Basal Temperature. Why?

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When we awaken, obviously our temperature will be influenced by the high level of the stress hormones of that moment; why to measure the basal temperture write here, if it will not be my actual temperature but rather a temperature compromised by the very high level of the stress hormones [upon awakening after a long night]?
 

somuch4food

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That's because the temperature isn't influenced by your activities.

It's also often recommended on the forum to take your temperature at other moments like after breakfast to be sure the temperature is not driven by stress hormomes.
 
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Hello, this is my first post. Not sure if this is where I should post this but here goes. I emailed a nice gentleman on this form about some issues, and he was very kind and give me some info to start with. I have also been reading this form for about a month. The information here is awesome, I am fairly new to Peteing (about 3 months) . I came from many years of low carbing prety close to almost 0 carbs, and never losing weight and hardly eating it all. I have high cortisol. and aTHS of 6…. And I am lucky if I get my basal temp to 97.0 :balloon:I actually celebrate when it gets there, yet my heart rate runs between 78 and 104. Experimenting with tyro, energin, 5a dhp, and cypro. The kind of gentleman mentioned cypro so I started with this but experimenting with it seemed that the issue with swelling is the pits. But sleep was amazing. I am pretty sure immune needs to be the focus but not positive I'm here to learn. And I'm very frustrated with not being able to get Basal temp up, avg. 95.7… Thank you :)
If posting here is not the correct place please let me know :)
 

Cirion

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Morning is indeed usually point of highest stress. However, I don't think it's at all possible to consistently have a 98.6F temperature upon waking if you are under metabolic distress since stress ultimately drops your metabolic rate. This has proven true for me.

@Debb'slearning that's rough... I'm guessing you also come from a history of severe caloric restriction? Calories and carbohydrates (salt too) are both the number one priority to increase to bring temperatures up. Dietary fat can have its place too, saturated fats specifically, but I'd personally focus heavily on carbohydrates and also make sure to eat some quality protein, that is, low tryptophan proteins like beef and gelatin.

Metabolism / waking body temperature / weight loss or gain is heavily correlated. Heavy caloric restriction can actually work against you with weight loss, and also make you feel horrible. It sounds counter-intuitive, but ultimately increasing calories can not only restore metabolism and make you feel better, but lose weight (Though you will likely gain some at first).

I am currently in the process of lots of data gathering to start to attempt to estabalish a concrete strategy to restore metabolism, and I am hoping to eventually write a book too, with what I've learned. But it's still in work, so for now like I say, keep it simple and just eat carbs freely (primary emphasis here), ample sugars, maybe some starches, eat some fats (saturated) but not too much (these can be over-done, but don't worry about over-doing carbs, watch out for PUFA), and eat some protein (taking care to eat low-tryptophan proteins). My experience has shown me it is difficult to over-do carbs as long as you mind the fats and proteins, so don't feel guilty with the carbs (as long as they aren't super fatty carbs like cakes, donuts, excessive ice cream etc). Carbs get a bad rap in fitness circles because of mixing carbs and fats (randle cycle).
 
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gilson d dantas
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So, why to watch the morning awakening temperature if it is the point of highest stress? I´d better in another time of the day, or not?
 

Cirion

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So, why to watch the morning awakening temperature if it is the point of highest stress? I´d better in another time of the day, or not?

In my experience it's still by far the best gauge of your metabolic health for the most part. But yes, if you are worried about it, take temps at other points like right after breakfast. If your temp goes down after breakfast, then it was indeed fueled by stress.

I would also suggest frequent testing during the day, when starting off and temps are very low, so you can get an idea of what foods warm you up. When I was first starting off I'd check my temps up to a dozen times a day (It was tough to maintain 98.6F for the first few months). Now I usually only check once or twice a day (always morning, sometimes afternoon)
 

mrchibbs

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It comes from Broda Barnes' research. See his book on hypothyroidism.
Based on empirical experience, he identifies a morning in-bed temperature of 97.8-98.2F as being indicative of healthy thyroid function. It should rise to a peak of 98.6-99 towards midday, and stay at above 98 until bedtime.

The value in taking it first thing is that it isn't influenced by activity or eating, and in a sense reveals more about the health of your metabolism as your liver has been ''fasting'' for 8 hours or more, and being able to keep a healthy temperature throughout the night is a tell-tale sign about your liver's ability to store glycogen and create t3.

The other aspect is taking temperature at different times of the day to identify patterns. If your cortisol is very high throughout the night, you might wake up with 98+ only to fall down to 96 or 97 after eating breakfast, from the general anti-stress effect of eating and that would thus indicate that cortisol is aritifically keeping your blood sugar high. Good nutrition, fructose, aspirin, and stress-reducing lifestyle should improve the health of the liver over several months.

Personally, I've improved my morning temps to around 97.3.-97.5 from lows of 96 or less. I still can't seem to get 98s unless it's summer and I'm very low stress. But I tend to hit 98.6 most days. It's a work in progress and I started while I was quite sick so there you go.
 
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gilson d dantas
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The value in taking it first thing is that it isn't influenced by activity or eating, and in a sense reveals more about the health of your metabolism as your liver has been ''fasting'' for 8 hours or more, and being able to keep a healthy temperature throughout the night is a tell-tale sign about your liver's ability to store glycogen and create t3.
The best explanation I ever heard. Yes, the temperature firs thing in the morning talks about my liver´s health. And allows me follow up if my nutrition etc is working or i it is not. I will have patterns to follow my stress-reducing food and lifestyle. Thank you!
 

Cirion

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I have also found that morning temperature is also a good gauge of endotoxin levels. If I ate too many bad foods (high pufa, too much starch, too much tryptophan, or otherwise things that cause increased inflammation, it always drives my morning temperatures down). High endotoxin/ammonia etc also reliable increases water weight (Another metric I now keep track of for this reason).
 

mrchibbs

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The best explanation I ever heard. Yes, the temperature firs thing in the morning talks about my liver´s health. And allows me follow up if my nutrition etc is working or i it is not. I will have patterns to follow my stress-reducing food and lifestyle. Thank you!

Glad it was helpful. The more you think in ''Peat'' terms the most the ideas make sense. Cronometer is a good way to track your Basal temperature, and you can export the data in .csv and track the trends of your temperature.
 
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Morning is indeed usually point of highest stress. However, I don't think it's at all possible to consistently have a 98.6F temperature upon waking if you are under metabolic distress since stress ultimately drops your metabolic rate. This has proven true for me.

@Debb'slearning that's rough... I'm guessing you also come from a history of severe caloric restriction? Calories and carbohydrates (salt too) are both the number one priority to increase to bring temperatures up. Dietary fat can have its place too, saturated fats specifically, but I'd personally focus heavily on carbohydrates and also make sure to eat some quality protein, that is, low tryptophan proteins like beef and gelatin.

Metabolism / waking body temperature / weight loss or gain is heavily correlated. Heavy caloric restriction can actually work against you with weight loss, and also make you feel horrible. It sounds counter-intuitive, but ultimately increasing calories can not only restore metabolism and make you feel better, but lose weight (Though you will likely gain some at first).

I am currently in the process of lots of data gathering to start to attempt to estabalish a concrete strategy to restore metabolism, and I am hoping to eventually write a book too, with what I've learned. But it's still in work, so for now like I say, keep it simple and just eat carbs freely (primary emphasis here), ample sugars, maybe some starches, eat some fats (saturated) but not too much (these can be over-done, but don't worry about over-doing carbs, watch out for PUFA), and eat some protein (taking care to eat low-tryptophan proteins). My experience has shown me it is difficult to over-do carbs as long as you mind the fats and proteins, so don't feel guilty with the carbs (as long as they aren't super fatty carbs like cakes, donuts, excessive ice cream etc). Carbs get a bad rap in fitness circles because of mixing carbs and fats (randle cycle).


Thank you for the info. I have been eating as many fruit carb as I can, it's the learning to remember to eat that is difficult. I have always avoided liquid oil as much as possible, but didn't put fish and fish oils in that category. Also tried to fill some food needs with nuts ( I react to almonds and fish oils badly) , no nuts, seeds, and fish oil for me anymore :). I have so much to learn, I am a certified personal trainer, CNHP and a clinical master herbalist and worked for a Naturopathic Dr for years...... and I feel like I know nothing, but I am so appreciative of all the info here and Ray Peat's articles. I have been using the gelatin but it causes issues for me and lowers my temps, not sure what's up with this? Thank you, Debb
 

Cirion

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Thank you for the info. I have been eating as many fruit carb as I can, it's the learning to remember to eat that is difficult. I have always avoided liquid oil as much as possible, but didn't put fish and fish oils in that category. Also tried to fill some food needs with nuts ( I react to almonds and fish oils badly) , no nuts, seeds, and fish oil for me anymore :). I have so much to learn, I am a certified personal trainer, CNHP and a clinical master herbalist and worked for a Naturopathic Dr for years...... and I feel like I know nothing, but I am so appreciative of all the info here and Ray Peat's articles. I have been using the gelatin but it causes issues for me and lowers my temps, not sure what's up with this? Thank you, Debb

Almonds and fish oils are both rich in PUFA, so I'm not surprised! I was not a personal trainer myself, but I was a huge gym junkie before, and you have no idea how much it has sucked to quit the gym (temporarily) until I get fully well haha! I also was stuck on a lot of the popular fitness fads like fish oil, probiotics, carbohydrate restriction (having to "earn" your carbs via activity), excessive proteins (especially bad ones like chicken), excess vegetables, and constant caloric restriction, etc so I know the feeling. You really do have to re-train what you thought is truth... I find it is best to keep an open mind and be willing to re-consider old beliefs.

For gelatin what brand do you take and how do you take your gelatin? I like to take my gelatin in the form of home made jello and this seems to do me the most good. Honey, OJ, and gelatin are the three ingredients I use. I didn't like gelatin at all myself until I started taking it in this form. Also, you might do better on it if you intake it with another protein source (since gelatin does not contain all the amino acids).
 
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Almonds and fish oils are both rich in PUFA, so I'm not surprised! I was not a personal trainer myself, but I was a huge gym junkie before, and you have no idea how much it has sucked to quit the gym (temporarily) until I get fully well haha! I also was stuck on a lot of the popular fitness fads like fish oil, probiotics, carbohydrate restriction (having to "earn" your carbs via activity), excessive proteins (especially bad ones like chicken), excess vegetables, and constant caloric restriction, etc so I know the feeling. You really do have to re-train what you thought is truth... I find it is best to keep an open mind and be willing to re-consider old beliefs.

For gelatin what brand do you take and how do you take your gelatin? I like to take my gelatin in the form of home made jello and this seems to do me the most good. Honey, OJ, and gelatin are the three ingredients I use. I didn't like gelatin at all myself until I started taking it in this form. Also, you might do better on it if you intake it with another protein source (since gelatin does not contain all the amino acids).

I have been using great lakes dissolved in water heated and then put in my morning OJ but it made me crash soon after consumed, I have tried others gelatins throughout the years even bone broth I have to keep at a minimum. I have been able to use glycine so far. I have never really been big on veggies nor fruit, but I am enjoying the fruit now :) I guess I need to seriously focus on my liver to get the temps up and then maybe my body will except the gelatin. Thank you again for the input :) this form is awesomeness .....need input
 

mrchibbs

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I have also found that morning temperature is also a good gauge of endotoxin levels. If I ate too many bad foods (high pufa, too much starch, too much tryptophan, or otherwise things that cause increased inflammation, it always drives my morning temperatures down). High endotoxin/ammonia etc also reliable increases water weight (Another metric I now keep track of for this reason).

I found the same things. Even some bread acts an irritant for me. I do better if I eat easy to digest sugars and dairy towards the day. I have bruxism and I tend to grind my teeth more severely if I eat difficult foods later in the day. Of course it makes sense because endotoxin => serotonin and the liver also has to deal with the endotoxin in the blood so it makes sense that allowing for the best digestion allows the liver to focus on maintaining blood sugar instead of other stuff.
 

livesimply

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Most things being equal (bedtime, wake time, ambient room temperature, etc.) would it be food towards night time that could influence my basal temperature so much, from 97.6º to 98.2º? I'm on thyroid meds. Thanks for any replies.
 

livesimply

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I asked the above of Ray Peat and he replied:
"Carbohydrates that are quickly assimilated late in the day help to restore glycogen, to lower nighttime stress. Things that irritate the intestine increase the stress hormones, which can increase the waking temperature."
 

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