If PUFA's Are One Of The Main Causes Of Aging, Why Don't Fruitarians Look Younger Than Other People

[Xisca]

Thanks for thinking about this! Physiology is not easy to remember with all those balance mvt up and down...

If we breathe too much we lose CO2 in both forms and flood the blood and tissues with Nitrogen and Oxygen instead. Hence we lose this protection.

However many of our cells will soon produce more CO2 so the issue can be fixed quite fast if we are aware of it!

Buteyko breathing is also half of the solutions, though proposed as a solution for everybody. I WANT to loose CO2!

There is not only respiratory alkalosis but also respiratory acidosis, from too much co2. I do not have candida, but this is an example of people having too much co2, because candida produces co2. Possibly any fungi, thus the problem mentionned by Buteyko when you increase CP and get fungi problems. CO2 is not a protection if you have too much, we just want balance, and we can be in either of the 2 cases away from the balance...

As I have too much co2, my body does not want to produce more, thus my bad burning of sugars and production of lactic acid (solution to produce less co2, it seems!). It can be postural in my case, as noted by my body therapist, but I cannot exclude a metabolic origine either...

For me, breathing more is not breathing too much.... And I am not the only one to be in this case. I would not do regular buteyko breathing without knowing in what case I am. I still use the slow breathing to get more co2, but not as a regular practise, only as an exceptional practise when I want more co2 for a relaxing effect.

Then, about acidosis and alkalosis, they are not only respiratory, they can be metabolic... So there are at least 4 cases and not only the one of the link to normal breathing website.

 

[Jennifer]

Hi @Richiebogie,

Thank you for sharing that link! Our choral director had given us a brief history of the song, but it was nice to read exactly what Kurt's thought process was while composing it. To think something so beautiful can come from a moment of frustration and hopelessness.

I agree! That reminds me of this short story about a woman's conversation with God when she sees a cold and starving child on the streets. She asks God why he doesn't do anything about it and he replies "I most certainly did do something about it. I made you!"

WOW! 100 years old?! Good for your grandmother! My grandmother didn't have refined foods until she was an adult, I believe. Things like pastries were a luxury they couldn't afford since times were tough – both men and women worked the factories here (this area was known for its mills) and her parents died very young. Her family moved in with their grandmother after the father died and she said they ate meals of nothing but mashed potatoes.

Darn! I was going to ask if you had tried having pineapple juice again and if you had any recent flareups. I'm sorry to hear you have but yes, it's good you at least know how to prevent them. Are you doing okay with your salads and the extra fat you added to your diet?

Sadly, I had to end my love affair with higher fat. I was getting headaches, nightmares and poor circulation. My feet were cramping up while practicing dance and I found my limbs were falling asleep while sitting – I sit in weird positions.

I can understand why you're attached to your phone. My mum doesn't want to give up her phone for the same reasons. Her phone is old school – a flip phone.

Yeah, it's great that Kasey can even eat at restaurants now without much issue. I'm hoping for the same experience when I move.

My first choice is Hawaii, but my parents are looking at Savannah, Georgia and I'm starting to question how safe I would feel being all alone in a new place so far from family. I haven't had the most positive experiences over the years, but maybe Hawaii is perfectly safe and I'm just being a big baby. lol

Yeah, I would only want a tiny house if I lived where most of my time could be spent outdoors and I had a large deck that functioned as another living space. If I could find a loft space with a rooftop garden in an old building overlooking the city of Savannah, I might be happy there, too. Not sure how realistic that is, though. I'd probably have an easier time finding a unicorn.

Ah, that's what R2E2 (lol it does sound like a Star Wars character) stands for. Someone mentioned them once in a comments section and I wondered what the name stood for. Thank you for the video! I'll be keeping an eye out for them.

If you do get White Christmas, I hope you like it! My brother stopped by yesterday and said he bought Holiday Inn, It's a Wonderful Life, Miracle on 34th Street (the original with Natalie Wood) and one of our favorites – Planes, Trains and Automobiles.

A bright blue sky on Christmas sounds like a dream! The sky here is currently grey and blizzard-like. It's been snowing since yesterday. But yeah, I try to avoid the worst of the sun, too. However, I've noticed that I don't burn easily anymore so maybe the diet helps?

We're taking a break from cooking and ordering the food instead. :)

Thank you, Richie! I hope you have a merry week, as well! :)

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @Jennifer,

Savannah (32 deg N) will seem hot after Vermont (44 deg N). It is slightly nearer to the equator than our Sydney (33.8 deg S), but Sydney does not get the storms that the US gets.

Kailua-Kona and Hilo (19.7 deg N) are almost as far south as Chiangmai (18.7 deg N). Do your parents think that could be too hot?

Or is the cost of housing too much higher in Hawaii? (You mentioned your mum considering a Tiny House there).

Or is the cost of the move too high? I guess all your possessions would need to be shipped in containers to Hawaii!

I can see that visiting family and friends left behind in Vermont becomes more expensive from Hawaii than from Savannah!

Either move is a big change and takes risk. Did you say you grew up in Canada? How long ago was your last move?

That's a cool story about God and the impoverished people. Thanks for that!

That is interesting about the lack of burning from the sunshine. I think Ray Peat attributes that to PUFA, but some people say the beta carotene from carrots, sweet potatoes, pumpkin and leafy greens acts like a sunscreen (or stops inflammation).

Cantaloupe also has beta carotene, so maybe your melons do too!

I stopped eating chocolate and a lower left eyelid twitch I had stopped! I should try drinking tea to see if it comes back due to caffeine or if it was due to something peculiar to chocolate like theobromine!

Meanwhile I am eating a few olives, a little olive oil and wholegrain mustard as sources of fat, so it is not much!

Was it the coconut fat that was causing your circulation issues? How much fat were you eating at the peak? Was it above 10% of calories?

I found a nice recipe for potato salad. I boiled/steamed some potato and sweet potato for 25 minutes and then let them cool off. I only took the skin off the sweet potato. I chopped the potatoes into small pieces. Then I folded in some rocket (arugula) and a dressing of balsamic vinegar, olive oil, salt, mixed dried herbs, honey and curry powder.

It was quite tasty, and much healthier than fries or chips, I'm sure!

How did your Chinese meal go? Did you have lots of bok choy? Do they have vegan options for all the popular dishes?

I got a shopping mall gift voucher for Christmas, so I might use that to get some Christmassy DVDs and blu-rays!

It is 34 deg Celsius today (94 deg Fahrenheit). I'm about to have a swim - my first swim since last Friday! I have been too busy, but Kasey recommends resting for a week after each exercise anyhow, so I'll see if it is any easier after the longer break!

 

[Jennifer]

Hi @Richiebogie,

My mum and dad don't mind the heat, but my dad likes a change of seasons so Savannah is a better choice in that regard. Housing in Hawaii is also higher than in Savannah, but there's more opportunity to live self-sustainably in Hawaii.

I already gave away a lot of my belongings so I don't have much that would need to be shipped and my parents said they would sell the furniture, and they've also scaled down on their belongings so they wouldn't have too much to ship either.

But yeah, the cost of flying back to the mainland to visit family was something my dad brought up as a concern. At least with Savannah we'd still be on the east coast. Still, my heart is saying Hawaii.

I was born and raised in New Hampshire, but family originates from Québec, Canada. I've only moved once in my life and that was 13 years ago to the next town over. I think the farthest I ever travelled was to three States over from me for a cheerleading competition.

Yeah, I was thinking that fruits and veggies are very alkalizing so they combat the heat from the sun, but I can see the carotenoids acting as a natural sunscreen as being a possibility, also.

That's interesting (and good) that your eyelid twitching went away when you stopped eating chocolate. It sounds like your adrenals/nervous system are happy with the change. If you do try tea, let me know what happens?

Yes, coconut causes the poor circulation, but also avocado and these raw olives I have. I was definitely eating above 10% of calories from fat – I was consuming up to 5 of those huge avocados or a pound of coconut and lots of coconut cream daily.

No matter how little avo and coconut I eat, I still get the sleeping limbs, but I'm finding that low-fat fruit and veggie soups aren't cutting it right now – it's currently -24°C and I've been so ravenous and cold. I'll put up with tingly limbs so I can stay warm and satisfied.

Your potato salad sounds really yummy and healthy! Thanks for sharing the recipe! I'm going to try it out on my mum and dad. I may also try roasting the potatoes in the dressing. My mum loves roasted veggies so I'm always looking for new dressings to try.

The meal was nice! The restaurant makes most of the dishes veggie upon request so we ordered the usual dishes like fried rice, lo mein and spring rolls, and I had steamed veggies and topped them with coconut aminos – I finally had some salt. lol How was your Christmas?

Oh, nice! My parents gave me a test kit from AncestryDNA for Christmas. It will be interesting to see what ethnicities make up my body. I know there's French and supposedly Amerindian – my brother and I were born with Mongolian spots near our tailbones. This test also allows me to fill in more of my family tree.

34°C temps sound amazing right about now! How was your swim? Was it any easier?

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @Jennifer,

Happy New Year from Australia. We have already ticked over to 2018!

Has your dad been to Savannah or Hawaii? It would be great though expensive if the 3 of you could visit both places! Maybe you could visit the vegan fruit farm!

That's funny! It's $190 cheaper to fly return from Montreal to Kailua-Kona via JFK and LAX than to start from JFK!

That could make it worthwhile getting a passport if you don't have one! They normally last 9.5 years.

Poor you living in blizzard conditions as a raw vegan! Winter was difficult for me too, though it never got below zero outside! I was using a lot of pre-frozen fruit and occasionally I did not defrost it fully in the fridge - it takes about 24 hours or more! Then you need it to reach room temperature before you consume it!

I had to drink some hot water to recover from one episode of drinking an icy smoothie in winter!

I find a little salt is warming. Maybe it is stressing the adrenals but it may also help blood flow and metabolism!

Maybe limit fat to 10% of calories but increase fruit calories majorly! Blending your melons with bananas could give you a heartier meal! Perhaps pig out on dates, raisins and other dried fruit.

I wonder if eating animal foods keeps people warm from the wasteful processing and elimination of protein...?

Maybe a little light exercise / dance routine every hour or so could provide similar heat for low protein vegans?

Now that Christmas is over I will aim to limit myself to fruit, root veggies and a little greens, herbs and spices.

I will try avoiding seeds including nuts, grains, peas and mustard, even though I just bought 2 jars of it! Maybe just a few seeds in trace amounts as found in some herbs and spices!

An interesting development - recently I have eaten a handful of raisins each day for a few days! No ulcers! This might suggest that total protein is more of an issue than high arginine to lysine ratio! (Chickpeas and sesame seeds are high in protein relative to fruit. They also may contain problematic seed proteins...) I will keep investigating!

Your DNA test sounds fun! I wonder how many genes they identify in sample DNA and how many are specific to various races!

Thanks for your support and advice in 2017! It is great that you are a fellow fan of Dr Morse... I find him compelling though at times I worry that I could be doing something dangerous!

I might have to try an egg a day or 50g anchovies a day if my weight gets any lower!

Though first I will try eating more fruit and potatoes each day!

All the best!

 

[Xisca]

Breakfast was 3 eggs in tomato sauce... And drink is warm bone broth... Still have one meal that is as much oranges as I can have! + papaya and salad and beet juice etc...

And I have become found of dry figs! With fresh macadamia, they are in season now.

 

[Jennifer]

Happy New Year, @Richiebogie!

My dad has driven through Georgia on his way to Florida, but has never been to Hawaii. He's also been to Texas and California (LA) and though he liked California's weather, he didn't like the traffic. We planned on staying at least a week in Savannah and Hawaii to get a feel for them. And yes, it would be nice to visit the fruit farm!

Huh, that is funny! Looks like it's wise for me to get a passport then! I was just looking at train routes – I've wanted to see the country by train since I was little and thought it might be fun to travel by one all the way to the west coast and then fly the rest of the way.

Thank you for all the suggestions! I've lowered my fat intake greatly, upped my fruit calories with dried fruit and have been warming up my soups in the Vitamix, and this has helped. When I have frozen fruit, I make sure to defrost it completely in a bowl of hot water before eating it.

I've also made it a point to up my sodium intake to help calm my adrenals. I've been having random bouts of anxiety since the cold and darkness set in and having some warm celery juice/broth with herbs leaves me feeling very relaxed. I was thinking of trying some dulce flakes, too.

I do think the fact that animal protein requires more energy to metabolize likely creates heat in the body, and acids are also warming. That and maybe because it's a more concentrated source of calories? I find food with a lower water content tend to be warming.

Movement is a great idea for keeping warm! Dancing has helped and if I still had the gym membership, I'd do laps in the heated pool and use the sauna afterwards. They also have indoor rock climbing! Rebounding to music would probably be fun and get lymph moving.

Woo-hoo! That's awesome that you didn't get the lip ulcers after having the raisins. Too bad about the mustard seeds, though if they're raw you could always try sprouting them and see how they treat you?

I think you have an excellent plan! Fruit, root veggies, greens, herbs and spices make up the majority of my mum's diet, and add in sprouted beans and grains and you have my dad's diet. I believe even a basic whole foods diet is extremely healthy!

Oh, my pleasure! Thank you so much for your support, also. Yes, Dr. Morse is compelling, but I think it's wise to play around with your diet until you feel secure with it. And even if you still believe what Dr. Morse teaches and want to follow his advice, it's okay to take a step back.

Like I mentioned to Lisa, even Dr. Morse has recommended eggs in depleted cases so if you find you need to have eggs, there's no shame in that. I've had to take steps back over the past two years I've been following his advice and I've still continued to improve.

If I felt good eating things like root veggies, you can bet I'd be eating them and feeling no fear or shame in doing so. So many people heal or maintain excellent health on all kinds of diets/healing modalities so there are certainly more ways than one to live a healthy life.

The main thing I take from Dr. Morse's work is the power of simplicity and an understanding of how the body works, in simple terms. I spent so many years reading highly complicated theories that led me so far down the rabbit hole I was having tea with the Hatter – being healthy doesn't require solving riddles!

Take care!

 

[Jennifer]

And I have become found of dry figs! With fresh macadamia, they are in season now.

I've been eating a lot of dried figs lately. Love them! And macadamia nuts – yummy on their own but insanely delicious covered in white chocolate!

 

[Travis]

I've been eating a lot of dried figs lately. Love them! And macadamia nuts – yummy on their own but insanely delicious covered in white chocolate!

These are good, but I've been eating dates.

Figs are higher in minerals, but also higher in mycotoxins.

 

[Wagner83]

These are good, but I've been eating dates.

Figs are higher in minerals, but also higher in mycotoxins.

You told me about those asian dates before, good to know they are lower in mycotoxins.

 

[Jennifer]

These are good, but I've been eating dates.

Figs are higher in minerals, but also higher in mycotoxins.

Do you think how the figs are dried and preserved makes a difference? I've been eating frozen, semi-dried figs from Trader Joe's and haven't had a problem with them – no headaches, intestinal pain/digestive disturbances, congested sinuses, eye weeping etc. I seem to have more problems with the dates. I usually find black mold in at least one while I'm stuffing them with some coconut butter, but I've never seen obvious signs of mold in these particular figs.

 

[Travis]

Do you think how the figs are dried and preserved makes a difference? I've been eating frozen, semi-dried figs from Trader Joe's and haven't had a problem with them – no headaches, intestinal pain/digestive disturbances, congested sinuses, eye weeping etc. I seem to have more problems with the dates. I usually find black mold in at least one while I'm stuffing them with some coconut butter, but I've never seen obvious signs of mold in these particular figs.

I looked into potassium sorbate (preservative), and I had looked into mycotoxins. I came to the conclusion that potassium sorbate, the common fig preservative, is quite safe. Although preservatives in general don't seem particularly healthy, I think that potassium sorbate is better than mycotoxins—certainly less toxic gram‐for‐gram, anyhow.

Mycotoxins are extremely variable and depend greatly on the environmental humidity in which the figs are dried. In Africa, they sun‐dry the coffee cherries and this produces far more mycotoxins than South American coffee. Grains can be and issue, but of course you don't eat those. However, some of the best evidence for mycotoxins and health came from studying grain‐induced kidney cancer in The Balkans (ochratoxin).

Since Trader Joe's is a Californian company, let's see what the mycotoxin level is in figs dried under those average conditions:

Doster, M. A. "Aspergillus species and mycotoxins in figs from California orchards." Plant Disease (1996)​

...and compare them with other fruit, of course.

This is not a copy–paste‐friendly .pdf file—so I can't pull quotes without transcribing—but I will let you know that mycotoxins on figs 'differed little for different harvests.'

They always focus on Aspergillus species since they synthesize the most powerful mycotoxin (ochratoxin is generally considered #2 behind aflatoxin—both Aspergillus toxins.) This genus of mold was only detected on between 3.46% (1993) and 6.71% (1992) of figs, but exactly what species Aspergillus does make a difference; only some appear to produce significant amounts of the dangerous mycotoxins. Exactly what spores are floating in Fresno right now represents another degree of randomness besides the drying conditions.

But of course, mycotoxins can be found on pitted dates as well, but the ones I have right now do still have their seeds and had come straight from California (via private supersonic jet a UPS truck).

 

[Travis]

You told me about those asian dates before, good to know they are lower in mycotoxins.

Some of them, from most countries. I did hear a terrible rumor about the ones from Bangkok.

 

[raypeatclips]

@Travis

I once asked Peat about potassium sorbate, and he said something negative about it, but I can't recall what now. I'll try find the email if you're interested. It didn't have any studies or references though.

 

[Travis]

@Travis

I once asked Peat about potassium sorbate, and he said something negative about it, but I can't recall what now. I'll try find the email if you're interested. It didn't have any studies or references though.

It appears to be an odd‐numbered fatty acid, ionically bound to an insignificant K⁺ ion. Perhaps it's the odd number which makes it toxic? since even‐numbered fatty acids are far more common in nature. I do know that β-oxidation plucks fatty acids down two carbons at a time, forming acetate then acetyl-CoA. What happens when it gets down to the remainder, the one carbon unit? Could we eventually have methanol? or formaldehyde?

Perhaps. It must be toxic somehow, or it wouldn't be a preservative. It certainly would be interesting to hear what Ray Peat had to say about it.

 

[raypeatclips]

It appears to be an odd‐numbered fatty acid, ionically bound to an insignificant K⁺ ion. Perhaps it's the odd number which makes it toxic? since even‐numbered fatty acids are far more common in nature. I do know that β-oxidation plucks fatty acids down two carbons at a time, forming acetate then acetyl-CoA. What happens when it gets down to the remainder, the one carbon unit? Could we eventually have methanol? or formaldehyde?

Perhaps. It must be toxic somehow, or it wouldn't be a preservative. It certainly would be interesting to hear what Ray Peat had to say about it.

I am struggling to find the exact email but i believe he told me it was mutagenic.

 

[Jennifer]

@Travis – Thank you for the detailed reply. Very interesting! I should of been clear when I said preserved. I was referring to the figs being frozen as a preservation method, not actual preservatives. The dried fruit I eat is just fruit with nothing else added. The dates I get are from California and still contain the seed. I go for the wet-packs so maybe that's why I tend to get a lot of moldy ones?

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @Jennifer, that is exciting if you can take the train across America! I wonder if it is cheaper to go to Los Angeles or Vancouver! (It is probably cheaper to go by bus than train, but maybe not as pleasant! Maybe you can mix it up!)

That is good you are keeping warm calorie-wise. We have had a relatively cool summer so far. Apparently we are at solar minimum for the next 3 years, and the last few solar cycles have been getting weaker also! We all might need to eat some more dried figs in the coming years!

Talking of mold, I have been coughing and wheezing a bit lately and wonder if it is related to all of the balsamic vinegar I have been using in my dressings!

Certainly drinking a little vinegar neat can cause me to gasp! Only a few sites say vinegar is toxic!

This man with the evocative name reckons that it contains chemicals that dissolve DNA! He reckons vinegar kills bacteria and lets yeast take over...!

(Is there a Mrs Semon?)



I sometimes wonder if there is something fungal in my head causing my various head issues!

I might go back to lemon juice in salad dressings and avoid my favourite tomato sauce, Worcestershire sauce and bottled olives for a while!

One issue is that restaurants often have dressings and dips with unknown ingredients in them. I have recently found a Korean cafe which allows me to order their Tofu salad without the tofu! It is quite tasty with sesame seeds and olive oil. However it is likely the cabbage has been fermented and has acetic acid in it!

Oh well, they do a tasty vegetable juice with ginger, beetroot, celery, oranges etc so I might just stick with that!

My ulcers did come back, so there could be a delay in getting them after eating arginine-rich foods! ...There is definitely a delay in getting rid of them once I start avoiding arginine-rich foods! I will avoid wine and other alcohol, raisins, grapes, balsamic and other vinegars for a while and see how that goes!

So many experiments! Lucky we have a fresh new year ahead of us to test them all out in!

I bought White Christmas on Bluray! It is quite a happy and colourful film and the extras are interesting! Thanks for that suggestion!

I once had a white Christmas in Prague in 1992! Gosh was that 25 years ago already?!

 

[Richiebogie]

This seems to be Dr Bruce's theory in a nutshell. Avoid foods made with yeast (alcohol, bread, cheese and other yeast-fermented foods), avoid things that kill bacteria (vinegar and antibiotics), avoid foods that feed yeast (malt), and avoid anything else you are allergic to (may be eggs). Kill the yeast if you are still having issues (nystatin).

Candida Diet and Anti-Yeast Treatment

It is similar to Dr Morse's diet but allows meat and vegetables.

Dr Bruce claims he has healed autism, arthritis and a broad range of illnesses.

I will see if I can find the book in the library or at a bookshop!

 

[Travis]

This seems to be Dr Bruce's theory in a nutshell. Avoid foods made with yeast (alcohol, bread, cheese and other fermented foods), avoid things that kill bacteria (vinegar and antibiotics), avoid foods that feed yeast (malt), and avoid anything else you are allergic to (may be eggs). Kill the yeast if you are still having issues (nystatin).

Candida Diet and Anti-Yeast Treatment

It is similar to Dr Morse's diet but allows meat and vegetables.

Dr Bruce claims he has healed autism, arthritis and a broad range of illnesses.

I will see if I can find the book in the library or at a bookshop!

I remember watching a few Dr. Norse videos a few years ago, and I thought he amusing—in a good way. I liked his general understanding of the lymphatic system, and he seems to be on board with my general principles.

I think you've probably seen the Dr. Tel‐Oren videos, which I think are probably even better (though far fewer in number.)

On a Dr. Morse topic, I must say that candida transforms into its hyphal form upon contact with prostaglandin E₂.

Kalo-Klein, A.. "Prostaglandin E2 enhances and gamma interferon inhibits germ tube formation in Candida albicans." Infection and immunity (1990)
Noverr, Mairi C. "Pathogenic yeasts Cryptococcus neoformans and Candida albicans produce immunomodulatory prostaglandins." Infection and immunity (2001)
​

Now is this a missing link? an explanation as to why candida is seen only in some people some of the time? There could perhaps be some truth to this, and if prostaglandins were responsible than immunogenic foods and linoleic acid would be a prime cause. While eating fruit, leaves, and coconuts, my skin is in good working order; all changes that I'd noticed in the past I had just ascribed to 'cooked food'—a very primitive thought really. Now I know much more: androgens cause acne, zinc deficiency allows sun damage by depleting the UV‐blocking urocanic acid on the skin, and now that prostaglandin E₂ likely transforms candida.. .

But I haven't read those prostaglandin E₂ articles yet, but I will.. .