Indicators Of T3 Vs T3/T4 Supplementation Combinations

Luckytype

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My TSH has doubled and my thyroid levels are bottom of their respective ranges.

I want to pick up some thyroid for as needed use. I have scoured the forum and while I know it is individual, I cant seem to find a pattern as to why someone should start with a t3 versus a t3/t4 combo? I see recommendations, but no reasons as to why and I don't understand it as well as others.

Is there a reason I should NOT use one of them to start? I understand how t3 is immediate and t4 takes time to build up, but I don't know what the correct choice to alleviate my body so it can start to progress and recover.

My labs are worse than my last, I just got the PRL test done finally so I know that as it falls will hopefully allow me to feel better. I am planning on having Cypro and Lisuride on hand.

My issue is coming off of all these stressors I am anticipating feeling like crap.

How does one decide to use one versus the other.

I am 33, male, ex chronic exerciser etc.. My food and nutrition is otherwise good to support it

TSH - 2.72 (up from 1.29 in april of 2017)
T4 free .90 (range of .8 to 1.8)
T3 .91 (range of 75-165)
Vit D 27 (down oddly from 39 in april 2017 - though ive been supplementing and tanning here and there - working on this)
B12 1700
Test 550 (down from 630 in april 2017)
Free test 19.25 (range of 5-21)
Fr Test %(bound?) 3.5 (1.5 - 4.2)
CRP .47 (range .20 - 10.0
Prolactin 18.2 (range 0 - 17ng/ml)

Can I get some insight please?
 

Tarmander

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People do better with some types of thyroid and worse with others. There is a bit of an experimental curve where you are figuring out what works right for you. I read an article not too long ago with a guy who had tried all the different thyroids. They all had their pluses and minuses, but he put together a list of how difficult the different thyroid forms are:

1. T4 (levothyroxine)
2. T4 / T3 in combination
3. Natural desiccated thyroid (NDT)
4. NDT / T3
5. T3 on its own (pure T3)

T3 by itself, due to its short half life, would be the most difficult to use. Basically the more T3 that enters the picture, the more difficult it is. I take tyromix, which is 6mcg/3mcg T4/t3 combo. I definitely notice a difference if I do 3 drops at a time with each meal verse 1 drop every hour spaced throughout the day. I think it is good to keep T3 at 4mcg or under per hour to avoid some of the sides associated with too much t3...but YMMV.

Edit: Oh I should also say that I get much better results with more T3, so the difficulty is worth it.
 
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Luckytype

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Generally speaking is T3 more difficult because of the need to administer so frequently?


Is one easier to taper off of than the other?

My thought is that something that has t3 will hopefully bring relief faster. I would ideally like to only be short term if possible while i recover.
 
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Luckytype

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Is it fair to assume that a low dose like 1-2mcg per hour will still have positive effects despite potentially being insensible ?

Im thinking slow ramp up here while the stress hormones come down
 

superhuman

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People do better with some types of thyroid and worse with others. There is a bit of an experimental curve where you are figuring out what works right for you. I read an article not too long ago with a guy who had tried all the different thyroids. They all had their pluses and minuses, but he put together a list of how difficult the different thyroid forms are:

1. T4 (levothyroxine)
2. T4 / T3 in combination
3. Natural desiccated thyroid (NDT)
4. NDT / T3
5. T3 on its own (pure T3)

T3 by itself, due to its short half life, would be the most difficult to use. Basically the more T3 that enters the picture, the more difficult it is. I take tyromix, which is 6mcg/3mcg T4/t3 combo. I definitely notice a difference if I do 3 drops at a time with each meal verse 1 drop every hour spaced throughout the day. I think it is good to keep T3 at 4mcg or under per hour to avoid some of the sides associated with too much t3...but YMMV.

Edit: Oh I should also say that I get much better results with more T3, so the difficulty is worth it.

Have you tried Tyronene only 1 drop with a meal ? so thats 8 mcg. Or do you feel that is to much and get bad reaction from it ? thats why you prefer just taking 1 drop TyroMix instead ?
 

Tarmander

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Have you tried Tyronene only 1 drop with a meal ? so thats 8 mcg. Or do you feel that is to much and get bad reaction from it ? thats why you prefer just taking 1 drop TyroMix instead ?
Yes I have tried tyronene and 8mcgs is too much. I get flabby, estrogen like symptoms. The 3mcg in tyromix seems just right.

Generally speaking is T3 more difficult because of the need to administer so frequently?


Is one easier to taper off of than the other?

My thought is that something that has t3 will hopefully bring relief faster. I would ideally like to only be short term if possible while i recover.

If you reply to my post I will get an alert that you have responded, otherwise I don’t know.

T3 is tougher for the administration frequency like you said, but it’s also just getting the right dose down. For example, the other night I went to take my last tyromix dose for the day. I put a drop on my hand and lick it off. Somehow I accidentally put the end of the dropper bottle in the drop that I had just placed on my hand. As I licked it off, I knew I had maybe overdosed myself by half a drop on accident. That night I had a small headache, my heart beat was faster then normal, and I could feel it through my whole body. I probably got around 5mcg instead of the normal 3mcg. If you are dosing T3 often, you can’t do things like that too much. It’ll just make your body wonk out and say what the **** are you doing to me! If it had been T4...psh no biggie. T4 stays in your system a week, T3 a day or less.

Is it fair to assume that a low dose like 1-2mcg per hour will still have positive effects despite potentially being insensible ?

Im thinking slow ramp up here while the stress hormones come down
1-2 mcgs an hour is a great place to start. Don’t be surprised if you have some adrenaline reactions in the first 2-3 weeks...meaning cold feet and shivering.

One word of warning, T3 is very powerful. I spent I think a year and a half on this forum before taking thyroid...just learning about food and stress and other supplements. I was really glad when I did start on thyroid, but also glad I did not start right away.
 

superhuman

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@Tarmander Cool. Have you tried splitting the T3 dose? like mixing 1 drop with some water or other fluid and take 1/3 of that so that will be like 2.5 mcg? Im not sure this is possible with the SFA/ethanol version in terms of that the dose will dissolve etc?
 

Tarmander

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@Tarmander Cool. Have you tried splitting the T3 dose? like mixing 1 drop with some water or other fluid and take 1/3 of that so that will be like 2.5 mcg? Im not sure this is possible with the SFA/ethanol version in terms of that the dose will dissolve etc?
Yeah I had some DMSO that I used to dilute it, but it was still estrogenic for me. Somehow having the T4 with it really makes it go down easy and prevent these sides. The question is how much T4 I can get away with. NDT has a ratio of 4ish:1. I am now doing 2:1 t4:t3 and it seems to work great. I wonder if a 1:1 would work or be too strong.

Ray talked about taking just T3 at one point. He said that when he was on just T3, even the smallest amount of stress would instantly make him hypothyroid. After adding in T4 that went away.
 

superhuman

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Yeah I had some DMSO that I used to dilute it, but it was still estrogenic for me. Somehow having the T4 with it really makes it go down easy and prevent these sides. The question is how much T4 I can get away with. NDT has a ratio of 4ish:1. I am now doing 2:1 t4:t3 and it seems to work great. I wonder if a 1:1 would work or be too strong.

Ray talked about taking just T3 at one point. He said that when he was on just T3, even the smallest amount of stress would instantly make him hypothyroid. After adding in T4 that went away.

Get you. Ray seems to like t3 during the day and T4 before bed or T3/t4 combo before bed.
I dont get any estrogenic effects from t3 only, i dont get any effects at all actually.
But when you say estrogenic effects, what does that really mean? what are the symptoms or effects?
 
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Luckytype

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Yes I have tried tyronene and 8mcgs is too much. I get flabby, estrogen like symptoms. The 3mcg in tyromix seems just right.



If you reply to my post I will get an alert that you have responded, otherwise I don’t know.

T3 is tougher for the administration frequency like you said, but it’s also just getting the right dose down. For example, the other night I went to take my last tyromix dose for the day. I put a drop on my hand and lick it off. Somehow I accidentally put the end of the dropper bottle in the drop that I had just placed on my hand. As I licked it off, I knew I had maybe overdosed myself by half a drop on accident. That night I had a small headache, my heart beat was faster then normal, and I could feel it through my whole body. I probably got around 5mcg instead of the normal 3mcg. If you are dosing T3 often, you can’t do things like that too much. It’ll just make your body wonk out and say what the **** are you doing to me! If it had been T4...psh no biggie. T4 stays in your system a week, T3 a day or less.


1-2 mcgs an hour is a great place to start. Don’t be surprised if you have some adrenaline reactions in the first 2-3 weeks...meaning cold feet and shivering.

One word of warning, T3 is very powerful. I spent I think a year and a half on this forum before taking thyroid...just learning about food and stress and other supplements. I was really glad when I did start on thyroid, but also glad I did not start right away.

@Tarmander this is so helpful. Thanks for taking the time to type this all out.

Ive been reading and maxing my food for about a year. My hesitation has always been being "stuck" on thyroid. I dont know why Ive been so fearful of it.

Can you tell me why you decided to supplement and how long you have been on it?

I am going to be working off of prolactin here starting friday. I am hoping my body will be resensitize to what little thyroid im making(bottom of range). Ill be using cypro and probably lisuride or metergoline sparingly.

My idea is maybe after a a couple weeks intoducing tyromix(3 and 6mcg respectively of t3 and t4)but diluted with 8-9ish drops of vodka and trying to time it with my food and see what i feel like and then slowly adding in more and more each couple days.

Does that sound reasonable? I have literally been humping the forum but just cant wrap my head around it. The last thing i want to do is shock my body and make the hair shedding worse.
 

Tarmander

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@Tarmander this is so helpful. Thanks for taking the time to type this all out.

Ive been reading and maxing my food for about a year. My hesitation has always been being "stuck" on thyroid. I dont know why Ive been so fearful of it.

Can you tell me why you decided to supplement and how long you have been on it?

I am going to be working off of prolactin here starting friday. I am hoping my body will be resensitize to what little thyroid im making(bottom of range). Ill be using cypro and probably lisuride or metergoline sparingly.

My idea is maybe after a a couple weeks intoducing tyromix(3 and 6mcg respectively of t3 and t4)but diluted with 8-9ish drops of vodka and trying to time it with my food and see what i feel like and then slowly adding in more and more each couple days.

Does that sound reasonable? I have literally been humping the forum but just cant wrap my head around it. The last thing i want to do is shock my body and make the hair shedding worse.
No problem man. I worked on stress for quite awhile. I ran on stress before Peat, and after reading him for awhile and changing my life around, I had lowered stress a lot. I was actually falling apart a bit, as stress was what kept me going. I was gaining weight, tired all the time, sluggish. I could lay around for hours. At that point, I did not really have anywhere to go with lowering stress anymore, so I started looking into thyroid after I got some blood tests back with a TSH around 4-5. After I started taking it, I knew it was the right decision. There is a lot of justified fear of being dependent on a drug, but really, after the life I have felt come back into me, I am happy to take thyroid. Been on it for about ten months. Started with NDT around 1 grain, overtime raised to 2 grains, and now doing tyromix.

This forum is definitely confusing at times. What drew you to Peat in the first place? What about his articles made some light bulb go on? To be honest, your plan sounds kind of scattered. I don't know your level of knowledge or experience...Lisuride and Metergoline are mind ******* chemicals if you don't know what you are doing. I have tried Lisuride, it is an amazing drug. But it is also a dopamine agonist...raising dopamine can be tricky. Too much and you can turn rageful and anxious...possibly leading to paranoia. It also makes everything you do very rewarding, almost no matter what it is...which if you are going through tough times in life might not be desirable. Cypro has more wiggle room.

I think thyroid is a good direction to go, and the risks are simple to mitigate. Timing it with your food is always a good idea. The only thing I would say is to set up some kind of plan or log so you can look back at what you have done.
 
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Luckytype

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No problem man. I worked on stress for quite awhile. I ran on stress before Peat, and after reading him for awhile and changing my life around, I had lowered stress a lot. I was actually falling apart a bit, as stress was what kept me going. I was gaining weight, tired all the time, sluggish. I could lay around for hours. At that point, I did not really have anywhere to go with lowering stress anymore, so I started looking into thyroid after I got some blood tests back with a TSH around 4-5. After I started taking it, I knew it was the right decision. There is a lot of justified fear of being dependent on a drug, but really, after the life I have felt come back into me, I am happy to take thyroid. Been on it for about ten months. Started with NDT around 1 grain, overtime raised to 2 grains, and now doing tyromix.

This forum is definitely confusing at times. What drew you to Peat in the first place? What about his articles made some light bulb go on? To be honest, your plan sounds kind of scattered. I don't know your level of knowledge or experience...Lisuride and Metergoline are mind ******* chemicals if you don't know what you are doing. I have tried Lisuride, it is an amazing drug. But it is also a dopamine agonist...raising dopamine can be tricky. Too much and you can turn rageful and anxious...possibly leading to paranoia. It also makes everything you do very rewarding, almost no matter what it is...which if you are going through tough times in life might not be desirable. Cypro has more wiggle room.

I think thyroid is a good direction to go, and the risks are simple to mitigate. Timing it with your food is always a good idea. The only thing I would say is to set up some kind of plan or log so you can look back at what you have done.
@Tarmander do you see yourself ever tapering off of it?

I happened to just randomly find Peat a couple of ways. First one was actually while I was searching for everything related to prolactin. There is always mention of prolactin on steroid forums, so while ive always been drug free i really enjoyed learning about them to be educated for my friends who may eventually try them. The second was reading hair like a fox from Roddy but in his book I was basically already there nutritionally so I guess I didnt know what the next step was. From the get go I knew mine had to be elevated and frankly my situation sounds very similar to yours. Eating the same amounts, slowly losing leanness, getting more and more tired etc..

I definitely lived a really neglectful life and to be honest im somewhat thankful my stress hormones sustained me eventhough I hate myself for doing it now. The body is a truly impressive system.

As far as the dopamine agonists I was only considering them IF cypro had such an effect that I need to counter some of the lowering effects on dopamine I read about once in a while. Im talking a tiny dose maybe once every 10 days or more..if its even needed at all.

Also roger that on the log. Im so used to tracking temp, pulse, haircount, food in crono that itll be nice and easy to do.

Why NDT to start? Was it availability? I know its all individual I really would like to start out with the "righter" choice.

Again, thanks man
 

Tarmander

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@Tarmander do you see yourself ever tapering off of it?

I happened to just randomly find Peat a couple of ways. First one was actually while I was searching for everything related to prolactin. There is always mention of prolactin on steroid forums, so while ive always been drug free i really enjoyed learning about them to be educated for my friends who may eventually try them. The second was reading hair like a fox from Roddy but in his book I was basically already there nutritionally so I guess I didnt know what the next step was. From the get go I knew mine had to be elevated and frankly my situation sounds very similar to yours. Eating the same amounts, slowly losing leanness, getting more and more tired etc..

I definitely lived a really neglectful life and to be honest im somewhat thankful my stress hormones sustained me eventhough I hate myself for doing it now. The body is a truly impressive system.

As far as the dopamine agonists I was only considering them IF cypro had such an effect that I need to counter some of the lowering effects on dopamine I read about once in a while. Im talking a tiny dose maybe once every 10 days or more..if its even needed at all.

Also roger that on the log. Im so used to tracking temp, pulse, haircount, food in crono that itll be nice and easy to do.

Why NDT to start? Was it availability? I know its all individual I really would like to start out with the "righter" choice.

Again, thanks man
Cool, it sounds like you are good at keeping track of things.

I did NDT because I got a prescription through my doc and thought it was a good place to start. I know that prehistoric man used to eat thyroid glandular of the animals he killed, so I felt comfortable doing similar. I wanted to get a feel for it before I started doing the more difficult types of thyroid. I have never felt really bad from taking thyroid, or messed up too bad. I started slow and ramped up slowly, and was okay with each step I took.

I could probably taper off if I wanted to, but why would I want to? I don't think of it like a drug, like lisuride or an SSRI or something. I think of it more as a food that you have to learn how to use properly, and dose correctly depending on time of year, food intake, and other factors. Almost like learning to drive...once you learn to drive, would you go back to not driving? You could, but why would you when it makes your life better in many ways? I think the same of thyroid. Does that make sense?
 
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Luckytype

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Cool, it sounds like you are good at keeping track of things.

I did NDT because I got a prescription through my doc and thought it was a good place to start. I know that prehistoric man used to eat thyroid glandular of the animals he killed, so I felt comfortable doing similar. I wanted to get a feel for it before I started doing the more difficult types of thyroid. I have never felt really bad from taking thyroid, or messed up too bad. I started slow and ramped up slowly, and was okay with each step I took.

I could probably taper off if I wanted to, but why would I want to? I don't think of it like a drug, like lisuride or an SSRI or something. I think of it more as a food that you have to learn how to use properly, and dose correctly depending on time of year, food intake, and other factors. Almost like learning to drive...once you learn to drive, would you go back to not driving? You could, but why would you when it makes your life better in many ways? I think the same of thyroid. Does that make sense?

@Tarmander yea that makes perfect sense. My hesitation is "what if" i lose access to it or something. Obviously feeling better is feeling better but I hate the idea the body is less than it was. Ah, such is life

From your experience do you recommend something like NDT over tyromix to start? Haiduts stuff is likely the only real access I will have to anything helpful.

Is NDT a better place to start? More forgiving or functionally are they roughly the same provided ramp up?

Totally overthinking this im sure..
 

cyclops

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I could probably taper off if I wanted to, but why would I want to? I don't think of it like a drug, like lisuride or an SSRI or something. I think of it more as a food that you have to learn how to use properly, and dose correctly depending on time of year, food intake, and other factors. Almost like learning to drive...once you learn to drive, would you go back to not driving? You could, but why would you when it makes your life better in many ways? I think the same of thyroid. Does that make sense?

This is an interesting way of putting it. What does your normal tyromix dosing schedule usually look like this time of year?
 

DaveFoster

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Yeah I had some DMSO that I used to dilute it, but it was still estrogenic for me. Somehow having the T4 with it really makes it go down easy and prevent these sides. The question is how much T4 I can get away with. NDT has a ratio of 4ish:1. I am now doing 2:1 t4:t3 and it seems to work great. I wonder if a 1:1 would work or be too strong.

Ray talked about taking just T3 at one point. He said that when he was on just T3, even the smallest amount of stress would instantly make him hypothyroid. After adding in T4 that went away.
With regards to a 1:1 T3 to T4 ratio you've mentioned for those with impaired livers, do you know of any lab values that would indicate too much T3 in their thyroid ratio and would suggest an increase in T4?

Dr. Peat: "No, that can happen when stress increases reverse T3."

Okay, so I suppose it's [the need for more T4 is] only reliant upon negative symptoms such as arrhythmias (such as when you took only T3).
 

Tarmander

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@Tarmander yea that makes perfect sense. My hesitation is "what if" i lose access to it or something. Obviously feeling better is feeling better but I hate the idea the body is less than it was. Ah, such is life

From your experience do you recommend something like NDT over tyromix to start? Haiduts stuff is likely the only real access I will have to anything helpful.

Is NDT a better place to start? More forgiving or functionally are they roughly the same provided ramp up?

Totally overthinking this im sure..
If you lose access to it, you go back to how you were...so in my case if I lost access to it I would go back to gaining weight, metabolic disease, sluggishness...basically rapidly aging. But I would not go back to less then what I was...I would not go from a 3 to an 8, and then go back to a 1. I would probably go back to a 4, or maybe better if the thyroid had helped my body build structure.

Haidut does both tyromix and tyromax...so you can do an NDT through him if you cannot get it elsewhere. I have that and take it in the morning before going with tyromix for the rest of the day. It is up to you. If you have the time, 1 grain of NDT is really not going to bug you out too much, or at least it shouldn't unless something is really wrong. If you can afford to be conservative and go slow, I think that is the best route.

If your pattern follows mine, you will feel great for 2 weeks to a month, and then start feeling crappy again. You up the dose to 1.5 grains, and the same will happen. At some point, you will get to a place in your dosage where you feel relatively good and stable, assuming your gut is on point and other stress factors are accounted for. You stick with that for a couple years, and then you may need to start taking less and less, maybe none at all during the summer and just a bit to get your through the winter. Just like our ancestors. Or maybe you have to take the high dose forever? Who knows...

This is an interesting way of putting it. What does your normal tyromix dosing schedule usually look like this time of year?

I do 1/2 a grain of NDT in the morning, and then I do 6 drops of Tyromix through the day; 1 drop per hour with skipping a couple hours. The amount of T4 I get would be equivalent to 1.5-2 grains of regular NDT like naturthroid. Broda barnes said he treated most people with 2 grains, with some needing maybe 3 or 4, but 2 grains for most was appropriate. The amount of T3 I get is a bit higher then 1.5-2 grains of NDT because NDT has a ratio of like 4 to 1 T4:t3. In the summer, I live somewhere very hot, I will probably be able to cut back my dosage to 3 drops of tyromix per day. I am just guessing though.

With regards to a 1:1 T3 to T4 ratio you've mentioned for those with impaired livers, do you know of any lab values that would indicate too much T3 in their thyroid ratio and would suggest an increase in T4?

Dr. Peat: "No, that can happen when stress increases reverse T3."

Okay, so I suppose it's [the need for more T4 is] only reliant upon negative symptoms such as arrhythmias (such as when you took only T3).

That is good to know. I recently asked him about my Free T3 level, which is around 7, and whether it was too high like my doc claimed. He said this:

The numbers that are now normal in the blood testing labs aren’t at all like the normals before 1950, when the crazy antithyroid campaigns began. The article on my website, 50 years of fraud…, briefly reviews some of the events that have led to the current fetish for T4 only. When Synthroid began marketing their T4 product, they had tested it only in healthy young men, where they found that it “worked like thyroid, USP.” Women are several times as likely as men to have thyroid problems, because of estrogen’s antithyroid effects; stressed men have higher estrogen. By the 1990s, when doctors were treating the most hypothyroid women with only enough T4 to “normalize” their TSH, it was found that aging women who had been taking T4 for several years had more osteoporosis than women who had never taken thyroid. They, by their special reasoning, concluded that it was the suppression of TSH that caused osteoporosis. Then, the thought spread to T3 as a cause, without the need for reasoning even. In in vitro experiments, T3 accelerates bone formation; in a rabbit experiment, a lethal chronic overdose of thyroid led to starvation and the atrophy of all tissues except bones, which were denser than normal.

He avoided giving me a range for Free T3 that was more accurate when I asked him directly...
 

DaveFoster

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If you lose access to it, you go back to how you were...so in my case if I lost access to it I would go back to gaining weight, metabolic disease, sluggishness...basically rapidly aging. But I would not go back to less then what I was...I would not go from a 3 to an 8, and then go back to a 1. I would probably go back to a 4, or maybe better if the thyroid had helped my body build structure.

Haidut does both tyromix and tyromax...so you can do an NDT through him if you cannot get it elsewhere. I have that and take it in the morning before going with tyromix for the rest of the day. It is up to you. If you have the time, 1 grain of NDT is really not going to bug you out too much, or at least it shouldn't unless something is really wrong. If you can afford to be conservative and go slow, I think that is the best route.

If your pattern follows mine, you will feel great for 2 weeks to a month, and then start feeling crappy again. You up the dose to 1.5 grains, and the same will happen. At some point, you will get to a place in your dosage where you feel relatively good and stable, assuming your gut is on point and other stress factors are accounted for. You stick with that for a couple years, and then you may need to start taking less and less, maybe none at all during the summer and just a bit to get your through the winter. Just like our ancestors. Or maybe you have to take the high dose forever? Who knows...



I do 1/2 a grain of NDT in the morning, and then I do 6 drops of Tyromix through the day; 1 drop per hour with skipping a couple hours. The amount of T4 I get would be equivalent to 1.5-2 grains of regular NDT like naturthroid. Broda barnes said he treated most people with 2 grains, with some needing maybe 3 or 4, but 2 grains for most was appropriate. The amount of T3 I get is a bit higher then 1.5-2 grains of NDT because NDT has a ratio of like 4 to 1 T4:t3. In the summer, I live somewhere very hot, I will probably be able to cut back my dosage to 3 drops of tyromix per day. I am just guessing though.



That is good to know. I recently asked him about my Free T3 level, which is around 7, and whether it was too high like my doc claimed. He said this:

The numbers that are now normal in the blood testing labs aren’t at all like the normals before 1950, when the crazy antithyroid campaigns began. The article on my website, 50 years of fraud…, briefly reviews some of the events that have led to the current fetish for T4 only. When Synthroid began marketing their T4 product, they had tested it only in healthy young men, where they found that it “worked like thyroid, USP.” Women are several times as likely as men to have thyroid problems, because of estrogen’s antithyroid effects; stressed men have higher estrogen. By the 1990s, when doctors were treating the most hypothyroid women with only enough T4 to “normalize” their TSH, it was found that aging women who had been taking T4 for several years had more osteoporosis than women who had never taken thyroid. They, by their special reasoning, concluded that it was the suppression of TSH that caused osteoporosis. Then, the thought spread to T3 as a cause, without the need for reasoning even. In in vitro experiments, T3 accelerates bone formation; in a rabbit experiment, a lethal chronic overdose of thyroid led to starvation and the atrophy of all tissues except bones, which were denser than normal.

He avoided giving me a range for Free T3 that was more accurate when I asked him directly...
That's actually quite funny; "fraud" is right.
 

cyclops

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I do 1/2 a grain of NDT in the morning, and then I do 6 drops of Tyromix through the day; 1 drop per hour with skipping a couple hours.

Why do you like to include that bit of NDT in the morning as opposed to just soley using tyromix?
 

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