. The verigo was real like walking outdoors sometimes it almost felt like i was gonna fall through the ground. Stiff joint specially neck area and upper back where its to the point of cracks and pop sounds. Also lowered libido and severly lowered motivation. Dont want to do anything really. I had tinniturs specially when everthing was silent and also Ive had like overexcited gag reflex so feels like you gag randomly. It took 1-2 months on iron and all my symptoms was gone.
Besides the zinc is just gonna make it worse trust me on this. When did all the symptoms start? Probably after you introduced the zinc supplement.
Another thing. Taking zinc will not raise your zinc either. I took zinc for long time got same symptoms as you and my zinc was low. Only when i stopped zinc my zinc went up.

Thanks... It's good to know your success with raising iron! You are right that I've read iron supp's are dangerous but like many so called 'dangerous' supplements, there do exist circumstances where it is exactly what is needed. Also, I believe you are right about zinc supplementation, what you say correlates with my research on the interplay between copper, ceruloplasmin, and zinc. I only started the zinc supp after these symptoms were in full swing though I don't think it's the main cause. I know my iron being low is a problem but I've kind of had it on the back burner as I didn't think it was a major player with my symptoms. After reading that you also had similar symptoms (especially that weird gagging feeling... it's awful) I need to move it up. My problem is that high iron foods like liver and green veg (even the broth) don't agree with me, neither do pretty much any supp's with the exceptions of what I am taking currently (mainly Idealabs stuff). Clearly I need to figure something out. Goal #1 is too at least get the RDA of iron via food. I will add in more cod, oysters, zero fat tuna, and figure out ways to consume liver an greens without getting heartburn. Also skip coffee when eating iron rich foods and have OJ instead. This should also eliminate a need for supplemental zinc. I will do anything to get rid of this gagging feeling.

 

[Douglas Ek]

Thanks... It's good to know your success with raising iron! You are right that I've read iron supp's are dangerous but like many so called 'dangerous' supplements, there do exist circumstances where it is exactly what is needed. Also, I believe you are right about zinc supplementation, what you say correlates with my research on the interplay between copper, ceruloplasmin, and zinc. I only started the zinc supp after these symptoms were in full swing though I don't think it's the main cause. I know my iron being low is a problem but I've kind of had it on the back burner as I didn't think it was a major player with my symptoms. After reading that you also had similar symptoms (especially that weird gagging feeling... it's awful) I need to move it up. My problem is that high iron foods like liver and green veg (even the broth) don't agree with me, neither do pretty much any supp's with the exceptions of what I am taking currently (mainly Idealabs stuff). Clearly I need to figure something out. Goal #1 is too at least get the RDA of iron via food. I will add in more cod, oysters, zero fat tuna, and figure out ways to consume liver an greens without getting heartburn. Also skip coffee when eating iron rich foods and have OJ instead. This should also eliminate a need for supplemental zinc. I will do anything to get rid of this gagging feeling.

I understand where you coming from but getting 8mg iron from food will do nothing to your ferritin. I've had to take 100-200mg iron to get my levels moving. You will need a prescription pill that's used for people with anemia and no low bs thing found at your pharmacy. You might have to live through the digestion problems for 1-2 months before you start getting better. Good luck though

 

[Texon]

I understand where you coming from but getting 8mg iron from food will do nothing to your ferritin. I've had to take 100-200mg iron to get my levels moving. You will need a prescription pill that's used for people with anemia and no low bs thing found at your pharmacy. You might have to live through the digestion problems for 1-2 months before you start getting better. Good luck though

@Douglas Ek do you know where your ferritin is now after supplementing? I believe I may have the same issue due to periodic blood donations.

 

[Douglas Ek]

@Douglas Ek do you know where your ferritin is now after supplementing? I believe I may have the same issue due to periodic blood donations.

Ive had it all over the charts. Started from 30 something and a hemoglobin at 13. Got it as high as 180 and hemoglobin at that point was 15 then I did have a 500ml donation coz i thought it was too high at 180 but i feelt great. So now im down at 90 in ferritin and 16 in hemoglobin i feel good like this. Over 80 is where i startfeeling alright. Lower I start getting headache, fatigue and cold hands. As it drops more all other symptoms starts to set in.

 

[Douglas Ek]

@Douglas Ek do you know where your ferritin is now after supplementing? I believe I may have the same issue due to periodic blood donations.

Did you have high iron or why do you periodicly donate blood?

 

[Soren]

Hemoglobin 12.5 g/dL (11.5 - 16.0 g/dL)
IRON 114 ug/dL (37 - 170 ug/dL)
TOTAL IRON BINDING 318 ug/dL( 250 - 450 ug/dL)
TRANSFERRIN SAT 36 % (15 - 50 %)
FERRITIN SERUM 29 ng/mL (20 - 200 ng/mL)
Ceruloplasmin, S 30.2 mg/dL (20.0 - 51.0 mg/dL)
Zinc 89 mcg/DL (range 80 to 120 mcg/Dl)

My Iron/Ferritin is in good range. My doctor has diagnosed me with 'High oxidative stress due to to high ratio copper to zinc'. She has me on a zinc supp.




You two are spot on. My doctor prescribed massage therapy and it helped BIG TIME! I even got myself a massage table to keep at home so I could have therapists come to my house. I used coconut oil and Frankincense Trinity as massage oil. I had been doing it every other week rotating with chiropractic but it all got a bit pricey so I've had to cut back unfortunately.

Glad to hear massage therapy helped you. Don't know what your budget is but if you want an at home device that is expensive but overtime will save you money compared to massage sessions I would recommend the theragun. It is pricey but it has been a lifesaver for me and my mother who has very stiff muscles due to parkinson's. It can feel like the equivalent of an hour long massage in a couple of minutes.

If you do get it be sure to use it not with simple pressing but at an angled way that stretches the muscle. I know this may seem random but it is an important detail and something I just discovered myself. This guy on Instagram has some good examples.

Joshua Truex, Sr. on Instagram: “SUNDAY @theragun DAY!!! I only have a minute when doing these so it may seem a little quick but I'm just giving you guys the ideas to feel…”

Theragun website: Theragun - The Original Percussive Therapy

 

[Soren]

Also I've seen that some have suggested low iron as a potential issue but have you considered low copper?

Perhaps you have addressed this earlier and I missed it but copper is essential for atp. Thne majority of supplements for with copper it is in an oxidised form that is toxic for the body. You can get it in food obviously but can be difficult to correct a deficiency.

Mitosynergy is a form of copper that is bioavaibale. Just bought some myself and am giving it a try.

 

[Zpol]

I understand where you coming from but getting 8mg iron from food will do nothing to your ferritin. I've had to take 100-200mg iron to get my levels moving. You will need a prescription pill that's used for people with anemia and no low bs thing found at your pharmacy. You might have to live through the digestion problems for 1-2 months before you start getting better. Good luck though

It's confusing. I'm just not sure about a supp. Estrogens cause dilution of blood and therefore could be causing the the low levels per dL ( I have severe estrogen dominance). I'll have to do some in depth research, like what would be causing this deficiency? I suppose I could get a new blood test and ask my doc, I'm due for a retest anyway. I have been eating a bit more so I'm curious if it even raised it a tiny bit.

Glad to hear massage therapy helped you. Don't know what your budget is but if you want an at home device that is expensive but overtime will save you money compared to massage sessions I would recommend the theragun. It is pricey but it has been a lifesaver for me and my mother who has very stiff muscles due to parkinson's. It can feel like the equivalent of an hour long massage in a couple of minutes.

If you do get it be sure to use it not with simple pressing but at an angled way that stretches the muscle. I know this may seem random but it is an important detail and something I just discovered myself. This guy on Instagram has some good examples.

Joshua Truex, Sr. on Instagram: “SUNDAY @theragun DAY!!! I only have a minute when doing these so it may seem a little quick but I'm just giving you guys the ideas to feel…”

Theragun website: Theragun - The Original Percussive Therapy

Sounds awesome! I'll have to save up for it but that'd be great have one to use anytime.

Also I've seen that some have suggested low iron as a potential issue but have you considered low copper?

Perhaps you have addressed this earlier and I missed it but copper is essential for atp. Thne majority of supplements for with copper it is in an oxidised form that is toxic for the body. You can get it in food obviously but can be difficult to correct a deficiency.

Mitosynergy is a form of copper that is bioavaibale. Just bought some myself and am giving it a try.

Thanks, I'll look into it. I have lowish ceruloplasmin.

 

[Douglas Ek]

It's confusing. I'm just not sure about a supp. Estrogens cause dilution of blood and therefore could be causing the the low levels per dL ( I have severe estrogen dominance). I'll have to do some in depth research, like what would be causing this deficiency? I suppose I could get a new blood test and ask my doc, I'm due for a retest anyway. I have been eating a bit more so I'm curious if it even raised it a tiny bit.



Sounds awesome! I'll have to save up for it but that'd be great have one to use anytime.



Thanks, I'll look into it. I have lowish ceruloplasmin.

Ive taken aromasin/exemestane which is an AI and that doesnt effect my blood levels of iron. I had lower ceruloplasmin than you did so I did also supplement with copper and the co factors retinol and also B-vitamins for hemoglobin production. Didnt take any zinc during this time since even taking a multivitamin with 7-15mg zinc in it made me feel worse within 1 day. My ceruloplasmin was border on being out of range. I think it also played a role in my symptoms but iron was defo a big factor aswell. Theres a lot of studies showing that even quite low doses of zinc draws iron from the blood probably into erythrocyte (red blood cell) production which can be good but I believe that ferritin and free iron also has processes in the body more than creating hemoglobin and transporting oxygen. If you google iron dopamine theres a lot of research how iron is involved with the function of brain dopamine signaling that would explain the low motivation, loss of libido, restless leg and the overexcited gag reflex with low iron deficiency. Also googling iron and thyroid theres a lot of research explaining how iron is needed for the liver to convert T4 to T3 through the enzyme deiodinaize which doesnt work properly without enough iron. Which also would explain why people with low iron get low thyroid symptoms like fatigue and cold hands and feet.

 

[Douglas Ek]

Also I've seen that some have suggested low iron as a potential issue but have you considered low copper?

Perhaps you have addressed this earlier and I missed it but copper is essential for atp. Thne majority of supplements for with copper it is in an oxidised form that is toxic for the body. You can get it in food obviously but can be difficult to correct a deficiency.

Mitosynergy is a form of copper that is bioavaibale. Just bought some myself and am giving it a try.

Doesnt have to be mitosynergy Ive did the chelated copper supplements aswell they work just aswell for 1/3 of the price. You can also eat lots of liver or cashew nuts or dark chocolate for copper. But chasews are high in pufa so might wanna avoid those.

Also since zpol seems to have quite low zinc I also believe this could be due to low copper. This was the case with me and many others that supplementing zinc actually just lowers your own zinc stores more and makes symptoms worse while supplementing copper for me actually brought my serum zinc levels up without even taking zinc. I know iron, zinc and copper has some sort of mineral balance/relationship where they synergise. And out of those three zinc seems to be the bad guy that tends to more easily lower the others.
Check out the video for more info:

 

[Zpol]

Ive taken aromasin/exemestane which is an AI and that doesnt effect my blood levels of iron. I had lower ceruloplasmin than you did so I did also supplement with copper and the co factors retinol and also B-vitamins for hemoglobin production. Didnt take any zinc during this time since even taking a multivitamin with 7-15mg zinc in it made me feel worse within 1 day. My ceruloplasmin was border on being out of range. I think it also played a role in my symptoms but iron was defo a big factor aswell. Theres a lot of studies showing that even quite low doses of zinc draws iron from the blood probably into erythrocyte (red blood cell) production which can be good but I believe that ferritin and free iron also has processes in the body more than creating hemoglobin and transporting oxygen. If you google iron dopamine theres a lot of research how iron is involved with the function of brain dopamine signaling that would explain the low motivation, loss of libido, restless leg and the overexcited gag reflex with low iron deficiency. Also googling iron and thyroid theres a lot of research explaining how iron is needed for the liver to convert T4 to T3 through the enzyme deiodinaize which doesnt work properly without enough iron. Which also would explain why people with low iron get low thyroid symptoms like fatigue and cold hands and feet.

Yes, the more I look into this it appears that I do have a lot going on that is related to low iron. My brain is working overtime. I'll get retested and stop the zinc for now.

 

[sladerunner69]

Too . Many. Supplements. ( liver is prob way overloaded. )

I agree. These symptoms started up after she began using numerous supplements. Just because the theory behind using one supplement is good, does not mean that using 10 different good supplements at once will be good. I used to take a similar approach until I realized I had completely suppressed estrogen and cortisol into uncomfortably low levels, while at the same time raising my adrenaline so that I felt at once tired and anxious.

A smart meter is the electric meter on your house. It sends electrical pulses through your house anywhere from 50,000 to 114,000 times per day. I mention it because most utilities let you opt out for a small fee and they will replace it with an analogue.

The criticism of the dangers of wi fi and EMF is done through fear of thinking that they could never live without their cell phone and truthfully these people are ignorant. It does not take much effort to find out how dangerous wifi and cell phones truly are.
The new 5G internet is terrible beyond belief. It is the same frequency the DARPA uses for crowd control with microwaves;

You tube Barry Trower, Dr Klinghardt to start and you will be amazed. The new research shows at least 114 neural proteins are effected by cell phone "radiation" and never return to normal.

This is for the health of everybody.

You don't understand the physics of electromagnetism. Microwaves are dose dependent. They produce an amount of heat relative to their dosage. The prototype microwave weapon uses a very large amount of power, enough to back half of a Humvee with car batteries. This allows the microwave emitter to operate at an effective range of no more than a couple hundred meters, but only for about 5 minutes until it needs more juice. The weapon also loses its effectiveness quickly beyond its range, and even at its maximum level can produce a burning sensation that is very painful but able to be resisted by some targets. 5g may be in the microwave range therefore produce more heat, which alone can cause protein denaturation you referenced, but at lower power levels the heat emitted by phones and computers is not very threatening, unless used chronically. Another aspect of microwave

Contrary to your assertion that no studies have been carried out on the matter of cell phone radiation, a few heavily funded studies actually have. There is such a part of business known as "Risk Management" and even "Operations and Research" whom would be interested in the long term health effects of their products, particularly if it means a multi-billion dollar recall (such as the ones that have crippled or killed many car manufacturers through the years). Most of the studies have found no relationship between cell phone use and cancer incidence, although a handful have found a statistically insignificant uptrend in cancers. I am not saying cell phones pose no risk, but that the empirical evidence is certainly pointing towards cell phones being a low-risk carcinogen. This is probably because radio waves do not travel through the body more than a few inches, and the lower frequency waves such as microwaves penetrate even shallower than radio waves. This is why a microwave oven will take so long to warm up the center of a chicken breast, it has to heat up the outer centimeter and allow a few minutes at 1000 watts for the heat to progress towards the center. 1000 watts of concentrated power is far more than any cell phone, or what you may get from a cell tower at a distance.

 

[achillea]

Smart Meters: How They Work, Why They Are Harmful.

 

[achillea]

5G to Radiate from Manhole Covers

Now 5G can hit you harder--and be better hidden.
Manhole covers will radiate wireless signals upwards from ground level. And go 650 feet, at least. Unlike small cell towers, manhole-based solutions apparently do not require permission from city planners. They are already being installed in Europe.
Historically, wireless providers have preferred to mount cellular hardware well above ground level, as rooftop- or streetlight-level radio signals can travel further with less physical interference. But localities across the world have balked at letting “small cells” — the backpack-sized building blocks of 5G networks — flood public spaces, particularly at their standard 500-foot separation.
The other way to avoid small cells visible to the public is to use cellular hardware inside a barrel-shaped enclosure with a ruggedized top. Even at ground level, the enclosures can distribute the wireless signal across an over 650-foot radius, subject of course to the vagaries of vehicular interference.
In addition, the company Vodafone's “Zero Site” solution hides 5G hardware inside street lamps, enabling a neighborhood to improve both cellular reception and night time visibility without the need for conspicuous small cell hardware.

 

[robertf]

+1 on too many supplements. Get a hair mineral test from Arl, Tei or Doctor's data.
There are different ways to interpret the results, but I'd be shocked if the results did not shine a blinding light on your mineral status and help you target which minerals are out of balance. And you will see what toxic metals are lurking.

 

[Zpol]

I agree. These symptoms started up after she began using numerous supplements. Just because the theory behind using one supplement is good, does not mean that using 10 different good supplements at once will be good. I used to take a similar approach until I realized I had completely suppressed estrogen and cortisol into uncomfortably low levels, while at the same time raising my adrenaline so that I felt at once tired and anxious.

+1 on too many supplements. Get a hair mineral test from Arl, Tei or Doctor's data.
There are different ways to interpret the results, but I'd be shocked if the results did not shine a blinding light on your mineral status and help you target which minerals are out of balance. And you will see what toxic metals are lurking.

It's frustrating. I started taking supplements because I was sick and diet alone wasn't helping. I tried many different diet plans and for last 5 years my diet plan has been within RP's suggestions (although I cannot have dairy). I did Doctor's Data and NutraEval plus my physician's blood tests... they all found deficiencies and recommend more supplements. I try to address the deficiencies with diet but because of the gastritis and the subsequent damage to my epithelial lining I cannot absorb nutrients from foods that well, it's like a catch 22.

5G to Radiate from Manhole Covers

Now 5G can hit you harder--and be better hidden.

What next?! this is insane. Thanks for the warning. I knew 5G was coming but not in the manhole covers.

 

[postman]

hypervitaminosis A?