How To Increase Androgen Receptors In My Cheek ?

[haidut]

Are you implying that Minoxidil has a hormonal activity at the receptor level?

It works exclusively through non-hormonal pathways

I don't think so. It has well-known anti-adrogenic effects at the receptor level.
Minoxidil may suppress androgen receptor-related functions

 

[Cameron]

I don't think so. It has well-known anti-adrogenic effects at the receptor level.
Minoxidil may suppress androgen receptor-related functions

Just posted a vitro study on it too. Clearly some see insane results do to increased blood flow of hormones to the follicle in skin. If minox is such an anti androgen why do you think "some" men go from zero to hero beards? Is there a androgenic compound that could upregulate androgens in skin and safely increase blood flow to the follicle? It may seem like a silly topic but it is fascinating at the least and beard density can really add to a man's confidence. My dht is 412 test around 700 is a dht dominate blood level likely to have more beard growth less muscle? Someone like me I have large amount of muscle but light vellus hair growth on face dhea levels are high for me aswell @haidut

 

[Cameron]

It also seems most actually see more results with beard growth then scalp hair regrowth wich seems ironic. Mechanism is not understood fully eithercway. a topical dht and dhea in castor oil with ethanol without additives would be exciting to try on the whisker area

 

[baccheion]

Just posted a vitro study on it too. Clearly some see insane results do to increased blood flow of hormones to the follicle in skin. If minox is such an anti androgen why do you think "some" men go from zero to hero beards? Is there a androgenic compound that could upregulate androgens in skin and safely increase blood flow to the follicle? It may seem like a silly topic but it is fascinating at the least and beard density can really add to a man's confidence. My dht is 412 test around 700 is a dht dominate blood level likely to have more beard growth less muscle? Someone like me I have large amount of muscle but light vellus hair growth on face dhea levels are high for me aswell @haidut

Have you ever checked histamine? Lower levels are associated with hairiness.

 

[Cameron]

Have you ever checked histamine? Lower levels are associated with hairiness.

I have not I will try to look into that

 

[haidut]

Just posted a vitro study on it too. Clearly some see insane results do to increased blood flow of hormones to the follicle in skin. If minox is such an anti androgen why do you think "some" men go from zero to hero beards? Is there a androgenic compound that could upregulate androgens in skin and safely increase blood flow to the follicle? It may seem like a silly topic but it is fascinating at the least and beard density can really add to a man's confidence. My dht is 412 test around 700 is a dht dominate blood level likely to have more beard growth less muscle? Someone like me I have large amount of muscle but light vellus hair growth on face dhea levels are high for me aswell @haidut

The mechanism of action of minoxidil is not known but the vasodilation and improved blood flow may be part of the answer. However, since other vasodilation drugs like Viagra do not cause hair growth there is more to the story than just blood flow.

 

[Cameron]

The mechanism of action of minoxidil is not known but the vasodilation and improved blood flow may be part of the answer. However, since other vasodilation drugs like Viagra do not cause hair growth there is more to the story than just blood flow.

Are you familiar with butea superba sorghum and forskolin? i was curious what your favorite androgenic herbs were. I like tribulus but was curious what you thought of things like sorghum and butea superba forskolin for ar and dht and which likely work and are metabolically safe. I stopped carnitine as it is anti thyroid

 

[haidut]

Are you familiar with butea superba sorghum and forskolin? i was curious what your favorite androgenic herbs were. I like tribulus but was curious what you thought of things like sorghum and butea superba forskolin for ar and dht and which likely work and are metabolically safe. I stopped carnitine as it is anti thyroid

I have not tried those herbs. They may work but since they are not studies nearly as well as TT has been it is hard to know what other effects they may have. Many herbs are estrogenic even if they increase AR density. Also, why use those when something like androsterone or lower dose DHEA also upregulates AR and is likely safer?

 

[Cameron]

I have not tried those herbs. They may work but since they are not studies nearly as well as TT has been it is hard to know what other effects they may have. Many herbs are estrogenic even if they increase AR density. Also, why use those when something like androsterone or lower dose DHEA also upregulates AR and is likely safer?

I just was curious you opinion I personally really do like sorghum bread and with promising herbs I like to get other view points in case I've missed a study or theory. Androsterone has been hit or miss with me and not always sure if what it's doing with other hormones like estrogen is always positive. I agree they are safe in low dose I do think they should be studied more in low dose androsterone is a cool metabolite for sure my dhea is already very high above 200

 

[Cameron]

You do enjoy tribulus effects on mood and strength? Forskolin does look safe asanother herb to increase camp in lydeic cells and androgen receptors I haven't seen any downsides in mechanism of action even with human studies I think i may try forskolin and trib together in next expirement Oral ingestion of forskolin (250 mg of 10% forskolin extract twice a day) for a 12-week period was shown to favorably alter body composition while concurrently increasing bone mass and serum free testosterone levels in overweight and obese men. The results indicate that forskolin is a possible therapeutic agent for the management and treatment of obesity.

 

[RisingSun]

Minoxidil Acts as an Antiandrogen: A Study of 5α-reductase Type 2 Gene Expression in a Human Keratinocyte Cell Line.
Pekmezci E, et al. Acta Dermatovenerol Croat. 2017.
Show full citation
Abstract
Although more than three decades have passed since the first use of minoxidil in androgenetic alopecia (AGA), its mechanisms of action have still not been comprehensively understood. 5α-reductase (5α-R) has an active role as the predominant enzyme in both AGA and female pattern hair loss (FPHL), which are also the main therapeutic indications of topical minoxidil. But there is insufficient literature data regarding the interaction of minoxidil and the enzyme 5α-R. Herein, we studied the in vitro expression levels of 5α-R type 2 (5α-R2) in a minoxidil-treated human keratinocyte cell line (HaCaT) in order to elucidate the relation of these two parameters. Cell proliferation assay was performed by a XTT reagent (a yellow tetrazolium salt). After determination of non-cytotoxic concentration, HaCaT cells were treated with minoxidil. Ribonucleic acid (RNA) isolations were carried out from both non-treated and treated cell groups using a TRI reagent (an RNA, DNA, and protein isolation reagent). Gene expressions of 5α-R2 as study material and glyceraldehyde-3-phosphate dehydrogenase (GAPDH) as the control were determined by real time-quantitative polymerase chain reaction (RT-qPCR) analysis. Results were represented as 5α-R2 / GAPDH fold change. Minoxidil treatment resulted in a 0.22 fold change for 5α-R2 (p < 0.0001). This antiandrogenic effect of minoxidil, shown by significant downregulation of 5α-R2 gene expression in HaCaT cells, may be one of its mechanisms of action in alopecia.

The 0.22 fold decrease in 5ar2 activity is anecdotal at best, and reflects in no way the pathways through which Minoxidil works.

There is literally hundreds of boys on the internet reporting being able to grow a full beard after a year applying Minoxidil on the face.
Increased blood flow seems to be the reason why.

If there is a 5ar2 downregulation, it is most likely a side effect and not the main effect

 

[Douglas Ek]

Minoxidil Acts as an Antiandrogen: A Study of 5α-reductase Type 2 Gene Expression in a Human Keratinocyte Cell Line.
Pekmezci E, et al. Acta Dermatovenerol Croat. 2017.
Show full citation
Abstract
Although more than three decades have passed since the first use of minoxidil in androgenetic alopecia (AGA), its mechanisms of action have still not been comprehensively understood. 5α-reductase (5α-R) has an active role as the predominant enzyme in both AGA and female pattern hair loss (FPHL), which are also the main therapeutic indications of topical minoxidil. But there is insufficient literature data regarding the interaction of minoxidil and the enzyme 5α-R. Herein, we studied the in vitro expression levels of 5α-R type 2 (5α-R2) in a minoxidil-treated human keratinocyte cell line (HaCaT) in order to elucidate the relation of these two parameters. Cell proliferation assay was performed by a XTT reagent (a yellow tetrazolium salt). After determination of non-cytotoxic concentration, HaCaT cells were treated with minoxidil. Ribonucleic acid (RNA) isolations were carried out from both non-treated and treated cell groups using a TRI reagent (an RNA, DNA, and protein isolation reagent). Gene expressions of 5α-R2 as study material and glyceraldehyde-3-phosphate dehydrogenase (GAPDH) as the control were determined by real time-quantitative polymerase chain reaction (RT-qPCR) analysis. Results were represented as 5α-R2 / GAPDH fold change. Minoxidil treatment resulted in a 0.22 fold change for 5α-R2 (p < 0.0001). This antiandrogenic effect of minoxidil, shown by significant downregulation of 5α-R2 gene expression in HaCaT cells, may be one of its mechanisms of action in alopecia.

Very interesting since DHT is the purpotraited viliain in baldness. But also DHT increases beard growth? From the results ive seen minoxidil works better for increasing beard growth than hair growth?

 

[Lucas]

Just posted a vitro study on it too. Clearly some see insane results do to increased blood flow of hormones to the follicle in skin. If minox is such an anti androgen why do you think "some" men go from zero to hero beards? Is there a androgenic compound that could upregulate androgens in skin and safely increase blood flow to the follicle? It may seem like a silly topic but it is fascinating at the least and beard density can really add to a man's confidence. My dht is 412 test around 700 is a dht dominate blood level likely to have more beard growth less muscle? Someone like me I have large amount of muscle but light vellus hair growth on face dhea levels are high for me aswell @haidut

My DHT are 1200 and test 740 and I only need to shave one time a week to be clean shaven all week!!

 

[Cameron]

My DHT are 1200 and test 740 and I only need to shave one time a week to be clean shaven all week!!

That is very high! Wow how is your libido strength mood has it always been that elavated?

 

[Lucas]

That is very high! Wow how is your libido strength mood has it always been that elavated?

Was around 600 before I started taking cabergoline for my high prolactin. Interesting is that I don’t feel improvements.

Cabergoline treatment rapidly improves gonadal function in hyperprolactinemic males: a comparison with bromocriptine.
De Rosa M, Colao A, Di Sarno A, Ferone D, Landi ML, Zarrilli S, Paesano L, Merola B, Lombardi G.
Department of Endocrinology and Molecular and Clinical Oncology, Federico II University, Naples, Italy.

This study evaluated the effects of chronic treatment with cabergoline (CAB), a new, potent and long-lasting ergoline-derived dopamine agonist, on seminal fluid parameters and sexual and gonadal function in hyperprolactinemic males in comparison with the effect of bromocriptine (BRC) treatment. Seventeen males with macroprolactinoma were treated with CAB at a dose of 0.5-1.5 mg/week (n = 7), or BRC at a dose of 5-15 mg/day (n = 10) for 6 months. Baseline prolactin (PRL) was 925.7 +/- 522.6 microg/l in the CAB-treated group and 1059.4 +/- 297.6 microg/l in the BRC-treated group. All the patients suffered from libido impairment, ten from reduced sexual potency, and six had infertility. In five patients provocative bilateral galactorrhea was found. Seminal fluid analysis, functional seminal tests and penis rigidity and tumescence, measured by nocturnal penile tumescence (NPT) using Rigiscan equipment, were assessed before and after 1, 3 and 6 months of CAB or BRC treatment. Hormone profiles were assessed before and after 15, 30, 60, 90 and 180 days of both treatments. Before treatment, all patients had a low sperm count with oligoasthenospermia, reduced motility and rapid progression with an abnormal morphology and decreased viability, and a low number of erections. After 1 month, serum PRL levels were significantly reduced in both groups of patients (20.6 +/- 6.6 microg/l during CAB and 256.3 +/- 115.1 microg/l during BRC treatment) and were normalized after 6 months in all patients (CAB: 7.9 +/- 2.2 microg/l; BRC: 16.7 +/- 1.8 microg/l). After 6 months, a significant increase of number, total motility, rapid progression and normal morphology was recorded in patients treated with both CAB and BRC. An increase in the number of erections during the first 3 months of both treatments was noted by NPT. However, the improvements in seminal fluid parameters and sexual function were more evident and rapid in patients treated with CAB. The number of erections was normalized after 6 months of treatment in all patients submitted to CAB treatment, and in all patients but one treated by BRC. In addition, a significant increase of serum testosterone (from 3.7 +/- 0.3 to 5.3 +/- 0.2 microg/l) and dihydrotestosterone (from 0.4 +/- 0.1 to 1.1 +/- 0.1 nmol/l) was recorded. At the beginning of treatment, mild side-effects were recorded in two patients after CAB and mild-to-moderate side-effects in five patients after BRC administration. The treatment with CAB normalized PRL levels, improving gonadal and sexual function and fertility in males with prolactinoma, earlier than did BRC treatment, providing good tolerability and excellent patient compliance to medical treatment.

 

[Andman]

@Lucas you dont feel any positive effects at all? libido, mood, body composition etc?

 

[Lucas]

Sad but no effects and my prolactin reduced from 17 to 1,7 using 0.25 mg per week.

 

[SuperHeavy]

DHT isn't so efficient for beard. It just increases sebum, causing beard hairs to seem thicker and darker. It is the free T that makes the beard develop. And high DHT equals to low free T, and low beard. It also increases risks of malassezia and excess sebum will cause inflammation and inability for the follicules to mature. It's why nizoral helped me growing facial hair.

 

[jase_11six]

Out of town until Sunday, so will do the blood test when I come back. It definitely changed hormonal profile, so should be interesting to see how.

Hi Haidut, would taking Tribulus be the best option to grow beard compared to applying topical DHEA and Androsterone ?

 

[jase_11six]

Hi Haidut, would taking Tribulus be the best option to grow beard compared to applying topical DHEA and Androsterone ?

And red light on cheek area? curious to know your thoughts