Does LESS Weight Loss/Fat Loss Occur If Inhibiting Lipolysis?

SOMO

Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2018
Messages
1,094
If you're already at your ideal weight, inhibiting lipolysis might be only beneficial, let's say you actually need to lose a bit of weight (and don't want it to take 2 years.)

76196-425x281-Tummy.jpg


In other words, does inhibiting lipolysis negatively impact fat loss/weight loss?
 

shepherdgirl

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
707
I am wondering the same thing. How can you burn any fat if you are getting enough sugar - doesn't the Randle cycle prevent fat burning?
 
D

Deleted member 5487

Guest
If you're already at your ideal weight, inhibiting lipolysis might be only beneficial, let's say you actually need to lose a bit of weight (and don't want it to take 2 years.)

76196-425x281-Tummy.jpg


In other words, does inhibiting lipolysis negatively impact fat loss/weight loss?

There are plenty of people who have experience naicinamide/aspirin increasing weight especially around the stomach.

Usually people say its "lowering cortisol and you have a weak metabolism" which may or may not be true.

But yes. Generally aspirin/niacinamide are healing supplements, not weight loss supplements.

Aspirin will make my face lean and aesthetic due to lower estrogen cortisol/edema but over time my hips and stomach gain fat.
 
OP
SOMO

SOMO

Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2018
Messages
1,094
@shepherdgirl
@Amarsh213

I am wondering the same thing. How can you burn any fat if you are getting enough sugar - doesn't the Randle cycle prevent fat burning?

I no longer really have this question or rather it was answered through personal experience.
I lost 12 pounds since posting this topic (am not overweight to begin with, down from 125 lbs) while eating a very high-carb diet with loads of fruit and honey. I also consume some starch daily (potatoes, rice or nixtamalized corn.)

So whatever the mechanism involved in losing fat mass is, eating a lot of carbohydrate DOES NOT AFFECT IT enough to completely stop weight loss.

The best thing about low-carb/ketogenic weight loss is the WATER weight (which even Keto people admit). When you're eating high carb, even if you lose weight, you will retain a bit more water in your muscle naturally (this isn't even a bad thing.)
There are plenty of people who have experience naicinamide/aspirin increasing weight especially around the stomach.

Usually people say its "lowering cortisol and you have a weak metabolism" which may or may not be true.

But yes. Generally aspirin/niacinamide are healing supplements, not weight loss supplements.

Aspirin will make my face lean and aesthetic due to lower estrogen cortisol/edema but over time my hips and stomach gain fat.

During the time of my weight loss, I was taking aspirin every few days and B3 (500 - 1000 mg) daily. I've never heard of aspirin or b3 stalling weight loss, but weight loss is still possible even if someone is supplementing with those 2 things.

I think Peatarians sometimes don't count calories or they underestimate the importance of calories when it comes to weight gain/weight loss.

Biggest Factor in weight loss: Calories
2nd biggest factor: Inflammation
3rd: Metabolism/hormones/etc.


I don't neglect the traditional CICO (Calories In, Calories Out) model of metabolism, because calorie restriction has been proven to induce weight loss, while calorie excess has been proven to maintain or cause weight gain.


If someone is reducing calories, exercising more and taking aspirin/b3, they will not gain weight. But I see many people posting here about how they consume 3000-4000 calories daily and realistically, almost everyone will gain weight on 3k-4k calories unless they are also exercising regularly and have inflammation under control.

Inflammation's role in Weight Gain can't be understated
. When people lose weight, it's been postulated that the adipose tissue's hormonal profile improves. In essence, the fat cells are less inflammatory when weight loss happens or if the person is already lean. The fat cells are more inflammatory when weight gain happens or if the person is already obese.


For me personally, wheat induces "weight gain" (visible added fat mass) on an otherwise isocaloric diet. It also causes acne for me, indicating that this food causes inflammation.

Skin issues and weight gain (or water-gain called "edema") go hand in hand when inflammation has taken place, likely due to poor diet.
 
Last edited:

sladerunner69

Member
Joined
May 24, 2013
Messages
3,307
Age
31
Location
Los Angeles
I no longer really have this question or rather it was answered through personal experience.
I lost 12 pounds since posting this topic (am not overweight to begin with, down from 125 lbs) while eating a very high-carb diet with loads of fruit and honey. I also consume some starch daily (potatoes, rice or nixtamalized corn.)

So whatever the mechanism involved in losing fat mass is, eating a lot of carbohydrate DOES NOT AFFECT IT enough to completely stop weight loss.

The best thing about low-carb/ketogenic weight loss is the WATER weight (which even Keto people admit). When you're eating high carb, even if you lose weight, you will retain a bit more water in your muscle naturally (this isn't even a bad thing.)


During the time of my weight loss, I was taking aspirin every few days and B3 (500 - 1000 mg) daily. I've never heard of aspirin or b3 stalling weight loss, but weight loss is still possible even if someone is supplementing with those 2 things.

I think Peatarians don't count calories or underestimate the importance of calories when it cehTomes to weight gain/weight loss.

Biggest Factor in weight loss: Calories
2nd biggest factor: inflammation

I don't neglect the traditional CICO (Calories In, Calories Out) model of metabolism, because calorie restriction has been proven to induce weight loss, while calorie excess has been proven to maintain or cause weight gain.


If someone is reducing calories, exercising more and taking aspirin/b3, they will not gain weight. But I see many people posting here about how they consume 3000-4000 calories daily and realistically, almost everyone will gain weight on 3k-4k calories unless they are also exercising regularly and have inflammation under control.

Inflammation

But it... But it... But it what?!?!
 

Jpkoepse

Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2018
Messages
66
Location
NC
I can attest to the fact that Niacinamide and Asprin will not stop fat loss completely. My last bodybuilding show, I dieted down from 13% to sub 5% bodyfat levels taking in both twice a day... Granted I was using many other "supps" as well. Just thought I'd throw that out there.
 

shepherdgirl

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
707
Thanks for your informative response @SOMO - very helpful! I appreciate hearing that you lost weight despite your high carb diet.
I eat a lot of sugar, fructose and fruit. I've been on a lowish fat, low pufa, Peat-style diet for like 2 1/2 years, and I am tired of having a belly. I just thought that after a long time of pufa restriction my metabolism would bounce back.
I think I will try adding more anti-inflammatory supps and counting calories. Plus I am exercising and lifting weights.
@Jpkoepse - sounds like the aspirin and niacinamide didn't stand in your way at all. 5% body fat, whoa! If you don't mind my asking, what were you eating?
 

shepherdgirl

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
707
Actually I never used to have a problem with weight, ate anything I wanted and was skinny. But I think I was running on adrenaline. I wonder if I can have the same physique without stress hormones...
 

Jpkoepse

Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2018
Messages
66
Location
NC
Thanks for your informative response @SOMO - very helpful! I appreciate hearing that you lost weight despite your high carb diet.
I eat a lot of sugar, fructose and fruit. I've been on a lowish fat, low pufa, Peat-style diet for like 2 1/2 years, and I am tired of having a belly. I just thought that after a long time of pufa restriction my metabolism would bounce back.
I think I will try adding more anti-inflammatory supps and counting calories. Plus I am exercising and lifting weights.
@Jpkoepse - sounds like the aspirin and niacinamide didn't stand in your way at all. 5% body fat, whoa! If you don't mind my asking, what were you eating?
Yea it didn't seem like it had an effect but I don't want to make a blanket statement and say it won't effect anyone. Ahh at the end it was very "non-peaty" (at this time I hadn't discovered much about Ray Peat). I will say though, I don't think "bodybuilding show condition" can truly be achieved without neglecting some of the core Ray Peat principles for most.

I don't remember every part of it.. but a lot of egg/egg whites, chicken, a little beef, a little cheese, a little rice and veggies/fruit.
At the time of show I was weighing 192 lbs and my macros were roughly (270 P, 40 C, 30 F)

I was also having an intense gym session every day with another 1.5 hours of cardio at the very end. Having said that, I would not recommended that, nor do I think that is necessary for someone to get into "good shape".
 
OP
SOMO

SOMO

Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2018
Messages
1,094
Thanks for your informative response @SOMO - very helpful! I appreciate hearing that you lost weight despite your high carb diet.
I eat a lot of sugar, fructose and fruit. I've been on a lowish fat, low pufa, Peat-style diet for like 2 1/2 years, and I am tired of having a belly. I just thought that after a long time of pufa restriction my metabolism would bounce back.
I think I will try adding more anti-inflammatory supps and counting calories. Plus I am exercising and lifting weights.

I think Thyroid and Progesterone are both supplements you should try when restoring metabolism, both orally and topically. Progesterone gave me a very noticeable mental boost and positive emotions, but unfortunately it caused ED, so I no longer take progesterone. Topical thyroid can possible reduce inflammation, including inflammation of adipose tissue. I had severe pain in my gums/jaw because a wisdom tooth was piercing through and I crushed up some thyroid tablets, applied it to that area of my gums and on my jawline and within minutes that area stopped throbbing.

I'm pretty sure topical thyroid or topical progesterone could also normalize the cell wherever applied and lead to localized weight loss (or less fat inflammation/less edema). Skin absorption is not very effective though.

By the way, Thyroid actually increases Fatty Acid Oxidation (Fatty acid metabolism and thyroid hormones) So even if Fatty Acid Oxidation is slightly reduced because of glucose/sucrose/fructose in the diet, the pro-thyroid effects of those carbohydrates evens things out.

Another alternative if your goals are strictly fat loss/body modification, Ketogenic diet does work for a lot of people who do it short-term. I myself was only able to do it for a few weeks, before a noticeable shutting down of metabolism, but I did get that shredded, tight look. I knew Ketosis was slowing my metabolism because I would be unbearably cold, especially in the mornings. I was actually diagnosed with Raynaud's and Hypothyroid at the time I was doing a ketogenic diet...but I was extremely lean and had a visible six-pack.

Basically, after trying both this Peat approach and Ketosis, I realize that there is more than one diet that works and more than one approach to health and body fitness goals. I had to experiment a lot basically, and I suspect it will be the same with your health goals.
 

shepherdgirl

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
707
Yea it didn't seem like it had an effect but I don't want to make a blanket statement and say it won't effect anyone. Ahh at the end it was very "non-peaty" (at this time I hadn't discovered much about Ray Peat). I will say though, I don't think "bodybuilding show condition" can truly be achieved without neglecting some of the core Ray Peat principles for most.

I don't remember every part of it.. but a lot of egg/egg whites, chicken, a little beef, a little cheese, a little rice and veggies/fruit.
At the time of show I was weighing 192 lbs and my macros were roughly (270 P, 40 C, 30 F)

I was also having an intense gym session every day with another 1.5 hours of cardio at the very end. Having said that, I would not recommended that, nor do I think that is necessary for someone to get into "good shape".
Thanks for this info! Sounds like you were eating lot of quality lean protein to preserve muscle. Haha, yeah I see you did not mention sugar, soda, etc. - just a little fruit.
I'm not a body builder but I would love to get back my wiry athletic look. My impression is that this is a lot harder to do (but possible) with Peat's diet. And as you say maybe one could not get totally ripped while Peating.
@SOMO those are great suggestions. Maybe I will try rubbing progesterone on my belly. I think I need to keep better track of temps too and pay attention to what raises temps, then optimize my metabolism by having more of these temperature raising foods and supps.
I tried a Paleo style low carb diet, not to get shredded but because I thought it was a healthy diet. Then i kind of crashed on it. Some people seem to do very well on it, though.
Maybe low carb is ok in the short run to lose some fat, but i think that at least for me it promoted aging and poor health, so I still plan to experiment with losing weight while Peating.
 

Jpkoepse

Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2018
Messages
66
Location
NC
Thanks for this info! Sounds like you were eating lot of quality lean protein to preserve muscle. Haha, yeah I see you did not mention sugar, soda, etc. - just a little fruit.
I'm not a body builder but I would love to get back my wiry athletic look. My impression is that this is a lot harder to do (but possible) with Peat's diet. And as you say maybe one could not get totally ripped while Peating.
@SOMO those are great suggestions. Maybe I will try rubbing progesterone on my belly. I think I need to keep better track of temps too and pay attention to what raises temps, then optimize my metabolism by having more of these temperature raising foods and supps.
I tried a Paleo style low carb diet, not to get shredded but because I thought it was a healthy diet. Then i kind of crashed on it. Some people seem to do very well on it, though.
Maybe low carb is ok in the short run to lose some fat, but i think that at least for me it promoted aging and poor health, so I still plan to experiment with losing weight while Peating.
I will say my girlfriend is "dieting" right now and using a "Peat" approach that seems to be working well. It's relatively high carb (for her around 150 g), very low fat mostly from beef or coconut oil (25 -30 g), and high protein (beef, chicken, greek yogurt) (155 g). The carbs sources are mostly sweet potato, fruit and rice cakes. Mind you she's also training once a day and having a separate cardio session (20 mins).

I just think once a person reaches a certain point, the carbs/calories will have to drop. And for a female, they usually drop much lower than men. The idea in the bodybuilding world is to diet down to an extremely lean state (show prep) and then slowly reverse diet by adding in calories and backing off cardio. I'd think if one were very disciplined, using peats ideas for this "rebound" would be great here. By this I mean adding in the carbs/sugars slowly to boost your crushed metabolism, etc. This seems like a good way to attain and then maintain a good physique. But now I'm just rambling.. Just my experience, not my recommendation tho! The best thing you can do is stay disciplined and see how you respond to a certain protocol. Then adjust :)
 

shepherdgirl

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
707
@Jpkoepse
To me it looks like she has a very good diet. Quality protein, enough carbs, and low fat.
I just think once a person reaches a certain point, the carbs/calories will have to drop.
Yeah, you are probably right. I have been lazy about monitoring my calories. No doubt I could cut back slowly and see if it helps. I guess it makes the most sense to cut back on fat temporarily (*sigh*).
That's a great idea to slowly increase metabolism after losing the weight. Returning to a more normal diet with a low metabolism could be dangerous!!
 

Lowdose69

Member
Joined
May 25, 2018
Messages
24
I can attest to the fact that Niacinamide and Asprin will not stop fat loss completely. My last bodybuilding show, I dieted down from 13% to sub 5% bodyfat levels taking in both twice a day... Granted I was using many other "supps" as well. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

What doses were you taking twice a day? I'm a weightlifter and have lost body fat on aspirin but I'm taking 4 to 6 grams a day. My body weight increased but my fat calipers show a decrease.
 

aquila2009

Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2021
Messages
76
What doses were you taking twice a day? I'm a weightlifter and have lost body fat on aspirin but I'm taking 4 to 6 grams a day. My body weight increased but my fat calipers show a decrease.
This is awesome. I powerlift and have see huge improvements in muscle and fat loss with 2-3 grams. What made you go up to 4-6?
 

Marquis777

Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2021
Messages
195
I really don't think it does. It's increasing my fat loss so far. Inhibiting lipolysis makes me feel great.
 

frannybananny

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Messages
703
I really don't think it does. It's increasing my fat loss so far. Inhibiting lipolysis makes me feel great.

This is confusing since most of the info that I could find states.... >>

Does lipolysis cause weight loss?
Yes! “Fat burning” is called lipolysis in medical terms and it's the mechanism where the body breaks down dietary fat or stored fat into absorbable form to be used as energy by the cells. Since our aim is to lose weight, we would be looking at how to boost lipolysis to burn stored fat rather than dietary fat.<<
 

Herbie

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
2,192
This is confusing since most of the info that I could find states.... >>

Does lipolysis cause weight loss?
Yes! “Fat burning” is called lipolysis in medical terms and it's the mechanism where the body breaks down dietary fat or stored fat into absorbable form to be used as energy by the cells. Since our aim is to lose weight, we would be looking at how to boost lipolysis to burn stored fat rather than dietary fat.<<
Lipolysis is not healthy, Haidut explains in this video about it how and the safer way to lose it


View: https://youtu.be/3OhCZ5YEou8
 

frannybananny

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Messages
703
Lipolysis is not healthy, Haidut explains in this video about it how and the safer way to lose it


View: https://youtu.be/3OhCZ5YEou8


Wow! So much information that went by so fast! Haidut talks extremely fast....no time to make notes and I hardly had a chance to read the closed Captions.... so what would you say the gist of this presentation was? To eat more sugar and fructose in order to not burn fat? I am now more confused than ever and want to lose weight but don't feel like I am under any stress to produce too much cortisol, etc.
 

Herbie

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2016
Messages
2,192
Wow! So much information that went by so fast! Haidut talks extremely fast....no time to make notes and I hardly had a chance to read the closed Captions.... so what would you say the gist of this presentation was? To eat more sugar and fructose in order to not burn fat? I am now more confused than ever and want to lose weight but don't feel like I am under any stress to produce too much cortisol, etc.

Eating low fat high carb prevents high insulin and elevated free fatty acids and lowers cortisol.

Sugar including from fruit lower cortisol.

Eating low fat allows the sugar to be used to create energy explained by the randle cycle.

When cortisol is low, the stored fat is removed by the liver and used by the resting muscles.
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom