Fructose Malabsorption

[jet9]

My issue is different from yours as I have an aldolase b deficiency, but I have found milk that hasn't been ultra pasteurized digests really well and doesn't result in the symptoms I get from fructose ( I think high heat can turn lactose into a fructose like substance ).

I dont eat any plants at all actually and get all my carbohydrates from milk. With the absorption issue you will want to watch out for fructan like substances as well, wheat is an example of a food that might be low in fructose, but has fructans that might cause symptoms.

I dont really have any advice other than eliminating foods that cause issues, and then avoiding them, which is rather straight forward and obvious. Wish I could offer a solution, sorry.

Best of luck!

Interesting, for some reason i always assumed you are eating lots of fruits :)
Your posts inspired me to go starch free (i am for 5 months), but i am dairy free and getting carbs from fruits and honey (no white sugar)

 

[jet9]

Bump

On reddit Xylose Isomerase was recommended

 

[somuch4food]

what do you eat for starch? also does any sugar makes you depressed including fruits?

I eat just about any starches: pasta, bread, potatoes, rice... I have my doubts on gluten, but haven't moved on this front yet.

Higher fructose fruits like watermelon, apples and pears can be troublesome gut wise. Too much plain sugar robs me of my motivation while starches do not, so I'm thinking it's the fructose.

 

[Tbone107]

On reddit Xylose Isomerase was recommended

I’ve tried it and didn’t see much of an improvement unfortunately

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Although the bloating and stomach pain has gone away, I am still dealing with pretty constant stomach gurgling and loose stools 2-3x a day. They’ve gotten better but I feel like it’s kind of plateaued.

Would replacing some of the sucrose with dextrose be a bad idea from a peat perspective? Any other thoughts on how I can clear this last hurdle?

If the dextrose is pure, then I think it's okay,. Ray is against the consumption of starch because it increases endotoxin production and because it can persorb into the blood and get stuck into small blood vessels. Dextrose wouldn't cause any of these things, since it doesn't need to be broken down to be absorbed like starch needs. Also, as long as you are ingesting some fructose with dextrose, the hyperglycemia should be much reduced, meaning it will be metabolized more easily.

 

[Tbone107]

If the dextrose is pure, then I think it's okay,. Ray is against the consumption of starch because it increases endotoxin production and because it can persorb into the blood and get stuck into small blood vessels. Dextrose wouldn't cause any of these things, since it doesn't need to be broken down to be absorbed like starch needs. Also, as long as you are ingesting some fructose with dextrose, the hyperglycemia should be much reduced, meaning it will be metabolized more easily.

Thanks Rafael, you’ve been a big help. The dextrose would be pure. So mixing it with fructose each time would help lessen the insulin reaction? I don’t want it to lead to fat gain but my libido/ general well being is much better since adding all the sugar. Wish my body could tolerate it better

Also is the stomach gurgling a sign of allergic reaction? I’ve never had it before.

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Thanks Rafael, you’ve been a big help. The dextrose would be pure. So mixing it with fructose each time would help lessen the insulin reaction? I don’t want it to lead to fat gain but my libido/ general well being is much better since adding all the sugar. Wish my body could tolerate it better

Also is the stomach gurgling a sign of allergic reaction? I’ve never had it before.

No problem!

Yes, Ray has said that even a small amount of fructose can stimulate the metabolism of a big amount of glucose. I don't think it will cause fat gain, since even people who eat mostly starch as a carb source don't get fat. The only thing I would be concerned about is that I have a suspicion that glucose needs more minerals to be metabolized, especially potassium, but this shouldn't be a concern, unless a bigger share of your carbs are coming from dextrose. If that was the case, a potassium supplement may be warranted. The fructose from sucrose will be enough, so it isn't neccessary to add pure fructose when using dextrose. Regarding the ratio of sucrose to dextrose, you can start with lower dosages of dextrose and increase it until you don't have loose stools or gurgling in the gut anymore.

Regarding the stomach gurgling, it may be because something is drawing water into the gut. It happens when I ingest magnesium, for example. Some people report that when ingesting fructose powder. Both of these susbtances tend to attract water. It may resolve itself by using a higher ratio of glucose to fructose.

 

[Tbone107]

Gotcha I have been using a magnesium supplement in my preworkout, and before I go to sleep at night. The gurgling and loose stools usually occur during the morning through lunch and then stop.

What would the extra potassium supplementation help with if you don’t mind sharing? I workout a fair amount and eat white rice/ white potatoes/ real sourdough daily so I probably do have on the high side of glucose intake to begin with.

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Gotcha I have been using a magnesium supplement in my preworkout, and before I go to sleep at night. The gurgling and loose stools usually occur during the morning through lunch and then stop.

What would the extra potassium supplementation help with if you don’t mind sharing? I workout a fair amount and eat white rice/ white potatoes/ real sourdough daily so I probably do have on the high side of glucose intake to begin with.

I think it would help with correct glucose metabolism, including glycogen formation. According to Ray, insulin is actually just a small part of all the insulin-like componentes of the blood, that is, other things in the blood make glucose enter the cells. Potassium has a more pronounced influence than insulin when it comes to this effect. Potatoes are a great source of glucose, because it already comes with a big amount of potassium. That would take a strain off of the body, since it won't need to produce much insulin to direct the carbs into cells. So as I see it, it has mostly to do with making it easier for glucose to enter cells and avoiding insulin excess. White rice, for example, has very little potassium, and if that is a big source of carbs for you, then using some potassium, maybe imitating the ratio of tubers( potatoes, sweet potatoes, yams etc.) is a good plan of action. For example, potatoes have 2 grams of potassium for each 100 grams of starch, approximately.

People who eat more salt lose more sodium and chloride in their sweat than somebody who eats less salt, so if you salt your food to taste, then you shoudn't lose much potassium at all in your sweat. The same happens with regards to urine.

 

[Tbone107]

Do you have a potassium source/supplement that you would reccomend? I probably eat potatoes half the time and white rice the other half. And I definitely try to make sure I get enough salt a day. I salt all of my food to taste and then take An extra tsp in my preworkout.

 

[Tbone107]

I think it would help with correct glucose metabolism, including glycogen formation. According to Ray, insulin is actually just a small part of all the insulin-like componentes of the blood, that is, other things in the blood make glucose enter the cells. Potassium has a more pronounced influence than insulin when it comes to this effect. Potatoes are a great source of glucose, because it already comes with a big amount of potassium. That would take a strain off of the body, since it won't need to produce much insulin to direct the carbs into cells. So as I see it, it has mostly to do with making it easier for glucose to enter cells and avoiding insulin excess. White rice, for example, has very little potassium, and if that is a big source of carbs for you, then using some potassium, maybe imitating the ratio of tubers( potatoes, sweet potatoes, yams etc.) is a good plan of action. For example, potatoes have 2 grams of potassium for each 100 grams of starch, approximately.

People who eat more salt lose more sodium and chloride in their sweat than somebody who eats less salt, so if you salt your food to taste, then you shoudn't lose much potassium at all in your sweat. The same happens with regards to urine.

And would I need to ingest it right at the time of the meal to take effect?

Would you take a small dose with the dextrose or only when I have bigger white rice meals?

Would you think it would be more beneficial to replace the cane sugar, maple syrup or both with the dextrose?

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Do you have a potassium source/supplement that you would reccomend? I probably eat potatoes half the time and white rice the other half. And I definitely try to make sure I get enough salt a day. I salt all of my food to taste and then take An extra tsp in my preworkout.

I think potassium bicarbonate and potassium malate are the safest ones. Potassium citrate also has been shown be beneficial, as long as not much is used due to the citric acid in it. The first one and the last one can be found on PureBulk. I never found potassium malate for sale. You could buy pure malic acid and mix it with potassium bicarbonate. That will give you potassium malate. It's important to not use much bicarbonate near protein-rich meals, since it will slow down digestion. Waiting 2 or 3 hours after such a meal before taking it will be helpful. With potassium malate and citrate, there is not need to worry about taking it away from meals, since it isn't going to neutralize the stomach acid.

And would I need to ingest it right at the time of the meal to take effect?

Would you take a small dose with the dextrose or only when I have bigger white rice meals?

Would you think it would be more beneficial to replace the cane sugar, maple syrup or both with the dextrose?

Ingesting it right after a meal would be better, since the carbs from the food and the minerals are going to enter the bloodstream in a more combined manner. That way both hypoglycemia and hyperglycemia will be avoided.

If it's not inconvenient, then small doses of potassium with each carb that hasn't minerals( white sugar, white rice, dextrose) would be the better choice, in my opinion.

Maple syrup is a great source of some minerals( zinc and manganese),therefore it is more valuable than cane sugar in this regard. So to lower the fructose amount of diet, replacing cane sugar with dextrose and seeing the results seems like a good idea. You mentioned you experience better libido and well-being from sugar, so you could lower fructose to the point where it doesn't cause problems but at the same time, still has those benefits.

 

[Tbone107]

Really appreciate it Rafael... so you don’t think there should be any concern or differentiation between dextrose and sucrose as long as I add a little potassium?

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

You're welcome!

I think there will be a difference in the sense that sucrose stimulates metabolism more than glucose, so with sucrose, you probably are going to eat more and burn more calories. With glucose, you may get less hungry and burn less calories. Fructose's main benefit is its effect of raising liver glycogen dramatically. If I recall correctly, you are drinking fair amounts of milk, which fills liver glycogen very well, so on that note, you're good. Fructose also accelerates metabolism, by activating the pyruvate dehydrogenase enzyme, so going too low on it could lower your metabolism. As long as you're ingesting some fructose, it should be okay with regards to this issue. For example, member @tyw used to eat just around 75 of fructose per day and he was very lean, while eating a ton of glucose from starch. Regarding the glycemic index, sucrose is lower than glucose, so that's why using glucose in conjunction with potassium would solve this.

Fructose raises metabolism more, but if it's causing problems, replacing some of the sucrose with dextrose is the next best thing, since it's still going to be a high carb diet, which lowers stress hormones and preserves muscle mass, so for now I think that would be the better choice. Over time, you can try increasing sucrose slowly to see if your tolerance improved. In the mean time, having a diet plan that you can fall back on will help, both physiologically and also when it comes to the stress of diet changes.

 

[Tbone107]

You're welcome!

I think there will be a difference in the sense that sucrose stimulates metabolism more than glucose, so with sucrose, you probably are going to eat more and burn more calories. With glucose, you may get less hungry and burn less calories. Fructose's main benefit is its effect of raising liver glycogen dramatically. If I recall correctly, you are drinking fair amounts of milk, which fills liver glycogen very well, so on that note, you're good. Fructose also accelerates metabolism, by activating the pyruvate dehydrogenase enzyme, so going too low on it could lower your metabolism. As long as you're ingesting some fructose, it should be okay with regards to this issue. For example, member @tyw used to eat just around 75 of fructose per day and he was very lean, while eating a ton of glucose from starch. Regarding the glycemic index, sucrose is lower than glucose, so that's why using glucose in conjunction with potassium would solve this.

Fructose raises metabolism more, but if it's causing problems, replacing some of the sucrose with dextrose is the next best thing, since it's still going to be a high carb diet, which lowers stress hormones and preserves muscle mass, so for now I think that would be the better choice. Over time, you can try increasing sucrose slowly to see if your tolerance improved. In the mean time, having a diet plan that you can fall back on will help, both physiologically and also when it comes to the stress of diet changes.

Awesome.. thanks that was one of my biggest problems deciding this digestion problem was tied to a diet change or stemming from my fructose problem. I think I put off the inevitable trying to get it to work but I’m hoping I can still manage with some sucrose and work myself up over time.

 

[managing]

Do you get it in supplement form? Or is it foods like butter, beef, etc?

mainly supplement. Ray says he approves, with the caveat of "as long as it is pure and not containing hidden PUFA". I've attemped to fractionate and haven't been successful. So I think its pure.

 

[Tbone107]

You're welcome!

I think there will be a difference in the sense that sucrose stimulates metabolism more than glucose, so with sucrose, you probably are going to eat more and burn more calories. With glucose, you may get less hungry and burn less calories. Fructose's main benefit is its effect of raising liver glycogen dramatically. If I recall correctly, you are drinking fair amounts of milk, which fills liver glycogen very well, so on that note, you're good. Fructose also accelerates metabolism, by activating the pyruvate dehydrogenase enzyme, so going too low on it could lower your metabolism. As long as you're ingesting some fructose, it should be okay with regards to this issue. For example, member @tyw used to eat just around 75 of fructose per day and he was very lean, while eating a ton of glucose from starch. Regarding the glycemic index, sucrose is lower than glucose, so that's why using glucose in conjunction with potassium would solve this.

Fructose raises metabolism more, but if it's causing problems, replacing some of the sucrose with dextrose is the next best thing, since it's still going to be a high carb diet, which lowers stress hormones and preserves muscle mass, so for now I think that would be the better choice. Over time, you can try increasing sucrose slowly to see if your tolerance improved. In the mean time, having a diet plan that you can fall back on will help, both physiologically and also when it comes to the stress of diet changes.

Hey Rafael, my stomach/digestion is feeling incredible amounts better since adding the dextrose in replacement for where I was using cane sugar. I am still using maple syrup in about a 40/60 ration in favor of the dextrose.

My one problem is that I have been feeling hypoglycemic. Any idea why that is happening and how to remedy it?

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Hey Rafael, my stomach/digestion is feeling incredible amounts better since adding the dextrose in replacement for where I was using cane sugar. I am still using maple syrup in about a 40/60 ration in favor of the dextrose.

My one problem is that I have been feeling hypoglycemic. Any idea why that is happening and how to remedy it?

Awesome, glad you're feeling better!

How many meals are you having per day? With glucose, small meals more frequently may be better. Other than that, maybe ingesting some safe fibers, such as mushrooms and cooked bamboo shoots or even vegetables( if they don't irritate your gut) with your biggest carb meals can help slow down the absorption of glucose and that will keep the blood sugar more stable. If anything else comes to mind, I'll let you know.

 

[yerrag]

@Tbone107 Since I've found out that taking plenty of fruit juice has been increasing my blood pressure (I suspect it feeds gut bacteria and increases inflammation, or that it increases my uric acid production), I've started to stay away from fruits as well as foods with high fructose content. The downside of that is that I lose the benefit of potassium intake that comes with fruit juices. Instead of potassium supplementation, I'm taking vegetable juice instead. The problem with vegetable juices is that it tends to low on sugar, and this could make me hypoglycemic, being that there's a lot of potassium in it, which facilitates glucose uptake by cells, and this could easily lower my blood sugar. So, I have to add carrots, which provide a good source of sugar with more glucose than fructose. My vegetable juice consists of celery, green bell pepper, and cucumber. Sometimes I have bitter gourd as well, but I found it too rich in potassium that leaving it out keeps me from the hypoglycemic feeling.

I also make my own potassium bicarbonate, and that helps out when I don't have the veggie juice, but I prefer less supplementation if I can get my minerals from whole foods as @Amazoniac has convinced me of it.

 

[jet9]

Hey Rafael, my stomach/digestion is feeling incredible amounts better since adding the dextrose in replacement for where I was using cane sugar. I am still using maple syrup in about a 40/60 ration in favor of the dextrose.

My one problem is that I have been feeling hypoglycemic. Any idea why that is happening and how to remedy it?

How did your experiment with dextrose go ?
Seems I also have problems with fructose so looking for ways to get glucose without fructose. (I am also starch sensitive)